Should Europa League winner earn Champions League berth?

legendary.xix

I've always felt it'd be a good move for the UEFA Cup, now Europa League, to allow the winner qualify for the Champions League.

It would surely give a huge carrot to go on and win the competition. Spurs for example who might not, but could I know, finish in the top 4 across the water, would surely treat the competition better if it provided a path to the Champions League for the winner.

It'd be an incentive to win Cups as well. We've had the FAI Cup final last week. The FA Cup early rounds are being played around now. Winning the cups would have the incentive of the getting to the Europa League where winning could produce a path to the Champions League that some might not earn through the league.

KevIRL

yes. makes perfect sense seeing as they have actually won a European trophy and teams in some leagues qualify by coming 4th in their leagues

dan1895

At least they would be a team that were Champions of something unlike a lot of whats competing in it at the moment.

dahat

Probably what that competition needs to spice it up..

Cameron Poe

Who goes in it when the FA cup winners have already qualified as has happened almost every year?

dsmythy

My kneejerk reaction was no. But now that i've thought about it, it would be a good idea. The only negative slant you could put on it is perhaps is that rather than the Europa League trophy itself being more valuable, it's the Champions League place that remains the prize.

dsmythy

Cameron Poe wrote: »

Who goes in it when the FA cup winners have already qualified as has happened almost every year?

Runners up I think. If it can't be them then the next in line in the league.

It will would make the Europa Cup a much more appealing comp.

It should be considered.

everdead.ie

I really think they should straight into the group stages too. It makes perfect sense and would add a lot more to the competition.

Diabhal Beag

I guess UEFA feel that a Shaktar/Porto level side will win it anyways so they don't think it's worth offering a place when they are already automatically qualified by winning their League. Still it should be on offer for say a team like Fulham that reaches a final at the very least.

legendary.xix

dsmythy wrote: »

My kneejerk reaction was no. But now that i've thought about it, it would be a good idea. The only negative slant you could put on it is perhaps is that rather than the Europa League trophy itself being more valuable, it's the Champions League place that remains the prize.

Both would go hand in hand really like winning a domestic cup and qualifying for Europe.

legendary.xix

Diabhal Beag wrote: »

I guess UEFA feel that a Shaktar/Porto level side will win it anyways so they don't think it's worth offering a place when they are already automatically qualified by winning their League. Still it should be on offer for say a team like Fulham that reaches a final at the very least.

Shaktar had to qualify for the Champions League the season after. They go through but if they hadn't they could've would up playing the UEFA Super Cup with it having been their last European game of that season. I'd suggest with Europa League winner getting an automatic berth in the Champions League that the Super Cup challengers could not be drawn in the same group as well.

Looking at the list of current automatic CL qualifiers, I'd suggest in place of the 17th placed league champion with that country being put in the play-off round.

citytillidie

Never happen will be a logical nightmare for UEFA when a team wins the Europa League, finishes outside the Champions league positions for that league.

homolumo

Defo, should have happened by now.

gnfnrhead

It seems like a good idea but I have a problem with it.

What happens if (lets say) Man United drop out of the CL and end up winning the Europa League AND win the Premier League? Thats two spots for one team. Europa League runners up? Fifth place in England? Another country altogether? Who gets the other spot in the CL?

Deciding a fair manner for things like that I think will be the hardest part. The idea is a good one but it has a decent amount of kinks to be ironed out before it's worthwhile looking at.

super_furry

Both finalists should.

legendary.xix

citytillidie wrote: »

Never happen will be a logical nightmare for UEFA when a team wins the Europa League, finishes outside the Champions league positions for that league.

There is a way UEFA could deal with it like they did with Liverpool. I know they've a rule at the moment a country can only have 4 clubs in the champions league. Should a CL winner finish outside the top 4, the 4th team will miss out.

I'd suggest if a CL and or EL winner are outside the top 4 places, allow the CL and/or EL winner their place in the group stage but their coefficient points be treated as a neutral country and no country protection. It would be the easiest solution if UEFA don't want more than 4 clubs accumulating coefficient points for one country through the CL. It can be done.

stovelid

It would make big clubs take it seriously but then again that would make it harder for the smaller clubs to win it as a result.

Fowler87

Cant see a reason why it shouldnt happen especially considering as the 3rd placed of each CL group drops into the europa anyhow

citytillidie

legendary.xix wrote: »

There is a way UEFA could deal with it like they did with Liverpool. I know they've a rule at the moment a country can only have 4 clubs in the champions league. Should a CL winner finish outside the top 4, the 4th team will miss out.

I'd suggest if a CL and or EL winner are outside the top 4 places, allow the CL and/or EL winner their place in the group stage but their coefficient points be treated as a neutral country and no country protection. It would be the easiest solution if UEFA don't want more than 4 clubs accumulating coefficient points for one country through the CL. It can be done.

They said that that will not happen again after Liverpool

legendary.xix

citytillidie wrote: »

They said that that will not happen again after Liverpool

The reason for that is that they've set it out that no country can have more that 4. If the CL winner is outside the top 4, the 4th placed team will miss out.

That's how it stands at the moment but it doesn't mean it cannot change if the will or lobbying took place. A subtle move to enhance the Europa League is qualification for the Champions League group stage. If a country were to get a 5th or 6th team in as a result, treat them as a neutral country as was done with Liverpool. Though they didn't want it, it has set a precedent on what could be done.

stovelid wrote: »

It would make big clubs take it seriously but then again that would make it harder for the smaller clubs to win it as a result.

