If Christ was not born until the late 20th Century, what would be the outcome ?

The Quadratic Equation

Here's an interesting hypothetical scenario to help explore our Christian faith :

If Christ was not born on earth until the latter half of the 20th Century instead of the 1st, how different would things be ?

1. How different would the world today be ?

2. How different would world history be ?

3. What religion, if any, would most people in Ireland and Europe be today ?

4. Where would Christ be born, who would be his apostles and first disciples ?

5. What authorities would he challenge ?

6. How would he be treated ?

7. What effect would the mass media have ?

8. Honestly, would you follow his Christ and his disciples and become a Christian ? Why would you do so, bearing in mind that many of the people of Judaea who witnessed Christ in the flesh did not follow him ?

Onesimus

We'd still crucify him. The human heart never changes.

The Quadratic Equation

Onesimus wrote: »

We'd still crucify him. The human heart never changes.

I agree, but what would be the modern version ?

Onesimus

The Quadratic Equation wrote: »

I agree, but what would be the modern version ?

We would be the modern version Q. Lets not point any fingers . We as a whole would be the modern version. And we as a whole strangely enough still Crucify Christ mystical body with our sins and rejection of his Holy Spirit and Mother Mary to this day. Nothing has changed. Nothing will change.

The Quadratic Equation

Onesimus wrote: »

We would be the modern version Q. Lets not point any fingers . We as a whole would be the modern version. And we as a whole strangely enough still Crucify Christ mystical body with our sins and rejection of his Holy Spirit and Mother Mary to this day. Nothing has changed. Nothing will change.

As I said, I agree, but I mean the modern version of the life of Christ, and how different the last 20 centuries would have looked, as per the OP questions.

tommy2bad

Nice question!
OK the first thing is Christianity would not be the dominant religion, that would be some variation of Roman Pagan cults. Which would have had an inquisition and reformation and all the rest. Jesus would have been born in the middle east or Russia or anywhere since the Jews scattered about the same time as they did anyway.
I don't think facebook would be his thing, more of a one on one man as I see it.
His message would threaten the vested inteistes of the time and be portrayed as political and guess what probably executed for some trumped up charge or other.
Lethal injection or electric chair? Duno but it radically changes the iconography of churches in another 1000 years.

dvae

Jesus would still be crucified. he would have to be, as it was prophesied in psalms.

Doc Farrell

The Quadratic Equation wrote: »

Here's an interesting hypothetical scenario to help explore our Christian faith :

If Christ was not born on earth until the latter half of the 20th Century instead of the 1st, how different would things be ?

1. How different would the world today be ?

2. How different would world history be ?

3. What religion, if any, would most people in Ireland and Europe be today ?

4. Where would Christ be born, who would be his apostles and first disciples ?

5. What authorities would he challenge ?

6. How would he be treated ?

7. What effect would the mass media have ?

8. Honestly, would you follow his Christ and his disciples and become a Christian ? Why would you do so, bearing in mind that many of the people of Judaea who witnessed Christ in the flesh did not follow him ?

Just for fun, some quick thoughts.
1. The roman world would still have fallen to the German and East European tribes. Following massive wars between the desert tribes of North Africa and the Scandanavian and European tribes we would now be speaking a mix of Arabic and Norse.
2. All knowledge of Greek and Roman works would be lost, although perhaps some Hellenic texts might still be stored in Constantinople, now known as little Aqaba. Arab explorers would have located the New World. South america is theirs but Canada and north America, having been located by the Norse through Greenland is disputed territory.
The great Chinese emperors have taken the majority of the Russian lands and a final war with the Arab horsemen empire of Africa is about to be played out over Pakistan.
3. Ireland and Britain no longer exists. It is pure Norse, a shipping point between Norse Canada, Scandanavia and war torn Spain.
Europe is simply a patchwork of warrior tribes rounded up to be slaves of the Norse and Arab empires. Their languages are myriad, they remain illiterate, human sacrificing, horse traders at best or fit for the galleys.
Because of their similar African roots, the Jewish people are allowed to exist as administrative slaves to their North african overlords. Their religion is an underground one. When they are captured by the Norse armies in one of the European wars they are immediately put to death due to their monotheistic views. Because of their literacy and archival skills the Chinese Emperors use them as tutors and translators but any mention of their religion is cause for immediate beheading.
Since St Benedict never existed metallurgy is still undeveloped so technology is 500 years behind, however the use of gunpowder is widespread, although considered unsportsmanlike by all three great Empires.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/woods/woods43.html

4. Christ is born, the child of slaves, his disciples are slaves, his apostles slaves. All are put to death. Glory in battle is all that matters.

