The Alien saga

krudler

So all this talk of Prometheus and the trailer made me watch the Alien saga again this week, and some of the blu-ray docs. The first two are absolute classics, I think the third is really underrated,with a interesting making of saga. and the fourth is pretty pants aside from a few moments. Its definitely a fascinating series of movies, the troubled shoots of the sequels makes for good documentary fodder.

So boardsies, whats your favourite of the series? Generally I find Aliens is more fun to watch, Alien is the better film but its more tense, and something you need to be more in the frame of mind to watch, if I'd compare them Alien is a night in a haunted house, Aliens is a rollercoaster.

Love the music in them as well, especially Alien 3s score, its really underrated and has some fantastic moments, like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGZxh-NG7FA

love the theme at 1.50 in, plays during the furnace scene.

Alien 3 was much maligned on its release but I think its a perfectly good entry into the series, its dark, really dark. killing off Newt and Hicks from the outset pissed off a lot of people but if they were kept in it then it would have most likely been a retread of Aliens, more corridors and guns. I like how the series was reinvented in every movie. Alien is a haunted house in space horror movies, Aliens is an action packed war film, Alien 3 is a gothic horror. Alien Resurrection is...well shyte to be honest.

TheUsual

I agree with most of your post, except I am not keen on Aliens ... it's just a boring shoot em up. You don't really connect with any of the soldiers or care when they get taken out.


Alien is a classic, which is why Prometheus is being made.

Alien 3 is a great film if you watch the extended cut on the DVD, really sinister and claustrophobic feel about it. They only have an axe to protect themselves and the acting is great in it.

Alien 4 should have been a lot better, there was a change of Director at least once, and the ending is so very bad.
I did like the underwater scenes and the idea that Ripley was a bit of a bitch in it.

The King of Moo

If I had to choose, I'd pick Aliens as my favourite. I love both it and Alien, but didn't get round to seeing Alien for many years, so when I finally saw it it didn't feel too original, but only because I'd seen so many films that imitated it.
A little like the way I felt the first time I saw Halloween.
Though like Halloween, I've given Alien many repeated viewings, and though it doesn't surprise me, I still love it and can appreciate how expertly it's made.

I saw Aliens when I was fairly young, and hadn't seen anything like it in terms of action, excitement and scale.
While I do think calling Alien a horror film and Aliens an action film is a useful distinction, I think Aliens is quite scary in its own way.
It's a different type of primal horror: the fear of a completely overwhelming force, contrasted with the fear of being alone and stalked in the first film.
While I love both films, Aliens will always be more iconic for me.

I often watch Alien 3 when it's on tv: it's a fascinating disaster, with a great setting in particular, but it's frustrating to see its potential wasted, and I hate the killing off of Newt and Hicks, particularly the manner it happens.

Alien: Resurrection: meh! Though I will say that the PSone tie-in game was a great, scary first-person shooter, reminding me more of Alien than Resurrection.

ebbsy

I remember coming out of the cinema after Alien 3 so disappointed, but everyone to themselves. There were a lot of scripts that were not used for that film that would have been so much better in my opinion, especially the monastery storyline. That would have made for a great film.

Perhaps only Cameron or Scott were the only ones capable of doing the series justice, which is why I cannot wait for this upcoming episode, it looks fantastic.

KilOit

Enjoyed them all immensely, new trailer really gave me a graving to re-watch them all. agree with you on Alien 3 it's very underrated, acting was superb compared to aliens

TheUsual

Watch the original Alien trailer along with the new Prometheus trailer ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEVY_lonKf4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sftuxbvGwiU

helimachoptor

For me Aliens is the one, Alien is fantastic though and as said above one is about being stalked on a completely alien planet and Aliens is about getting overrun.

All immense, I'm really like Alien 3 i think in some ways it mirros the stalked feel of Alien.

Resurrection was ok, I really enjoyed the AVP films even though they are terrible additions to the (both) series.

