No attendant at M6 toll Dublin-bound

Cringer

Today I travelled from Galway to Dublin and upon hitting the first toll of €1.80 I had a two euro coin. To my surprise there were no booths available with the yellow attendant sign.

This irked me as I had to use the exact coins lane, along with plenty others, who I am sure there were a few who also tossed in the two euro coin.

I don't travel that leg often and wondered if this was a common occurrence of a Sunday whilst the roads may appear quieter or indeed a swap over in shift where adequate cover wasn't provided.

Realistically I would probably have pulled into a lane with X on the signs and got out to find someone if I had to break a note but this didn't happen at this time. It may have happened to others.

Anyone else experience this and is the onus on me to ensure I have the exact change and if I don't I have to give them more than what I should do? What if I only had notes?

Victor

Generally there is no obligation anywhere to give change, although it is useful if you want the customers to come back.

Keith in cork

The two toll bridges i use almost weekly on the cork dublin route, the "correct change only" machine actually drops out change. We frequestly pop the hand in the slot once we've paid, and hey presto, enough coin to pay the next toll.

Obviously the toll isn't alot, but on a return trip to dublin, we pass the toll bridges 4 times. Should i be going to my family home, add to this 2 more. Theres only so much change a guy can keep in the car at one time. Usually its just whatever coins are in my pocket as i like to keep a clean interior.

The 3rd week of august i made return trips to dublin 6times in 7days. Oh, and i'm not a driver for business so it all mounts up.

BrianD

Surely there is a service level agreement that there must be one manned booth? What if I arrived with a €20 note?

Keith in cork

BrianD wrote: »

Surely there is a service level agreement that there must be one manned booth? What if I arrived with a €20 note?

Its probably written somewhere that it should be manned. But i'd imagine its also written that its our duty to have change on us.

InchicoreDude

I have driven through this toll many times, and have never seen it unmanned. So I dont think it is a usual occurrence. Maybe it was manned but the light was off.....

Lapin

Victor wrote: »

Generally there is no obligation anywhere to give change, although it is useful if you want the customers to come back.

I thought it was illegal to charge above the advertised rate for goods and services ?

markpb

Lapin wrote: »

I thought it was illegal to charge above the advertised rate for goods and services ?

It's not legally required for merchants to provide change - it's a convenience they offer.

Tarabuses

markpb wrote: »

It's not legally required for merchants to provide change - it's a convenience they offer.

Where did you pick up that idea?

Papa_Lazarou

Tarabuses wrote: »

Where did you pick up that idea?

He's actually correct. Merchants such as these booths or say even corner shops/supermarkets have no legal obligation to provide change to customers. In theory it's your duty to have the correct amount for the service you use. Not many places would last very long though if they didn't provide it

ThisRegard

Been through it fairly often on a Sunday evening and never saw it unmanned either. However I've often seen people drive right up to the barrier in the far left booth, the tag only without having an actual tag and hold up the queue behind them while they sit there and beep like idiots for someone to come help them.

Cringer

So it seems like it was a once off - I should have taken a photo to show you all but none the less I had a passenger who also confirmed it.

Thanks for the feedback all.

L1011

Phone the M6 concessionaire, they're generally very good to deal with on the phone. If they can't explain it, off to the NRA as I'm pretty certain there's an SLA for mainline tolls.

Some junction (as opposed to mainline) tolls - e.g. Enfield N4 - are NEVER manned under normal circumstances. They'll be manned solely in case of something like a major GAA match or the like happening locally.

flazio

ThisRegard wrote: »

Been through it fairly often on a Sunday evening and never saw it unmanned either. However I've often seen people drive right up to the barrier in the far left booth, the tag only without having an actual tag and hold up the queue behind them while they sit there and beep like idiots for someone to come help them.

That's the M4 booth, the M6 tag lanes are on the right before you reach the boothes.
I'm not calling you a liar but I can't imagine that N6 company left the Toll gate unmanned as this would mean that HGVs couldn't get past. The gate to the extreme left is always manned whenever I'm going through as this has a secondary barrier for any wide load vehicles. Had any truck been unable to get through, there would have been uproar among hauliers.

L1011

flazio wrote: »

That's the M4 booth, the M6 tag lanes are on the right before you reach the boothes.
I'm not calling you a liar but I can't imagine that N6 company left the Toll gate unmanned as this would mean that HGVs couldn't get past. The gate to the extreme left is always manned whenever I'm going through as this has a secondary barrier for any wide load vehicles. Had any truck been unable to get through, there would have been uproar among hauliers.

M4 Enfield as stated is permanently unmanned, HGV drivers have to get out and throw the requisite coins in or use plastic, or a tag.

However, I'm not even sure if the HGV lanes on the M6 have baskets/readers for unmanned use so your point does stand.

channelsurfer2

MYOB wrote: »

Phone the M6 concessionaire, they're generally very good to deal with on the phone. If they can't explain it, off to the NRA as I'm pretty certain there's an SLA for mainline tolls.