5. And yet the physical miracles that he performed give the slaves hope. His sermon on the mount seems to make no sense but is passed around in written form by the educated Jews. It is quickly translated into Arabic and shared in stories of the thousand dialects of middle Europe and the pirate people of the North med coast.
Soon anyone found with christ's words are instantly put to death by all three great Empires. But his message is spread by what remains of the indigenous people's of the Americas, the Africas, the Himalayas who also have a legend of a peaceful man, a religion long banished by their warrior kings.
Soon, within 200 years, all three great empires convene a council to determine how to root out this insidious cancer which insults their Gods, undermines their armies and weakens their tax collectors.
But this new message has passed beyond their tutor slaves. Physical miracles continue in the name of this slave king. Their surgeons and nurses have listened to it, their galley slaves and seamen and now their own blasted priests and priestesses are listening.
8. They decide to kill everyone who mentions this slaves name, to take the land of anyone who harbors a Christian and to skin any man who values peace over the glory of war.
And then the wives and mothers of those slain in battle hear of this slave miracle worker....

8 question. I am an Iberian pirate and slave trader between the Norse and Africans. I do what I'm told and grow rich. My galleys are filled with these peaceful Christians. I sell them and tell them to keep their mouths shut. I have no interest in religion, my gods had families who lived on a mountain at the further edge of the Med, long dead.
My favorite wife, mother to my oldest children has become a slave king follower. If I do not publicly renounce and kill her I lose my estates on both sides of the pillars of Hercules. Chinese traders have offered my safe passage to their territories in the new continent below Africa. But I cannot bring her. Our sons, bar one, tell me to leave her behind. What do I do? I grow old. I will consult with my wisest slave, a follower of Moses.

My apolologies if I offended anyone. Just a little make believe.

Onesimus

Doc Farrell wrote: »

Just for fun, some quick thoughts.
1. The roman world would still have fallen to the German and East European tribes. Following massive wars between the desert tribes of North Africa and the Scandanavian and European tribes we would now be speaking a mix of Arabic and Norse.
2. All knowledge of Greek and Roman works would be lost, although perhaps some Hellenic texts might still be stored in Constantinople, now known as little Aqaba. Arab explorers would have located the New World. South america is theirs but Canada and north America, having been located by the Norse through Greenland is disputed territory.
The great Chinese emperors have taken the majority of the Russian lands and a final war with the Arab horsemen empire of Africa is about to be played out over Pakistan.
3. Ireland and Britain no longer exists. It is pure Norse, a shipping point between Norse Canada, Scandanavia and war torn Spain.
Europe is simply a patchwork of warrior tribes rounded up to be slaves of the Norse and Arab empires. Their languages are myriad, they remain illiterate, human sacrificing, horse traders at best or fit for the galleys.
Because of their similar African roots, the Jewish people are allowed to exist as administrative slaves to their North african overlords. Their religion is an underground one. When they are captured by the Norse armies in one of the European wars they are immediately put to death due to their monotheistic views. Because of their literacy and archival skills the Chinese Emperors use them as tutors and translators but any mention of their religion is cause for immediate beheading.
Since St Benedict never existed metallurgy is still undeveloped so technology is 500 years behind, however the use of gunpowder is widespread, although considered unsportsmanlike by all three great Empires.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/woods/woods43.html

4. Christ is born, the child of slaves, his disciples are slaves, his apostles slaves. All are put to death. Glory in battle is all that matters.

5. And yet the physical miracles that he performed give the slaves hope. His sermon on the mount seems to make no sense but is passed around in written form by the educated Jews. It is quickly translated into Arabic and shared in stories of the thousand dialects of middle Europe and the pirate people of the North med coast.
Soon anyone found with christ's words are instantly put to death by all three great Empires. But his message is spread by what remains of the indigenous people's of the Americas, the Africas, the Himalayas who also have a legend of a peaceful man, a religion long banished by their warrior kings.
Soon, within 200 years, all three great empires convene a council to determine how to root out this insidious cancer which insults their Gods, undermines their armies and weakens their tax collectors.
But this new message has passed beyond their tutor slaves. Physical miracles continue in the name of this slave king. Their surgeons and nurses have listened to it, their galley slaves and seamen and now their own blasted priests and priestesses are listening.
8. They decide to kill everyone who mentions this slaves name, to take the land of anyone who harbors a Christian and to skin any man who values peace over the glory of war.
And then the wives and mothers of those slain in battle hear of this slave miracle worker....