Really looking forward to Prometheus

krudler

Aliens is one of my favourite movies to watch, its so brilliantly paced, you dont see a xenomorph for over an hour, then its more ebbs and highs until the finale which is absolutely outstanding action cinema. once the aliens start breaking into the room from the ceiling until they get back to the Sulaco its just non stop action, fantastic stuff from Cameron. my favourite scene of the movie is when they go back for Newt and Ripley is tooling herself up in the elevator with grenades, flares and wiedling a flame thrower and assault rifle as the elevator descends, James Horner (who does recycle a lot of his stuff) does some great work here:

that part at 1.40 gives me goosebumps, as the floor numbers get lower and lower, the whole facility is coming apart, the warning siren is going off and Ripley is getting ready, then the doors open and...nothing, just the sounds of the atmosphere processor rupturing.

The queen still looks amazing as well, from her reveal, with that horrible egg sac, sublte gestures, one of the best puppets ever put on film, the big cgi one in AVP looked pants, in Aliens she had awkward, spindly movement as she isnt designed to do anything but sit there and lay eggs, the one in AVP is tearing around the place like an olympic sprinter.

mike65

Alien cubed is better in the DVD edit I understand, the cinema release was bit of a mess albeit with good aspects.

Alien worked better for me the second time around whereas Aliens was just fantastic out of the box, Cameron piling on the hardware, action and kills like a kid in a toyshop!

Never seen Resurrection for some reason, never mind the AvP stuff.

Mickeroo

Aliens is the one for me, just a visceral experience of a film. I prefer the original cut to the overlong extended one as the extra footage kills the pace for me. I find Aliens just a very intense film, its almost exhausting to watch in some ways.

Alien is great though, and far more scary than the 2nd one. I would rank it alongside The Thing as the best horror film I've ever seen. The claustrophobic setting and the fact you never really see the monster are all used to perfection. I think Alien 3 is a bit of an imitation of the first in some ways, although I think its a very underrated film in its own right and a worthy entry in the series.

I'm going to buck the trend a bit and say I actually really really like Ressurection. I just thought it was a pretty fun film and a different take on things, I don't think its as good as the other three but I loved the comic book feel of it, I liked that Ripley had become part alien which made her more or less superhuman, and I liked that basically its a firefly/alien crossover Plus it has Ron Perlman in it.

Rob987

Aliens for me too. A brilliant re-imagining of the first movie yet unique in its own way. And still, 25 years later, as fresh as ever. Out on blu-ray early 2012 though it'll be interesting to see how it transfers, as the original grainy format works so well.

Alien was brilliant also. I remember walking out of cinema in 1992 after Alien 3 and feeling very disappointed, a feeling which persists today. To me, the series stops at Aliens...

I have both the limited edition motion tracker and M41a pulse rifle. Trying to post photos but can't from iPhone. They're awesome :-)

Rob

Rob987

Et voila...

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/84a64c62.jpg

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/8fc16e74.jpg

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/cd759058.jpg

Mickeroo

Rob987 wrote: »

Et voila...

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/84a64c62.jpg

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/8fc16e74.jpg

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/cd759058.jpg

Pretty bad ass

Is the ammo counter just a sticker or an actual light?

RichieC

definitely Aliens for me.

PerrinV2

Aliens cause bishops love sci fi.

rednik

Alien the original and the best. I bought the blu ray anthology and they look great on the coffee table, best coasters ever.

Rob987

Mickeroo wrote: »

Rob987 wrote: »

Et voila...

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/84a64c62.jpg

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/8fc16e74.jpg

http://i1118.photobucket.com/albums/k614/Rob9877/cd759058.jpg

Pretty bad ass

Is the ammo counter just a sticker or an actual light?

It's an LED light. Battery stored in magazine. From Propstore of London. Motion tracker has functioning screen also - shoots the radar waves out & warning pings/spots just like the movie. Museum quality piece; limited to 2,500 pieces worldwide.

FlashD

Another vote for Aliens, second favourite film of all time behind Indy (raiders), remember renting it out at the local vid store with a friend in the late 80's, we were both about 12. (No questions asked back then in small country towns), Guns, violence, monsters, cool spaceships and machines, a 12 year old kids dream.

