Lighting at Junctions

veryangryman

Anyone notice how once the bulbs go out on these that they are not replaced?

Is there anything built into a contract for the roads design to keep them all maintained. Its not such a big deal now but i do notice a few that are out at present. Do they wait until its a big problem before replacing or something?

NFD100

veryangryman wrote: »

Anyone notice how once the bulbs go out on these that they are not replaced?

Is there anything built into a contract for the roads design to keep them all maintained. Its not such a big deal now but i do notice a few that are out at present. Do they wait until its a big problem before replacing or something?

I agree, particularly bad on M1 in Fingal Co. Co's bit, especially Junctions 4 and 5. They seem to have given up maintaining that road completely.

Pete_Cavan

I am not sure about PPPs but there is nothing about lighting maintenence in standard road building contracts. I was speaking to a guy who installs public lighting (he has the contract to sell Siemens lighting products in Ireland) about six months ago and he said that councils have problems with ESB because public lighting is an unmetered supply, cant remember exactly what the issue is but one side (or possibly both) feel they are getting ****ed over by this arrangement. He also said that lighting at junctions on motorways here are over spec'ed compared to European norms and that there is no need for that much light.

AFAIK a lot of the luminaires in this country dont conform with EU regulation wrt energy consumption (maybe they have to be LEDs) but I am sure if that applies only to new lanterns installed going forward or if it is retrospective and all existing lanterns have to be replaced - I doubt its the latter.

L1011

The ESB haven't done the bulk of street lighting in some time, its Airtricity: http://www.airtricity.com/ie/home/about-us/utility-solutions/

They sold this division to Airtricity to make the figures of what % of power was supplied by them look lower.

BrianD

I remember that in the late 80's/early 90s that large stretches of street lighting was switched off of bypasses for cost reasons - the Blanch by-pass being one. It would be great to see more stretches of public lighting on some dual carriageways and m-ways.

Also, is lighting at m-way junctions necessary or should less intensive lighting be used?

galwayrush

MYOB wrote: »

The ESB haven't done the bulk of street lighting in some time, its Airtricity: http://www.airtricity.com/ie/home/about-us/utility-solutions/

They sold this division to Airtricity to make the figures of what % of power was supplied by them look lower.

Airtricity have lost the contract for most of Connacht to Electric Skyline.

Pete_Cavan

MYOB wrote: »

The ESB haven't done the bulk of street lighting in some time, its Airtricity: http://www.airtricity.com/ie/home/about-us/utility-solutions/

They sold this division to Airtricity to make the figures of what % of power was supplied by them look lower.

I was referring to supply of electricity, not installation of the lighting.

L1011

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

I was referring to supply of electricity, not installation of the lighting.

I'm pretty certain that the power for the Airticity installed/maintained ones is supplied by Airtricity, the sale of the unit being specifically stated as being to (artificially) adjust the figures of how much power was being sold by non-ESB firms.

Pete_Cavan

MYOB wrote: »

I'm pretty certain that the power for the Airticity installed/maintained ones is supplied by Airtricity, the sale of the unit being specifically stated as being to (artificially) adjust the figures of how much power was being sold by non-ESB firms.

Mystery solved, up to May 2009, ESB was the only supplier licensed to supply electricity to County Councils. Companies with authorisation from the CER now can, not necessarily Airticity. More justification for allowing private companies compete in the residential energy market imo.

Wild Bill

I think the PPP folk look after lighting on their stretches of road (such as the M50). The results in these cases are very good.

On the other hand on non-PPP stretches such as the Naas Road it is the local authorities who are sub-contracted by the NRA; thus the crap lighting maintenance of the lighting on the South County Dublin section of the N7.

The standard has improved hugely compared to 10 years ago but is still far short of European norms.

In the UK for instance less than 1% of streetlights will be out of action at any given time; ditto most of Western Europe.

In Ireland it varies between Local Authorities there appears to be no rolling daily target; up to 30% go out of action in some places until there is a replacement programme.

The idea of immediate replacement seems not to exist outside some of the PPPs road schemes.

Zoney

They seem to get replaced if you report the specific lamppost. I think the issue is probably that there is little pro-active checking for failed streetlamps. If there is it must be even less frequently than annually, especially outside urban areas. Hard to know whether any pro-active checking goes on at all, because in urban areas replacements could just be due to local residents complaining.

By the way, this principle extends to a lot of things in Ireland. It's annoying that one has to do it, but there are many things that do get acted on if you simply make some noise to the relevant authority (rather than just boards).

ardmacha

Local authorities need to get their act together re systematic inspection. And not just have different inspectors for street lights and road signs etc but someone who records all of these things.