8 question. I am an Iberian pirate and slave trader between the Norse and Africans. I do what I'm told and grow rich. My galleys are filled with these peaceful Christians. I sell them and tell them to keep their mouths shut. I have no interest in religion, my gods had families who lived on a mountain at the further edge of the Med, long dead.
My favorite wife, mother to my oldest children has become a slave king follower. If I do not publicly renounce and kill her I lose my estates on both sides of the pillars of Hercules. Chinese traders have offered my safe passage to their territories in the new continent below Africa. But I cannot bring her. Our sons, bar one, tell me to leave her behind. What do I do? I grow old. I will consult with my wisest slave, a follower of Moses.

My apolologies if I offended anyone. Just a little make believe.

No Need to apologise doc but hey! You must have a LOT of time on your hands lol:D

Doc Farrell

One too many eggnogs I'm afraid. I'm watching Becket and now my sentences sound like they are being spoken by that great Irishman Peter o'toole, or perhaps that equally glorious Celt, sir Richard Burton.

The Quadratic Equation

Thanks Doc excellent bit of hypothesising, rich in detail, your're getting into the spirit of it.

The Quadratic Equation

dvae wrote: »

Jesus would still be crucified. he would have to be, as it was prophesied in psalms.

Of course, but its the modern twist we're interested in, i.e. by whom this time in the late 20th century would be so threatened by him they had to put him to death etc., would CNN and Sky refer to it ? How different would our current history be, would we presently be an islamic country instead, or still pagan ? would we become Christians or would it be our decedents instead, who would be the modern day Sadducees and Pharisees ? Imagine how different world history would be today if Jesus were not born untill the last 30 years, and how he would be recieved and treated today by the media and otherwise ?

I ask this because I believe time is just a circumference on a wheel, Christ is the hub, with each generation being one spoke and equidistant from God, once civilisation was reached, only fashions and technologies change, human politics, life, love, ambition, problems etc. are all the same, time is just a calendar, each generation and spoke on the wheel of life gets its chance and on this earth, and then has to make way for the next, death is followed by examination and graduation for some, we're no further away from Christ in time than the learned Irish monks of the middle ages were on their spoke of the wheel.

Doc Farrell

Very nice second paragraph. Do you speak about natural law?.
I visited skellig Michael recently, as a photo tourist. But there is no running water on the island. I crouched in a cell and asked how could this be? What is it's purpose?
I understand a Cathedral but not a damp cell on a god forsaken rock. I know what I'm supposed to understand but that isn't the same thing as feeling it and living it.
I bring it up because some have argued that waterlogged dreary wooden abbeys in the midlands saved what we call civilization and without skellig Michael , or rather the genius behind the need for such places, there would be no CNN, no universities of classical reasoning.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_the_Irish_Saved_Civilization

The Quadratic Equation

Doc Farrell wrote: »

Very nice second paragraph. Do you speak about natural law?.
I visited skellig Michael recently, as a photo tourist. But there is no running water on the island. I crouched in a cell and asked how could this be? What is it's purpose?
I understand a Cathedral but not a damp cell on a god forsaken rock. I know what I'm supposed to understand but that isn't the same thing as feeling it and living it.
I bring it up because some have argued that waterlogged dreary wooden abbeys in the midlands saved what we call civilization and without skellig Michael , or rather the genius behind the need for such places, there would be no CNN, no universities of classical reasoning.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_the_Irish_Saved_Civilization

Indeed Irish monks salvaged and preserved as much Greek and Latin literature as possible from the fallen Roman empire. They had much to meditate on. Could it be fitted into one lifetime ? I would imagine those isolated cells removed as many wordly distractions as possible, and were perfect for borderline misanthropes like myself, while contemplating Christ and humanity.

As a Catholic I thank God for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, where time is bent back on itself, enabling me to present at Calvary for the sacrifice of all time, and to unite with the body, blood, soul and divinity of God.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Onesimus wrote: »

We'd still crucify him. The human heart never changes.

