Yet another 'caught on camera' cops heavy handed to photographer

dinneenp

I always find these interesting to watch/listen to. link

Back in 2010, I blogged the video of Jules Mattsson, a 15-year-old freelance photographer who was stopped by police while shooting an Armed Forces Day parade in London. The police inspector took down his details, told him it was an offense under the Terrorism Act to take pictures of soldiers, told him that the police could stop public photography without recourse to any law, and then told him that photographing soldiers was "gay," "anti-social behaviour," "silly" and "stupid."

PCPhoto

fair play to him.... he knew the laws related to what he was doing and questioned the police.... who obviously didn't understand how to do their own job.

its highly unlikely but have there or will there be disciplinary proceedings against the police involved ?

its good that people question the police like this ... non aggressive and non threatening, if only photographers over here knew the law regarding their own work..... many don't because the law is such a grey area and open to interpretation.

I dont have the revelant piece of law available at the moment - but it is apparently illegal* to photograph gardai during the course of their duties (Dont tell the gardai that) .... * it is however legal to photograph them if they are not performing their duties.

* = My interpretation of a law which is fairly old and possibly not even known by most gardai.

thefly

Class fair play to the little weiner

Borderfox

PCPhoto wrote: »

fair play to him.... he knew the laws related to what he was doing and questioned the police.... who obviously didn't understand how to do their own job.

its highly unlikely but have there or will there be disciplinary proceedings against the police involved ?

its good that people question the police like this ... non aggressive and non threatening, if only photographers over here knew the law regarding their own work..... many don't because the law is such a grey area and open to interpretation.

I dont have the revelant piece of law available at the moment - but it is apparently illegal* to photograph gardai during the course of their duties (Dont tell the gardai that) .... * it is however legal to photograph them if they are not performing their duties.

* = My interpretation of a law which is fairly old and possibly not even known by most gardai.

I thought with the Gardai it was ok so long as you werent obstructing them, if it was the case when they were performing duties then marches would be out of bounds

PCPhoto

its a little known law .... doubt many gardai would be able to quote it or even reference it.

(learned about it from a solicitor)

opti76

PCPhoto wrote: »

its a little known law .... doubt many gardai would be able to quote it or even reference it.

(learned about it from a solicitor)

cant remember the statuate but ....
its not illegal to photograph a garda in the execution of his duty but it is illegal to "publish" the image, if the member is clearly identifiable without the garda's consent or the consent of the press office.

publish is a broad definition though ...

In my brief experience of photographing Gardaí, I've found that in real-world practical use, the Gardaí general don't care if you photograph them.

That said, I've found, too, that, in the case where the Garda is doing some non-essential work (like waiting around at a crime scene or the likes) they usually appreciate it if you approach them and tell them you're going to take the photograph before you take it (so they can turn their back to you).


That said, I've never actually seen a Garda giving out to anyone for taking photographs or recording video of them, so...


Of course none of that helps from a lawful standpoint.

Tallon

I tried to take a photo of a Garda car at a show when I was younger and the two gardai went crazy, made me delete it

Obviously, I have since been educated and would not delete it now

Tallon

They do it a little different in the US

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=5d8_1324187477

Freddie59

Fair dues to that young fella. The policeman was thick. At the very least he should be able to quote the relevant law verbatim. My own experience is london was quite different. [URL="
Mounted Policewoman, London, England by Vadrefjord (Ireland), on Flickr"]I photographed a mounted policewoman outside Buckingham Palace[/URL] and she was delighted to oblige. Even pointed out a pickpocket that was nearby.

Likewise our [URL="
Tall Ships Race 2011, Waterford City, Ireland by Vadrefjord (Ireland), on Flickr"]own mounted police[/URL] obliged during the Tall Ships Festival. You can't tar them all with the same brush.

photolessons

I really look forward to the day that cameras embedded into say, glasses, are a pretty standard thing. It would really turn the tables on thugs like this abusing a limited position of power when 'no one is looking'.

Sort of a crowd-sourced Orwellian situation ha.

K_user

What a great video - thanks for publishing it.

How many members of the police force surrounded that 15 year old, on a day that they were concerned over terrorism? At one point it was a sergeant, then it was the inspector in charge. No one seemed to have a direct answer and used the old "change the subject" tactic, but the young man was having none of it. He just kept asking what the charge was.

The police were obviously frustrated and just wanted rid of him. The more they tried to frighten him off, the more he stood his ground. Which is turn p*ssed them off and got them all riled up.

Congrats to that young man, I doubt most of us would have the b*lls to do the same.

Zillah

That kid was great. Few things piss me off more than cops taking liberties with their power. They say he was paid an undisclosed sum. I didn't think you could sue the police, what exactly what the compensation for?

MiskyBoyy

dinneenp wrote: »

I always find these interesting to watch/listen to. link

Back in 2010, I blogged the video of Jules Mattsson, a 15-year-old freelance photographer who was stopped by police while shooting an Armed Forces Day parade in London. The police inspector took down his details, told him it was an offense under the Terrorism Act to take pictures of soldiers, told him that the police could stop public photography without recourse to any law, and then told him that photographing soldiers was "gay," "anti-social behaviour," "silly" and "stupid."

Interesting video, this is the same guy on some News channel in the U.K discussing what happened...

PCPhoto

the video clip doesn't really deal with the original video.... basically the policeman saying ... well... the law is wrong.... but I'm not going to do anything about it... the ordinary "bobby" needs to have more common sense.

The only issue with that is that it deals with England - here in Ireland if you refuse to give your details it DOES annoy the gardai to the extent that you will more than likely be arrested for failing to comply with the instructions/directions of a Garda - which is an offence. (I believe)

Shamrock883

Article 40 of the constitution gives us the right to privacy. I would take it that encompasses the right to withhold your details unless they state a provision of the law by which you must provide them. Section 9 (think that's right) of the public order act says if they have reasonable suspicion you have committed a crime, they can ask for your details and arrest you should you decline in that case.

I would imagine standing in a public place taking a photo and minding your business would give you a pretty strong case if anything were to happen...

Someone please correct the errors in my judgement before I get arrested :pac:

padocon

opti76 wrote: »

cant remember the statuate but ....
its not illegal to photograph a garda in the execution of his duty but it is illegal to "publish" the image, if the member is clearly identifiable without the garda's consent or the consent of the press office.

publish is a broad definition though ...

But remember there was a story a few months back about 2 gardi (on duty)that chased some famous model and pulled her over to have a chat. She ended up taking a photo with them and she or someone sent it to the press, it was on the cover of a tabloid the next day.

thefly

Shamrock883 wrote: »

Article 40 of the constitution gives us the right to privacy. I would take it that encompasses the right to withhold your details unless they state a provision of the law by which you must provide them. Section 9 (think that's right) of the public order act says if they have reasonable suspicion you have committed a crime, they can ask for your details and arrest you should you decline in that case.

I would imagine standing in a public place taking a photo and minding your business would give you a pretty strong case if anything were to happen...

Someone please correct the errors in my judgement before I get arrested :pac:

Pretty much spot on!

On less you are under the suspicion of committing a crime, you don't have to give them your details.

MiskyBoyy

I found the perfect t-shirt for this guy:

http://www.ebay.ie/itm/Im-photographer-not-terrorist-SLR-DSLR-Digital-photo-camera-Black-T-shirt-/290616371799?pt=US_Mens_Tshirts&hash=item43aa15ea57#ht_1237wt_1344

Tallon

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NpL4PZdWT0