Bike parking at Irish Rail Stations

bk

At Clontarf Dart station I noticed that there is an excellent bike parking storage. Large shed, covered roof and locked gate to get into it.

This should be a superb facility, unfortunately looking through the window all I see are three dusty, rusty bikes that look like they haven't been moved in three years. On the outside is a sign that says you can rent a key to the gate for £7 (that is right pounds, that is how old this is!!).

I believe such facilities exist at many stations and I assume they are equally underutilised

It is such a pity, as most of the hard work has already been done (building the actual structure), just a little extra effort and this could be a brilliant extra service. Here is what they should do:

1) Replace the key lock on the gate with a smart card reader lock.
2) Require people register for access to this service, with proof of address and ID, via either Leap Card or Dublin City Bike Card (or better yet put all on Leap).
3) Use the registered leap card to allow people access to any of these bike parks at any station.

The advantage of points 1 to 3 above is that it allows people access bike parking at any station, without having to rent a key every time. Much easier.

4) Put CCTV inside the bike storage, looking at the bikes and at the entrance.
5) Record who enters the bike park with their unique Leap card.

4 and 5 above improve security.

6) Make it so that a light automatically comes on when you enter and goes off when you leave. At the moment it looks really dark and scary.
7) Replace the crappy bike stands they are using at the moment with Sheffield (U type) stands.
8) Clean it regularly and remove bikes left there for long.
9) Build similar but much larger secure bike parks at Hueston, Connolly, Tara and Pearse
10) Advertise and promote the hell out of this new service, perhaps in conjunction with Dublin Bikes. You could perhaps even get companies to sponsor it.

Well other then step 9, the others would cost very little to implement.

If properly designed, implemented and promoted, I believe such a project could be just as successful as Dublin Bikes.

bk

Some pics of the bike parking at Clontarf station.

helen.b

I wish that a lock up existed in Portmarnock train station. My son had his bike stolen form there last night. They cut clean through the lock. Very upsetting for him. He's 16 and goes everywhere on his bike. Can't afford to replace it.
He also got surrounded on Grafton Street at 2pm yesterday and was robbed. They only got 55p as he had the rest of his money and Mp3 was in an inside jacket pocket and his phone wasn't worth taking. All in all not a great day for him, but at least he wasn't hurt.

Run_to_da_hills

It would do better as a holding cell for fare dodgers.

bk wrote: »

Some pics of the bike parking at Clontarf station.

loyatemu

never mind faffing around with smartcards etc - it would only give people a false sense of security. anyone could still walk into the bikeshed behind someone with a card. just get rid of the gate and let people use the racks.

Dravokivich

I've recently noticed at Coolmine and Leixlip that they've put up lockers you can stand a bike in.

Haven't looked into how to avail of the service though.

bk

loyatemu wrote: »

never mind faffing around with smartcards etc - it would only give people a false sense of security. anyone could still walk into the bikeshed behind someone with a card. just get rid of the gate and let people use the racks.

I disagree, not if there is CCTV (monitored in the ticket office) and if people are vigilant. I know I'd never let someone tale gate me. Do you allow people to do that at the gates in DART stations?

Anyway at quieter stations like Clontarf you would rarely have people coming up behind you.

Places like Hueston and Connolly should have big, manned bike parking.

I've recently noticed at Coolmine and Leixlip that they've put up lockers you can stand a bike in.

If you can individually lock the lockers, then these are great and hopefully they will be rolled out to all stations.

Really every DART station could have these, just line the platform with some lockers.

Orion

Dravokivich wrote: »

I've recently noticed at Coolmine and Leixlip that they've put up lockers you can stand a bike in.

Haven't looked into how to avail of the service though.

Which Leixlip station? I might cycle up the canal and have a look.

subway

They were installing these lockers at howth junction also.

Dravokivich

Orion wrote: »

Which Leixlip station? I might cycle up the canal and have a look.

Sorry, skipped my mind for a sec that there's 2. It's up by Louisa Bridge in the Car Park that's next to the platforms.

bk wrote: »

If you can individually lock the lockers, then these are great and hopefully they will be rolled out to all stations.