Some junction (as opposed to mainline) tolls - e.g. Enfield N4 - are NEVER manned under normal circumstances. They'll be manned solely in case of something like a major GAA match or the like happening locally.

no point in ringing the NRA... I rang and emailed over a year ago to ask why Laser Cards are not taken and I havent even got a reply yet.

ThisRegard

flazio wrote: »

That's the M4 booth, the M6 tag lanes are on the right before you reach the boothes.
I'm not calling you a liar but I can't imagine that N6 company left the Toll gate unmanned as this would mean that HGVs couldn't get past. The gate to the extreme left is always manned whenever I'm going through as this has a secondary barrier for any wide load vehicles. Had any truck been unable to get through, there would have been uproar among hauliers.

No, my bad, I'm mixing up the M4/M6. However as MYOB says far left lane is unmanned, it's the second of the two tag only lanes, the other being the far right. Take a look here at the road markings, I usually zip through this lane when I have stuff on the roof.
http://maps.google.ie/maps?q=m4+enfield&hl=en&ll=53.410785,-6.738138&spn=0.009017,0.022724&sll=53.401034,-8.307638&sspn=9.243361,23.269043&vpsrc=6&hnear=M4,+Enfield,+County+Meath&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=53.410853,-6.741194&panoid=aF8MLSoBj0pprdYs9THgEw&cbp=12,94.29,,0,-0.93

stoneill

I threw the correct change at the basket, missed a bit, and half of it went all over the road but the barrier still opened.
Got me thinking that maybe you don't need the total amount but just a few coins to get the barrier opened.

Cookie_Monster

channelsurfer2 wrote: »

no point in ringing the NRA... I rang and emailed over a year ago to ask why Laser Cards are not taken and I havent even got a reply yet.

because fees for laser cards are scandalously high for merchants so it wouldn't be worth it for such small amounts.

The exact same reason the banks have little interest in Visa debit, they make to much money out of Laser

bk

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

The exact same reason the banks have little interest in Visa debit, they make to much money out of Laser

AIB and BOI are both moving to Visa Debit in 2012.

Not only that but it will be the contacless, wave to pay, type of Visa Debit card.

ThisRegard

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

The exact same reason the banks have little interest in Visa debit, they make to much money out of Laser

Banks are actually now moving away from laser and replacing them with visa debit, soon enough there'll be no laser any more, they'll all be visa debit cards. Permanent TSB, BOI and AIB are already well into the process of it, TSB I think are ahead of the other 2 in the process.

Solair

ThisRegard wrote: »

Banks are actually now moving away from laser and replacing them with visa debit, soon enough there'll be no laser any more, they'll all be visa debit cards. Permanent TSB, BOI and AIB are already well into the process of it, TSB I think are ahead of the other 2 in the process.

Ulster Bank and Permanent TSB no longer issue Laser Card. It's Visa Debit only.

AIB and Bank of Ireland are due to roll out Visa Debit in 2012. The switchover of their internal systems has already begun and they are definitely going to have contact-less payments from the word go.

I've already seen a few retail pin-pads with contact-less readers and AIB branding.

markpb

ThisRegard wrote: »

Banks are actually now moving away from laser and replacing them with visa debit, soon enough there'll be no laser any more, they'll all be visa debit cards. Permanent TSB, BOI and AIB are already well into the process of it, TSB I think are ahead of the other 2 in the process.

Helped in no small way by the EU Payment Services directive forcing banks to make their national-only payment cards pan-European or lose them.

Cookie_Monster

bk wrote: »

AIB and BOI are both moving to Visa Debit in 2012.

Not only that but it will be the contacless, wave to pay, type of Visa Debit card.

ThisRegard wrote: »

Banks are actually now moving away from laser and replacing them with visa debit, soon enough there'll be no laser any more, they'll all be visa debit cards. Permanent TSB, BOI and AIB are already well into the process of it, TSB I think are ahead of the other 2 in the process.

Yes I do know that, eventually. 10 years after everywhere else though. I was in a business meeting with AIBMS a few months ago and they said that fees were the stumbling block and why it's not already in. The banks want laser fee levels, Visa are having none of it and that's why it's dragged on and on and on and on...

L1011

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

because fees for laser cards are scandalously high for merchants so it wouldn't be worth it for such small amounts.

On the other angle, they're tiny, which is why for shopping which is generally large amounts, Lidl/Aldi took them only at the start and never credit cards.

Flat fee cuts both ways.

Solair

Well, the banks can also go with MasterCard debit. So, visa could yet be told to take a hike. The cards are identical in terms of functionality.

It's a pity there isn't a 3rd major "transaction card" brand though.

Visa and MasterCard swallowed up the viable competitors and have basically turned into a duopoly.

EuroCard was a viable competitor at one stage.

American Express is the only alternative brand really and it's not in the debit card market here.

There's also JCB (Japan Credit Bureau) and Discover, but again they don't exist in this market.

Carawaystick

Victor wrote: »

Generally there is no obligation anywhere to give change, although it is useful if you want the customers to come back.

If you go to a shop, there's no obligation to pay either vic.
what should the op do, U turn on the same carriage way?

Maybe the toll road operators should display clearly the prices and methods of payment available at the point of entry...