Anyways I have seen it many times since, still excellent to this day, I also prefer the original cut as the directors is a little too long and kills the relentless pace of the original slightly.

Alien is also excellent in a different way, slower pace and great build up.

Alien 3 is a bit underated but had its problems (David Fincher was originally directing, could have been class if he had been left to do his thing). On the back of ALiens though it was a tall order.

ALien Resuerrection, I enjoyed it in the cinema but it wasn't a good film as far as story, too disjointed, I have never really gone back to it, visually it was heavily stylised too. The underwater scene is probably the best thing about it. Possibly the start of my love/hate relationship with CGI.

Don't class any of these as horror, always sci-fi for me.

FIRST TO VOTE HERE ...ALIENS 100%

unclebill98

Aliens for me.

Have to say I love all the films cause I suppose I was at a age where alien films where my fav type of films.

In saying that Aliens has some of the most memorable quotes and scenes than the rest of them(well maybe not the chest busting scence, that kind of goes with out aying)

The likes of hicks, Vaschez, the drop ship, the apc and main orbiting ship, the sentry gun are for me some of the best movie moments.

A friend of mine's boyfriend is trying to get her to watch all the Alien movies before the release of Prometheus and I gave her a list of all (good and bad) of the ones she'll have to watch beforehand - have I missed any?

Alien
Aliens
Aliens 3
Aliens: Resurrection
Alien vs Predator
Alien vs Predator: Requiem

krudler

take both AVP movies of the list, what'd she do to deserve that?!

FlashD

Looking at the cycle to date if Scott is doing the next one, then that means Cameroon should be back in the hot seat for a sequel to Aliens.

.......:D

Sad Professor

I love Aliens very much, but Alien is better in every possible way. As brilliant as Cameron’s film is, when you get down to it he regurgitated the plot of the original film, exchanging the cat for a girl, the crew for marines and the atmospheric suspense for wall-to-wall action. His greatest accomplishment was taking a timeless sci-fi horror classic and turning it into another ‘80s action film. Nearly all the set pieces are based on similar sequences in the original film with elements of Cameron’s own Terminator worked in. While the execution is flawless, there’s nothing original or innovative about Aliens in the way that the first film was.

I can understand people preferring Aliens over the first film - it’s faster paced, more action-packed, more testosterone-fuelled, etc. But it owes so much to the original that I don’t think can considered a truly great film in itself. It’s certainly one of the greatest sequels ever made, but the first film is a masterpiece. The cast, the photography, the design of the creature, the suspense - it’s in a league of its own. Cameron’s film did what every sequel attempts: take the original and multiple it by a 100. The result is one of the greatest thrill rides ever made, but you never the get the sense that Cameron even in his wildest dreams could have made the original film.

krudler

Something I love about Alien is the set design, its absolutely stunning even to this day, it puts most other movies to shame, its one of the first movies to show a spaceship as this dirty, industrial place rather than the super clean 2001/Star Trek stuff. Its a film that looks timeless aside from a few 70's computer screens, but even those add to the overall charm and look of the film, stuff like the MUTHUR room and the grainy, interference laden monitors are great looking.

The dvd/blu-ray docs are pretty much the best set of extras ever as well, I've watched them a few times now and they're always engaging, especially Alien 3, its nice to see a making of thats as candid as it is, given the movies troubled production there was no way they could gloss over it anyway but its refreshing to see something different to the "we all got on and everyone loved everyone" dvd extra.

NinjaK

Alien 2 is my favorite but I like the other 3 aswell. The 3d and 4th films are good imo

Agricola

Aliens for me. I saw it before the original and I think it may have spoiled it for me. You expect the first film to be more of the same but its very different. Not that Alien isnt great in its own right, but for me personally it begins and ends with the second film.

It's probably my favourite sci-fi and favourite action movie. The pacing is so brilliant. The long uneventful lead-in where so much time is spent getting to know the characters, the tense cat and mouse scenarios and the fantastic action sequences which are themselves huge payoffs for tension filled buildups.
Its one of the few films I cannot tear myself away from when its on TV.