Bingo.

Outcoem would be exactly the same today as it was 2000 years ago: who wants a peace-preaching hippie liberal influencing the locals?

Kepti

The Quadratic Equation wrote: »

7. What effect would the mass media have ?

Interesting questions. I'll tackle the easiest one.

He would be absolutely hounded once the media got wind. He would be under constant surveillance, every move, every word recorded. Enough, I suspect, to drive a normal person to madness. Our regular broadcasts would be interrupted by MiracleWatch, to witness the latest. I imagine he would use mass media to preach, as it would be the best way available to spread the word.

gimmebroadband

His disciples would have professions such as fishermen, a tax-collecter, a doubting Thomas, and the odd zealot, and there would still be a Judas who would be paid off by those who wish to have Jesus Killed!

PDN

I've posted this before, but it seems apt in this thread. G.A.Studdert Kennedy was a graduate of Trinity College Dublin who, as a chaplain, became known as 'Woodbine Willie' in World War I and won a Military Cross.

Indifference

By G. A. Studdert-Kennedy

When Jesus came to Golgatha,
They hanged Him on a tree,
They drove great nails through hands and feet,
And made a Calvary.
They crowned Him with a crown of thorns,
Red were His wounds and deep,
For those were crude and cruel days,
And human flesh was cheap.

When Jesus came to Birmingham
They simply passed Him by,
They never hurt a hair of Him,
They only let Him die;
For men have grown more tender,
And they would not give Him pain,
They only just passed down the street,
And left Him in the rain.

Still Jesus cried, 'Forgive them,
For they know not what they do!
And still it rained the winter rain
That drenched Him through and through;
The crowd went home and left the streets
Without a soul to see,
And Jesus crouched against a wall
And cried for Calvary.

tommy2bad

Well we guard our world with locks and guns
And we guard our fine possessions
And once a year when Christmas comes
We give to our relations
And perhaps we give a little to the poor
If the generosity should seize us
But if any one of us should interfere
In the business of why there are poor
They get the same as the rebel Jesus

Jackson Brown.

Bit of a theme of us learning nothing from the incarnation developing. Was it a waste of time then?

The question that the op begs is why was He born 2000 years ago, is their some scriptural or other reason for 'then' rather than 'now'?

kjw47

The Quadratic Equation wrote: »

Here's an interesting hypothetical scenario to help explore our Christian faith :

If Christ was not born on earth until the latter half of the 20th Century instead of the 1st, how different would things be ?

1. How different would the world today be ?

2. How different would world history be ?

3. What religion, if any, would most people in Ireland and Europe be today ?

4. Where would Christ be born, who would be his apostles and first disciples ?

5. What authorities would he challenge ?

6. How would he be treated ?

7. What effect would the mass media have ?

8. Honestly, would you follow his Christ and his disciples and become a Christian ? Why would you do so, bearing in mind that many of the people of Judaea who witnessed Christ in the flesh did not follow him ?

The world( majority) hates truth-- its why they killed him and all of his followers back then--truth exposes false religions and practices. Gods word says most would rather have their ears tickled.

PDN

tommy2bad wrote: »

The question that the op begs is why was He born 2000 years ago, is their some scriptural or other reason for 'then' rather than 'now'?

But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law (Galatians 4:4).

A combination of circumstances came together 2000 years ago:

a) Various human philosophies, as taught by the Greeks, had been tried and proved inadequate to address the problem of human sin.

b) For probably the only time in history a large proportion of the population of the known world spoke a common language (Greek).

c) The Pax Romana, together with Roman roads, made it possible for the Gospel to spead rapidly.

d) The Jewish law had done it's job of being a schoolmaster to bring the Jews to Christ. A sufficient amount of Jews now looked for something beyong the Law and were waiting expectantly for the Messiah.

Mr Trade In

Where on Earth would he be born, Isreal = leader of Mossad, America = Major Military/ Political leader, Ireland = Moonshine connoisseur. Also wouldn't the whole world most likely be Muslim as the message and teachings of Muhammad would have spread worldwide without Christianity there to rival it.

Doc Farrell

Fairly sure Jesus wouldn't be in Mossad or the Republican party if he were alive today but as this is undoubtedly the strangest hypothetical thread this week I guess your view is as good as any.
Civilization simply wouldn't exist as we understand it, apart from the Chinese, God bless'em!