Sport and football should not be easy. I would suggest however for UEFA to bring back a revamped Intertoto Cup. It wouldn't require a whole lot to bring it about. Something like 20 league champions don't have the Europa League safety net. Shamrock Rovers got it this year getting by the Estonian champions. Bohemians missed out last year when beaten by TNS. The 20 league champions I mentioned along with the Europa League play-off losers should enter a UEFA Intertoto Cup as a straight knock-out over two legs play-off. UEFA has had three competitions running simultaneously in the past with one at least being all knock out.

Something like 37 clubs are defeated at the EL play-off stage. Adding in 20 league champions gives 57. If the EL was giving a path to the Champions League, I don't think Fair Play teams should be entering the EL. I'd suggest the top 8 fair play leagues enter a team into a UEFA Fair Play Cup. It'd only need 3 knock-out rounds with the two-legged final played on the same week and CL/EL play-offs. The fair play cup winner would enter the Intertoto Cup as well.

If anyone is still with me so far, you're looking at 58 clubs in a straight knock-out competition. 6 wildcards could be added to make 64 e.g. the 6 highest ranked clubs knocked out before the EL play-offs. 64 clubs playing 3 knock-out games before Christmas would see 1) 64 -> 32, 2) 32 -> 16, 3) 16 -> 8. The best 8 of 12 EL third placed teams could join the UEFA Intertoto Cup round of 16 after Christmas. Going on then to quarter-finals, semi-finals and a two-legged final as well.

The UEFA Intertoto Cup winner would earn a place in the Europa League group stage. The advantage of the Intertoto Cup like this is that it would give league champions from lower nations more european game experience. EL play-off losers would also have the chance to get european game experience. It'll give european football a straight knock-out competition which is missing from the calendar. There wouldn't be any coefficient points for this effectively third tier competition. Looking at recent years you could've looked at the like of Villa landing into the competition. While it might not appear high on their radar, if it was offering a path to the Europa League, which in turn was offering a path to the Champions League, I think it'd have been tough for the likes of them to be dismissive of it. The old UEFA Intertoto Cup used to see some big names entering during the summer looking for a path to the old UEFA Cup.

I think it'd be a good move forward for European football. It only require subtle changes for it to come about but a lot of lobbying. :cool:

legendary.xix

I have to raise this topic after this week. UEFA surely have to give the Europa League winner a champions league spot to give the competition more prestige?

YouTookMyName

How to spilt the TV money is the biggest problem and therefore a non runner.

stovelid

legendary.xix wrote: »

I have to raise this topic after this week. UEFA surely have to give the Europa League winner a champions league spot to give the competition more prestige?

The competition has prestige.

It's just that the overwhelming majority of people on the thread support the tiny majority of mega-clubs that view the competition as beneath them. Even the heartfelt pleas to award as CL spot to the winners are less about the integrity of the competition (and the clubs that routinely contest it) and more about providing an additional route into the 'only show in town' for supporters of he nearly-mega clubs: namely - on this forum - the English club that finishes 5th, no doubt.

jesus_thats_gre

Yes.

dfx-

No to the title question. The Europa League trophy is enough. If big names don't bother with it, then it's their own tough luck that they don't win it.

stovelid

Funny how much earnest - and of course no doubt well-meaning - discussion about restructuring the EL emanates from boards in the week that United and City bomb downwards into the competition.

aidan24326

Thing is the UEFA Cup in its former guise WAS a prestigious competition. So why did they go changing the name? Ok it's not a 'cup' competition anymore, but then neither is the Champions League. It's become too diluted with too many games.

But this season there's quite a few fairly big name clubs in it so I don't see why you wouldn't want to go and win it. When you see who's actually left in the Europa League it won't be easily won. But I think the name-change wss a poor effort. 'Europa League' makes it sound like little more than a big brother of the Intertoto Cup, when really the UEFA Cup used to be alot more than that.

Le King

The only way it will regain any prestge to bigger clubs if the CL actually becomes a tournament of league champions and everybody else gets to play in the Europa League.

But Uefa are never going to devalue the CL like that.

Dempsey

I dont think so, the chance to play the UCL champions for bragging rights is enough IMO.

I also think the 3rd place in the UCL getting a knockout spot in the UCL should be hooked. The group stages of the UCL would be a much fiercer contest without the financial safety net.

legendary.xix

I'd agree regards third placed teams entering the EL as a safety net. I don't agree with it. The EL group stages are competitive enough with the top two teams going through. The CL should be the same. Once the group stages start, that should be the end of any parachuting from one to the other. The EL could then expand to 64 but I would still suggest giving the winner a CL spot. Look at Stoke, if they were to somehow go on to win the EL, getting a CL spot would be a fantastic reward.

mike65

Could be the best way for Utd to get to play in the CL next season

losthorizon

aidan24326 wrote: »

Thing is the UEFA Cup in its former guise WAS a prestigious competition. So why did they go changing the name? Ok it's not a 'cup' competition anymore, but then neither is the Champions League. It's become too diluted with too many games.

But this season there's quite a few fairly big name clubs in it so I don't see why you wouldn't want to go and win it. When you see who's actually left in the Europa League it won't be easily won. But I think the name-change wss a poor effort. 'Europa League' makes it sound like little more than a big brother of the Intertoto Cup, when really the UEFA Cup used to be alot more than that.

It wasnt originally called the UEFA Cup either!