FrostyJack

Sad Professor wrote: »

I love Aliens very much, but Alien is better in every possible way.

Original is not always best, they are 2 different types of films. One could argue Cameron improved on the pacing of the first and added the action sequences it was missing to make it perfect. I know some people who could not get past the first 20 minutes of Alien (not saying this is a good thing), but Aliens seems to be all things to all men (obviously not all men). I only watched Alien 3 yesterday, the 2 and half hours seemed to fly in, very underated movie.

Zombrex

Both Alien and Aliens are excellent. Alien is a haunted house movie in space and Aliens is a Vietnam war movie in space. The brilliance of both is that the writers and director understood the type of movie they were trying to make.

This I think was the biggest problem with Alien 3, and to a much greater extent Alien 4, confusion among the team (writer, director, art department etc) over what type of movie they were tying to make.

Alien 3 famously went through many many re-writes, alterations and studio interference. Joss Weldon (writer of Alien 4 and yes Buffy) has stated that the script for Alien 4 was not altered very much the problem was that the director just had a completely different vision over pretty much every scene than the way Weldon has meant it to be taken.

I guess it shows the problem when teams making a film are not all on the same page (ahem)

impr0v

ebbsy wrote: »

Perhaps only Cameron or Scott were the only ones capable of doing the series justice, which is why I cannot wait for this upcoming episode, it looks fantastic.

I don't think you can blame Fincher for the shortcomings of Alien 3. He came to the party late, and had constantly to fight for creative control. The fact that it has merit at all, and it does have considerable merit, is in large part testament to his skill as a filmmaker.

mike65

Sad Professor wrote: »

I love Aliens very much, but Alien is better in every possible way. As brilliant as Cameron’s film is, when you get down to it he regurgitated the plot of the original film, exchanging the cat for a girl, the crew for marines and the atmospheric suspense for wall-to-wall action. His greatest accomplishment was taking a timeless sci-fi horror classic and turning it into another ‘80s action film. Nearly all the set pieces are based on similar sequences in the original film with elements of Cameron’s own Terminator worked in. While the execution is flawless, there’s nothing original or innovative about Aliens in the way that the first film was.

I can understand people preferring Aliens over the first film - it’s faster paced, more action-packed, more testosterone-fuelled, etc. But it owes so much to the original that I don’t think can considered a truly great film in itself. It’s certainly one of the greatest sequels ever made, but the first film is a masterpiece. The cast, the photography, the design of the creature, the suspense - it’s in a league of its own. Cameron’s film did what every sequel attempts: take the original and multiple it by a 100. The result is one of the greatest thrill rides ever made, but you never the get the sense that Cameron even in his wildest dreams could have made the original film.

I doubt anyone on the Alien team would maker any great claims for originality. They remade It! The Terror from Beyond Space with a budget. Its plus points are of technique not "creativity".

CatFromHue

I really like Aliens but can see why people don't think it fits in with Alien and Alien 3. I think it's this "non fitting in" which makes the Alien trilogy so good though.

I read a few of the spin off Alien books where the Alien had made it to Earth. The feeling from these books, Alien, and Alien 3 is of helplessness, loneliness, and hardship. The Aliens while not invincible come across as almost invincible. In Alien and Alien 3 there is only one Alien and it isn't defeated until the very end. In Aliens though it's relatively early in the film when one of them is killed.

I think Aliens helps make the trilogy though. If you look at the Terminator trilogy they're effectively the same film, whereas the Alien trilogy you could say work very well together.

I know there is an Alien and Terminator 4 but for me both of these films stand outside their predecessors in their storyline. They make the films nearly a Trilogy +1 as opposed to a quadrilogy!

Sad Professor

Even with all the script problems, Alien 3 would have turned out fine if Fincher had been left alone to direct and edit the film the way he wanted. The film is a perfect example of what happens when a bunch of idiot studio executives get together and start looking over the director's shoulder. The documentary on the Blu-ray is eye opening. Jon Landau's failure to take responsibly for the finished result is sickening.

mike65 wrote: »

I doubt anyone on the Alien team would maker any great claims for originality. They remade It! The Terror from Beyond Space with a budget. Its plus points are of technique not "creativity".