Fanny Cradock

PDN wrote: »

But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law (Galatians 4:4).

A combination of circumstances came together 2000 years ago:

a) Various human philosophies, as taught by the Greeks, had been tried and proved inadequate to address the problem of human sin.

b) For probably the only time in history a large proportion of the population of the known world spoke a common language (Greek).

c) The Pax Romana, together with Roman roads, made it possible for the Gospel to spead rapidly.

d) The Jewish law had done it's job of being a schoolmaster to bring the Jews to Christ. A sufficient amount of Jews now looked for something beyong the Law and were waiting expectantly for the Messiah.

Perhaps there was a convergence of events in history that made 2000 years ago the best possible time for the Messiah to finally arrive.

The Quadratic Equation

Doc Farrell wrote: »

Fairly sure Jesus wouldn't be in Mossad or the Republican party if he were alive today but as this is undoubtedly the strangest hypothetical thread this week I guess your view is as good as any.
Civilization simply wouldn't exist as we understand it, apart from the Chinese, God bless'em!

I find it a useful exercise to help sink in the truly enormous impact Christ has had on world history, I'm also fascinated by the question of how he might divinely choreograph such a miraculous impact in todays world, and how todays instant mass media would portray it and how it would affect the spread of the Gospel. Personally today, I think we would be living in a much more Islamic style world, and the modern Christ would be put to death for both threatening the teachings of Islam and upsetting the political power balance in an Islamic country, where ever that may be. I wonder what the modern day equivalent of lepers and tax collectors for Rome would be ?

PDN

The Quadratic Equation wrote: »

I find it a useful exercise to help sink in the truly enormous impact Christ has had on world history, I'm also fascinated by the question of how he might divinely choreograph such a miraculous impact in todays world, and how todays instant mass media would portray it and how it would affect the spread of the Gospel. Personally today, I think we would be living in a much more Islamic style world, and the modern Christ would be put to death for both threatening the teachings of Islam and upsetting the political power balance in an Islamic country, where ever that may be. I wonder what the modern day equivalent of lepers and tax collectors for Rome would be ?

I doubt it very much. Islam probably began as a heretical strand of Christianity, so if Christ had not come then there would be no Islam. An Arabic version of Zoroastrianism perhaps?

looksee

First thing that occurred to me - it would not be the 20th century.

I think that poem sums it up pretty well, but that is seeing things from a current perspective. If there had not been Christianity every aspect of Western life and history would have been different, especially our attitudes and outlook which are based on Christian morality.

tommy2bad

Based on Christian morality perhaps but with definite Hellenistic leanings.
Islam wouldn't exist as islam but probably as a reaction to whatever dominant religion was in conflict with the Prophet.

Allowing for a historical butterfly effect things could be extremely different but people being people I don't think so. Christianity exists today in the form it dose, as much because of politics as anything else.
Someone raised the point that crucifixion was a must scripturally. Where would crucifixion still be the method of execution? Lethal injection creates a similar body posture, so Texas? Kinky Friedman as the new St Peter???
http://www.amazon.com/They-Aint-Making-Jesus-Anymore/dp/B000A5B2I4

yawha

Why do people think he'd be executed?

There are plenty of modern messiah claimants, mystics, spiritual leaders etc. that exist today, they're not put to death.

Fanny Cradock

Well, the thread presupposes that there is a Jesus and that he is divine - namely, that he is part of the Trinity. Christianity has always maintained that the ultimate goal of the Messiah was self-sacrifice. Old Testament passages like Isaiah 53 have been understood in this light. His life for our sin.

yawha

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Well, the thread presupposes that there is a Jesus and that he is divine - namely, that he is part of the Trinity. Christianity has always maintained that the ultimate goal of the Messiah was self-sacrifice. Old Testament passages like Isaiah 53 have been understood in this light. His life for our sin.

I understand this.

But, at least in the modern western world, you wouldn't get put to death simply for having and preaching beliefs contrary to the majority.

Now, you can presuppose that in this context he wouldn't have existed 2000 years ago, and thus the course of history differed and the west was a much less tolerant and diverse place.

But if the question is assuming the world is as is today minus Christianity, and we're talking about the west, I don't see how Jesus would be subject to the death penalty, let alone torture.

Fanny Cradock

I would think that the underlying assumption of the thread is that without Christianity the world would be all the worse off for it.

tommy2bad

Christianity has always maintained that the ultimate goal of the Messiah was self-sacrifice.

