IRISH DEFENCE FORCES RE-ORG 2012 - WHAT DOES THIS MEAN FOR OFFICER RECRUITMENT?

KickstartHeart

Press release, DoD website.

"Statement by the Minister for Defence, Mr. Alan Shatter, T.D., on Defence Budget 2012
Re-organisation of the Defence Forces
A major re-organisation of the Defence Forces will be initiated arising from the reduction in strength of the Permanent Defence Force to 9,500 personnel. This will include a reduction in the number of Army Brigades from the current three to two.

“Because the Defence Forces have downsized faster than the rest of the public service and are already 11% below the 2000 strength level, the Government have decided that there will be no further reduction below the level proposed in the Comprehensive Review of Expenditure. The strength will be maintained at 9,500 but there will be a major streamlining of the organisation. No further barrack closures are envisaged as part of this process.

In the context of the downsizing of the PDF, I have decided that a major re-organisation of the Defence Forces is now necessary in order to prioritise “front-line” service delivery. This will include a reduction in the number of Army Brigades from three to two which will free up military personnel from administrative and support functions. The reduction in the number of Army Brigades will require a re-defining of territorial areas of responsibility”.

“I have asked the Chief of Staff and Secretary General to bring forward detailed re-organisation proposals for my consideration. This will include proposals relating to the Reserve Defence Force, which is currently organised along similar lines to the Permanent Defence Force.”

“The task of the Defence Forces in 2012 is to make the changes necessary to continue to operate effectively across all of the assigned roles within the restricted financial allocation. I am confident that they will meet this challenge”.
Defence and Army Pensions
Gross Expenditure
2011 Budget Allocation
2012 Budget Allocation
Difference
(Army Pensions and Defence)
(Millions)
- Current
921.6
893.3
28.3
- Capital
12.0
9.0
3.0
- Total
933.6
902.3
31.3

The gross allocation in 2012 for Defence and Army Pensions combined is €902m, an overall reduction of 3.4% on the 2011 allocation. Defence provision for 2012 at €688m is €38m (5.2 %) below the 2011 estimate. The provision for Army Pensions for 2012 is €214m, an increase of €6.3m (3%) on the 2011 estimate.


The expenditure reductions of c. €38m will be achieved mainly through:

· Pay and allowance savings arising from reduced Defence Forces, Civil Service and Civilian Employee numbers. (Note: A Permanent Defence Force (PDF) strength of 9500 is provided for in 2012.)
· The planned reduction of expenditure on equipment and capital works across the Defence Forces. (The procurement of two new naval vessels will continue within the reduced allocation for Defence spending.)
· Organisational efficiencies associated with barrack closures will achieve additional non-pay savings.



Notes for Editors:
In the mid 1990’s it was decided to reduce the strength of the Permanent Defence Force to approx. 11,500 personnel, with the Army being organised into three Brigades each of approx 2,300 personnel as well as the Defence Forces Training Centre and other elements. The White Paper on Defence (2000) further reduced the strength of the Permanent Defence Force to 10,500 personnel and retained a three Brigade structure. As a result of the further reduction to 9,500 personnel it is now necessary to fundamentally revisit Defence Forces organisational structures including reducing the number of Brigades to two.

There are currently three Permanent Defence Force Army Brigades, 1 Southern Brigade with its Headquarters in Cork, 2 Eastern Brigade with its Headquarters in Dublin and 4 Western Brigade with its headquarters in Athlone. Each Army Brigade is comprised of a Brigade Headquarters with infantry, artillery, cavalry and other supporting units. In Ireland, each Brigade has a defined territorial area of responsibility."



Comprehensive Expenditure Report 2012 - 2014 (Budget 2012)

Skip to page 48 for DoD

http://budget.gov.ie/Budgets/2012/Documents/CER%20-%20Estimates%20Final.pdf



Over all question. What does this mean for Defence Forces Officer recruitment in 2012 and the near future? A cadet class to be taken? A full class or a small one like the most recent ones? General enlistment recruitment situation?