I disagree completely. There is heaps of creativity on display in the first Alien: H.R. Giger's xenomorph, the photography, the production design, the whole visual style of the film. The plot had been done before but never like that. There's a helluva lot more to the film than technique. It's got style. Something which I don't think can be said for Aliens. Cameron is basically a master of technique and not much else. Where as Scott is capable of some stunningly original and creative work when he puts his mind to it.

krudler

krudler wrote: »

take both AVP movies of the list, what'd she do to deserve that?!

Ah AvP was an enjoyable popcorn flick, but yes, there was no defending AvP: R

krudler

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah AvP was an enjoyable popcorn flick, but yes, there was no defending AvP: R

I actually preferred AVP:R of the two of them, AVP was just dull, I dont understand the logic of slowly introducing two movie aliens that have 6 movies already collectively about them. we all know who the predator is and what aliens are, get to the fighting! least in AVP:R they're in it right from the start.

bullvine

Alien is a great film, perhaps the best haunted house film ever...

but

Aliens hands down is the greatest scifi, action, horror film ever made.

bullvine

CatFromHue wrote: »

I really like Aliens but can see why people don't think it fits in with Alien and Alien 3. I think it's this "non fitting in" which makes the Alien trilogy so good though.

I read a few of the spin off Alien books where the Alien had made it to Earth. The feeling from these books, Alien, and Alien 3 is of helplessness, loneliness, and hardship. The Aliens while not invincible come across as almost invincible. In Alien and Alien 3 there is only one Alien and it isn't defeated until the very end. In Aliens though it's relatively early in the film when one of them is killed.

I think Aliens helps make the trilogy though. If you look at the Terminator trilogy they're effectively the same film, whereas the Alien trilogy you could say work very well together.

I know there is an Alien and Terminator 4 but for me both of these films stand outside their predecessors in their storyline. They make the films nearly a Trilogy +1 as opposed to a quadrilogy!

Thats a really interesting way to look at the films.

FrostyJack

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah AvP was an enjoyable popcorn flick, but yes, there was no defending AvP: R

AvP:R was much better than AvP as stated above. It was a zero inteligence, zero suspense movie, but I loved it. Both cannot be compared to the Alien movies, they have more in common to the Predator ones. AvP could have been really good if they didn't make it PG13 and didn't have the stupid ending.

Ridley

krudler wrote: »

I actually preferred AVP:R of the two of them, AVP was just dull, I dont understand the logic of slowly introducing two movie aliens that have 6 movies already collectively about them. we all know who the predator is and what aliens are, get to the fighting! least in AVP:R they're in it right from the start.

I think that's more AVP's execution not working rather than the idea of a slow build-up. Supposed to be suspense in the first time the two collide, after all.

I'd like to see an adaptation of the AVP: Eternal comic, and the end of Requiem could set it up nicely.

Basically a man finds the wreckage of a Predator ship carrying xenomorph eggs in the hold and becomes a prominent mogul off the back of reverse-engineering what he can of the ship's tech. He also finds that the biology of the dead Predator pilot has the secret to immortality (I'd change that to a cure for cancer or something). Assuming the eggs to be Predators, he incubates them and of course all hell breaks loose when xenomorphs infest the building complex while a journalist is investigating the man's suspicious rise to prominence and Predators arrive to reclaim their technology.

That it takes place in Tokyo is a plus.

Galvasean

mike65 wrote: »

I doubt anyone on the Alien team would maker any great claims for originality. They remade It! The Terror from Beyond Space with a budget. Its plus points are of technique not "creativity".

Interesting. i'll have to look up that film.

bullvine

It also borrowed alot from Dark Star!

Sad Professor

Dan O'Bannon co-wrote Dark Star.

Planet of the Vampires was a potentially far greater influence on Alien, both conceptually and aesthetically. Scott claims he never saw it, which is hard to believe given that Prometheus looks like it has even more in common with it. However, influences can come from all sorts of places.