Is it? I always thought He came to redeem us.

I would think that the underlying assumption of the thread is that without Christianity the world would be all the worse off for it.

Is it? How much worse was it before Jesus? I think most of the improvements in the world would have happened anyway. We built on a Greek Roman tradition, China ,Japan India didn't and are playing catch up since.
Apart from the theological realm what difference did Jesus make. Paul went to Rome, Rome instituted Christianity as the unifying state religion and carried on as normal. It could have been worship of Apollo or Isis or TFSM (blessed be his noodly appendages) The same geo political sequence would have resulted.
Did Jesus change something other than metaphysically ?

mikemac1

Jews would kill him

tommy2bad

mikemac1 wrote: »

Jews would kill him

Well yeah, presuming he would still be a Palestinian.:rolleyes:

Doc Farrell

mikemac1 wrote: »

Jews would kill him

Not a Catholic teaching since the 60's, reititerated by the Pope this year.

http://www.catholic.org/international/international_story.php?id=40576

b.o.m.d.a.s.

JESUS FOR SAM

Manach

In this alternative history world (OT See Harry Turtledove's work), I reckon that the world would be Byzantine. Given than it was a logically necessity to split the Roman empire in the 4th empire, Byzantine would still be founded. As PDN stated, without Christianity there would be no Islam, which in the 7th century hammered into Byzantine. Without Christindom to tame the barbarian hordes, Western Europe becomes a tribal area. In this timeline, given the traditional approach to science that Rome had, we'd likely be using gunpowder.

tommy2bad

b.o.m.d.a.s. wrote: »

JESUS FOR SAM

Wrong Kingdom

lmaopml

dvae wrote: »

Jesus would still be crucified. he would have to be, as it was prophesied in psalms.

Certainly, Scripture is unique in that it holds up itself by prophesy for the test of time - and it will stand the test of time. Christ had to be born in Bethlehem, and indeed at the time he was born, and died how he died, among many other prophesies about the Messiah.

However, the thread is looking at how things would play out should all of those things have come together today, or in our time as such, given our knowledge of history, but not of the future, how would people approach a Jesus now.....? He's still here, in everybody, we're doing it all the time - it's just a thought experiment.

kjw47

mikemac1 wrote: »

Jews would kill him

the false christian religions would first. They hate truth.

bonniebede

Yes. On live tv. As a participant in big brother. When the other house participants vote him out (reject him) but the people phone vote him back in (the crowds loved him). so the house particpants crucify him.

Mr P. Pilate, on being asked about the incident said, he wasn't sure about the truthfulness of the statements Jesus had made, but it was great television.


Rumours abound that a special two hour show on sunday will be asked if it is possible at this stage, being dead, for Jesus to still win big brother. Could be the ultimate comeback show.

Fanny Cradock

tommy2bad wrote: »

Is it? I always thought He came to redeem us.

My post doesn't say anything different to this. But if you prefer you can add redemption into my post, which I thought was implied.

tommy2bad wrote: »

Is it? How much worse was it before Jesus? I think most of the improvements in the world would have happened anyway. We built on a Greek Roman tradition, China ,Japan India didn't and are playing catch up since.
Apart from the theological realm what difference did Jesus make. Paul went to Rome, Rome instituted Christianity as the unifying state religion and carried on as normal. It could have been worship of Apollo or Isis or TFSM (blessed be his noodly appendages) The same geo political sequence would have resulted.
Did Jesus change something other than metaphysically ?

Perhaps you would enjoy reading Atheist Delusions by David B. Hart. While I don't doubt that we would still advance without Christianity (in what direction, I wonder), it's interesting to read how Christianity - either as a formalised religion or something a little more raw (and possibly a little more real) - was operating very much against the then prevailing pagan current. In areas like care for the sick and poor, rights for women (yes, hard to credit), education, support for natural philosophy etc. - there hadn't ever been anything like Christianity and what Christians felt inspired to do by it. Of course, they also felt that the Gospel inspired some pretty rotten stuff as well. If you want to hear Hart in debate with Terry Sanders of the National Secular Society discuss this further then have a listen here.


You are welcome to your belief. But I'm fairly certain that the world would be a much different place if we still worshipped Apollo. Moreover, I think that in many respects we would live an impoverished existence.