Some layouts are a bit wasteful, for instance here on the M1, half of this standard is lighting a field.

Wild Bill

ardmacha wrote: »

Some layouts are a bit wasteful, for instance here on the M1, half of this standard is lighting a field.

Not sure. I think those tower lights are aimed.

Empire o de Sun

I've been living in Germany a while now, and none of the motorways are lit, none, not where I live, and I've yet to see one with one, and I driven acrossa fair bit if Germany. I said to someone in wok that ours have lighting, and he thought that that was mad and very expensive.

Wild Bill

Empire o de Sun wrote: »

I've been living in Germany a while now, and none of the motorways are lit, none, not where I live, and I've yet to see one with one, and I driven acrossa fair bit if Germany. I said to someone in wok that ours have lighting, and he thought that that was mad and very expensive.

You'll find the views of Germans are not as respected in these here parts as they used to be

They tend to think anything they do is logical and anything they don't do is mad.

There is a name for that condition - it starts with an "A" :mad:

ardmacha

Well the Belgians light every motorway (not just junctions).

So it is not just the weird Irish.

Wild Bill

There is extensive lighting on many British motorways and lightening at junctions in numerous countries.

L1011

The UK lights more mainlines than we do. We've mostly only lit junctions and our few D3 mainlines for the most part.

Obviously most of the lit UK ones are D3, but that's because their entire network is mostly D3.

ardmacha

Even Sri Lanka lights its junctions......

Empire o de Sun

Wild Bill wrote: »

You'll find the views of Germans are not as respected in these here parts as they used to be

They tend to think anything they do is logical and anything they don't do is mad.

There is a name for that condition - it starts with an "A" :mad:

What have you got against the Geman people or "the Germans" as you say. You may not agree with what the German Government is doing or not doing, but that doesn't mean you have to paint everyone in a nation with the same brush.

Getting back to lighting on Motorways. I prefer that junctions are lit but not over the top lighting as shown on the M1 example above. Mainlines in my opinion do not need to be lit. I think belgium is over the top.

Amtmann

Wild Bill wrote: »

You'll find the views of Germans are not as respected in these here parts as they used to be

They tend to think anything they do is logical and anything they don't do is mad.

There is a name for that condition - it starts with an "A" :mad:

That's a bigoted comment and it's unwelcome on the forum.

KevR

Urban DCs definitely need to be fully lit. I saw a guy wearing dark clothes walking in the median strip on the Athlone Bypass on Sunday night.

Totally crazy on his part but not illegal.

It's a fairly busy urban DC that is used by pedestrians and cyclists so it should be fully lit in my opinion.

Wild Bill

Tremelo wrote: »

That's a bigoted comment and it's unwelcome on the forum.

Maybe I should have restricted my comment to the German who thought the Irish putting lights on motorways were mad?

Any perceived anti Germans-in-general comments are withdrawn. Some of my best friends are Germans. :cool:

whyulittle

Couple of lads in a cherry-picker changing lights at J8 on the Athlone BP today.

HonalD

Empire o de Sun wrote: »

I've been living in Germany a while now, and none of the motorways are lit, none, not where I live, and I've yet to see one with one, and I driven acrossa fair bit if Germany. I said to someone in wok that ours have lighting, and he thought that that was mad and very expensive.

I agree - the cost of providing electricity to public lights on roads is a cost which we could do with saving.

Is there any reason to light roads between junctions or is it just the done thing. I can see a warrant for junction lighting but not along straight inter-urban roads.

Wild Bill

HonalD wrote: »

I agree - the cost of providing electricity to public lights on roads is a cost which we could do with saving.

Is there any reason to light roads between junctions or is it just the done thing. I can see a warrant for junction lighting but not along straight inter-urban roads.

I'd go with the 90% of Roads Authorities who consider this a worthwhile measure.

In Germany they have no speed limits on certain roads either - now that is something we should copy :cool:

Those light-less, limitless German roads are reflected in the fatal accident stats, btw.

But safety is for sissies.

Carawaystick

Wild Bill wrote: »

I'd go with the 90% of Roads Authorities who consider this a worthwhile measure.

In Germany they have no speed limits on certain roads either - now that is something we should copy :cool:

Those light-less, limitless German roads are reflected in the fatal accident stats, btw.

But safety is for sissies.

Autobahnen have lower quality (n general) junctions tan the ones here, they have poor lineage and no cateyes; It's hairy enough driving on an empty Autobahn at night.