Really every DART station could have these, just line the platform with some lockers.

You can yeah, each door seems to have a padlock on them. Don't know what the story is about getting access to them as I've only had a quick glance while walking by.

monument

A lot of the bicycle parking at train stations and Luas stop is very, very new. I suspect from the signs and the gate that he one at Clontarf is also new or newly redone.

DublinBikes2Go on twitter posted this image:

subway

thats the same lorry i saw at howth junction. i think its a great idea, but tbh, they look like a totally ineffecient use of space.

this is what i always think of when i hear bike park

bk

monument wrote: »

A lot of the bicycle parking at train stations and Luas stop is very, very new. I suspect from the signs and the gate that he one at Clontarf is also new or newly redone.

Not at Clontarf, been there years, the sign literally says £ !!!!

Does bike lockers look great, hopefully they get rolled out to all stations.

subway wrote: »

this is what i always think of when i hear bike park

We have to take baby steps towards reaching this. When you have such a massive bike culture like Amsterdam, then bike theft isn't such a bike problem and you can have dedicated staff at such bike parks.

Bike theft is still a massive problem in Dublin and not enough people cycle to have dedicated staff watching bike parks, thus the need for such lockers.

Having said that, I believe Connolly, Hueston, Tara and Pearse should have dedicated, manned bike parking. I'm sure there would be enough business to justify it.

subway

i agree its going to take small steps to achieve, but my argument is the space usage. looking at the lockers at HJ, you could store potentially 15+ bikes in the room they have used for 3. (will have to confirm the final number of lockers later today)

surely, there is a bike stand out there where, once the bike is in place, the stand folds in thru the frame and secures the bike, negating the need for a lock?
with a bike stand like the one i have described, you can have a lot more bikes squeezed in place.

for example, HJ, busy commuter intersection, people from 8+ areas bus, walk, drive or cycle to the station ever morning to get some 50 darts between 6am and 10am (plus whatever number of commuter trains)
with the new service, 3 people per day can cycle, no one else has access to any facilities and (unsure of the cost) its unlikely there will be budget (definitely not space) for more of these in the near future.

so, again, its great to see better faciltiies being offered, and i agree its a chicken and egg type problem, but its just does not appear to be scaleable

pclive

bk contact the NTA with your ideas on the bike lockup they might be interested in providing funding for the project

monument

bk wrote: »

Not at Clontarf, been there years, the sign literally says £ !!!!

Sorry, it looked new or at least revamped. I've seen far worse mistakes on signs than the £ sign!

subway wrote: »

i agree its going to take small steps to achieve, but my argument is the space usage. looking at the lockers at HJ, you could store potentially 15+ bikes in the room they have used for 3. (will have to confirm the final number of lockers later today)

surely, there is a bike stand out there where, once the bike is in place, the stand folds in thru the frame and secures the bike, negating the need for a lock?
with a bike stand like the one i have described, you can have a lot more bikes squeezed in place.

for example, HJ, busy commuter intersection, people from 8+ areas bus, walk, drive or cycle to the station ever morning to get some 50 darts between 6am and 10am (plus whatever number of commuter trains)
with the new service, 3 people per day can cycle, no one else has access to any facilities and (unsure of the cost) its unlikely there will be budget (definitely not space) for more of these in the near future.

so, again, its great to see better faciltiies being offered, and i agree its a chicken and egg type problem, but its just does not appear to be scaleable

I think 15+ in the space of three boxes is a bit of an overestimation. From the picture the boxes takes up the space of about three U or Sheffield stands -- so that's three bikes rather than six bikes.

But there should also be U stands provided at the stations and there is an advantage to the boxes for regular users. Users of the boxes get not only more secure parking which will suit more expensive bikes or any bike in problem areas, but also extra storage space, so they can leave rain gear drying or their helmet or pannier or whatever you're having your self.

Lockers also allow the more unusual combo of using the bike at the work end after getting off the train. Say I live in the city or across town and I'm commuting to an ok area but don't want to be leaving by bike there every day and don't want to carry my gear on the train.

To look at it another way, about 5-6 of these boxes fit in the space of one parking space and they suit areas where you can't have car parking.