OS119

KickstartHeart wrote: »

Over all question. What does this mean for Defence Forces Officer recruitment in 2012 and the near future? A cadet class to be taken? A full class or a small one like the most recent ones? General enlistment recruitment situation?

flippant answer? it probably means they won't be recruiting people who write in capital letters.

serious answer? it means less officers because there are less officer posts - 3 less inf Bn's, 1 less Arty Regiment etc... however, it may mean, along with the upcoming retirements due to pension changes, that a huge swathe of mid-ranking officers who had Bde/Bn staff posts and didn't have to get their boots muddy suddenly disappear.

that may mean, but not right now, that the Army is going to be looking to replace crusty old Commandants with thrusting young Captains.

however, as of right now the Army has a third more Pln/Coy/Bn/Bde level officers than it needs - there may be gluts at some career points and shortages at others - but its unlikely, in my view, that the Army is going to be crying out for officers in the next two or three years.

alanmcqueen

This gives some indication of the problems with restructuring and this was the now defunct ECF figure:

http://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2011-04-05.1247.0&s=defence+forces+lt+capt#g1251.0.r

(link retrieved from post on irishmilitaryonline)

Irish Times letter today from DoD PO indicated changes to increase "front line" troops. Given that total DF numbers are now at just over 9,000 and that will drop with February deadline looming, it's very hard to predict how the DF will look by end 2012.

With NRP figures only providing for 8,000 troops and Minister saying 9,500, serious changes are looming to fund that many but the DF will have to recruit to get up to 9,500 next year and that will include cadets in small numbers.

KickstartHeart

OS119 wrote: »

flippant answer? it probably means they won't be recruiting people who write in capital letters.

serious answer? it means less officers because there are less officer posts - 3 less inf Bn's, 1 less Arty Regiment etc... however, it may mean, along with the upcoming retirements due to pension changes, that a huge swathe of mid-ranking officers who had Bde/Bn staff posts and didn't have to get their boots muddy suddenly disappear.

that may mean, but not right now, that the Army is going to be looking to replace crusty old Commandants with thrusting young Captains.

however, as of right now the Army has a third more Pln/Coy/Bn/Bde level officers than it needs - there may be gluts at some career points and shortages at others - but its unlikely, in my view, that the Army is going to be crying out for officers in the next two or three years.

Flippancy neither wanted nor warranted.

OS119

KickstartHeart wrote: »

Flippancy neither wanted nor warranted.

au contrare!

KickstartHeart

OS119 wrote: »

au contrare!

Veulent pas seulement voir si je vais faire le travail que je veux de mon frère;) de ne pas être attribué pour l'utilisation de grandes lettres

goldie fish

There are already tooo many chiefs, not enough indians.

mbiking123

Yes there will be recruiting cadets each year but probably at a much reduced level

Why ?

it is not 100% true that they have to take them in every year by law, but it has transpired that when they cosidered not taking any this year that the only person who can stop officer and cadet appointments is legally the President so the advice of the AG was that legally they have to hold a competition

http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com/showthread.php?14832-Recruitment-Promotion-Embargo-(untill-end-of-2010!)/page20&p=266103#post266103

Poccington

Cadet competitions have long stopped being subject to any kind of sense.

I'd be quite shocked if they bring in any less than 25 Cadets a year from now until 2014.

neilled

mbiking123 wrote: »

Yes there will be recruiting cadets each year but probably at a much reduced level

Why ?

it is not 100% true that they have to take them in every year by law, but it has transpired that when they cosidered not taking any this year that the only person who can stop officer and cadet appointments is legally the President so the advice of the AG was that legally they have to hold a competition

http://forum.irishmilitaryonline.com/showthread.php?14832-Recruitment-Promotion-Embargo-(untill-end-of-2010!)/page20&p=266103#post266103

Not true at all. Cadetships are awarded by the minister, and are withdrawn by the minister as well if it's felt that a cadet isn't achieving the standards necessary. There is nothing in the constitution which references cadet classes having to be taken in every year, or the defence act, other than stating the ministers powers of grant and withdrawal.

neilled

Poccington wrote: »

Cadet competitions have long stopped being subject to any kind of sense.

I'd be quite shocked if they bring in any less than 25 Cadets a year from now until 2014.

Both army classes are smaller than 25. It's in the public domain if you know where to look. Shocked yet?