HJ? Howth Junction? That's exactly the kind of station where if I was using bike to get to the train and going to work all day, I'd want these lockers. I would not be too quick to leave a bike there all day. And is there not still U stands there at least on one side?

subway

Ok, maybe a slight exaggeration, I mention to write 9 (3 bikes per locker) as I had typed 5 lockers originally.
Yes, I'm referring to how junction, from my earlier posts, and I think these lockers have replaced the ordinary stands.
I agree it's a dodgy station, 100%, and as a station it's an abominable testament to Celtic tiger idiocy. They did nothing to address the risk of antisocial behaviour and pretty much evrhing to encourage it.
Either way, in principle, a bike stand of they type I described with some CCTV and the odd stt patrol to discourage antisocial behaviour near the bikes would deliver more space than these. Clothing lockers could and should be provided at almost every train station anyway.

loyatemu

monument wrote: »

I think 15+ in the space of three boxes is a bit of an overestimation. From the picture the boxes takes up the space of about three U or Sheffield stands -- so that's three bikes rather than six bikes.

3 sheffield stands will take 6 bikes.

the problem with bike parking is always capacity - have a look at the stands in Greystones (sorry don't have a photo) - lots of sheffield stands under a canopy, there's really no need to do more than this, if you want security buy a decent U lock. Have a look at the stolen bikes thread on the Cycling forum, people have had their bikes nicked from underground carparks with CCTV and security - they didn't bother locking the bikes properly because they thought they were "secure"

bk wrote:

Do you allow people to do that at the gates in DART stations?

have you never been to Pearse station - half the passengers there tailgate because their paper tickets are faulty or they're just too lazy to get their tickets out (or they're fare-dodgers) - nobody gives a damn, not even the Irish rail employees.

bk

loyatemu wrote: »

Have a look at the stolen bikes thread on the Cycling forum, people have had their bikes nicked from underground carparks with CCTV and security - they didn't bother locking the bikes properly because they thought they were "secure"

My bike was locked with three locks including a Kryptonite New York Fahgettaboudit Mini U-lock [1] to a sheffield stand in a secure underground car park with CCTV and the bastards stole the saddle, saddle bar and kicked in the two wheels.

There is no such thing as too much security in Dublin.

If the current setup is good enough, then why are such facilities used so little?

[1] Anyone who knows anything about bikes knows that this is by far the best bike lock on the market.

subway

There is no such thing as too much security in Dublin.

I think this is an unfairly negative argument, Dublin bikes proves that it's possible to have a bike in the city. I agree, vandalism and thefty happens, but it doesn't meAn you can't safely keep a bike in dublin. I do it,and many others do, and better fgeneral facilities and critical mass reduce the risk over time.

If the current setup is good enough, then why are such facilities used so little?

Current setup isnt perfect, but It's more thn just lack of storage facilities IMO. It's the whole attitude to cycling in ireland, things are changing slowly but it's not fair to say the poor facilities are the only reason for low cycling numbers in Ireland

monument

Same boxes as well as sheltered U stands at Dundrum Luas stop.

Pic on Dublin Cycling Campaign's Facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151023738310052&set=pu.186031000051&type=1&theater

Oasis_Dublin

I know a friend who had his bike taken, bar his front wheel, from above Balally Luas stop near Dundrum. I'm not sure if people have enough trust in the Irish public for systems like this to work, unfortunately.

monument

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

I know a friend who had his bike taken, bar his front wheel, from above Balally Luas stop near Dundrum. I'm not sure if people have enough trust in the Irish public for systems like this to work, unfortunately.

Could be wrong but..

That sounds a lot like a classic case of only locking the front wheel to a solid object.

bk

monument wrote: »

Same boxes as well as sheltered U stands at Dundrum Luas stop.

Brilliant, that is exactly what I was thinking would be the best scenario. Large number of free sheltered Sheffield stands and a smaller number of the lockers for more expensive bikes. Best of both worlds.

Hopefully they roll this out to all stations soon.

irlrobins

bk wrote: »

Hopefully they roll this out to all stations soon.

This site has some more info on the bike lockers at Luas stop and train stations: www.bikelocker.ie