Woman jailed for sexual exploitation of teen

caseyann

A woman has been given a four-year prison sentence for the sexual exploitation of a 15 year old girl.


The schoolgirl was a friend of an acquaintance of Ms Thomas.
The Dublin Circuit Criminal Court heard that on at least six occasions the girl had sex with a 60-year-old man in his home or in Ms Thomas' home.

A 39-year-old woman has been given a four-year prison sentence for the sexual exploitation of a 15-year-old girl.
Ramilekun Thomas, originally from Nigeria but with an address in Fort Lawn Park in Blanchardstown, pleaded guilty to two counts of using a child for the purposes of sexual exploitation in May 2008.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/1107/thomasr.html

I dont know if in right place but if it isnt could mods move it please,as so many different angles of this the legal the moral and the political.


Ireland handed over 161 people to other EU member states on foot of EU arrest warrants last year, up from 69 people in 2009, according to a report released today.
of those surrendered, 87 were sent to Poland and 34 were sent to the UK.

Ireland received a total of 373 arrest warrants last year, including 15 for murder, attempted murder and manslaughter and 22 for sexual offences.
There were 30 arrest warrants issued for drugs offences.
Ireland issued 51 arrest warrants in 2010, of which 14 people were surrendered.
There were also 12 people handed over to the State from arrest warrants issued from 2004-2009.
Since 1 January 2004, 148 people have been surrendered to the State.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/1104/crime.html


Ireland i feel needs to take action now.The laws need to be brought in world wide finger printing and records available at the flip of a switch so we know is getting in and out of Ireland.
Ireland needs to start protecting their borders.
Just with the first article above she should be deported and forced to do her jail sentence in Nigeria and banned for life from Ireland and put on permanent record all over world.
Its only going to get worse unless some laws are brought in and changed.
And all this oh but they have an EU citizenship or Irish passport it should be revoked immediately.

jblack

The crime was committed in this country so are you suggesting we deport offenders before they are tried/jailed here?

caseyann

jblack wrote: »

The crime was committed in this country so are you suggesting we deport offenders before they are tried/jailed here?

No i suggest they are given the trial here to be proven guilty or not,and then removed from the country as they should no longer be obliged to remain in the country.They when returned to their perspective country be jailed the term they recieved here.Not jailed here and then free to get fed and free room and board then receive money here and free to remain in Ireland after.

How many years would she do here and how hard would it be for her in womans prison.I doubt hardly any time at all and will do it standing on her head.
And yes i do agree with the latter to Irish being deported back to Ireland when they commit crimes even if they have a citizenship of the country they are in,unless ofc fines or the likes or have children in said country with a citizen of that country.If however proven dead beat dad or mom then removed respectively also.

jblack

I will put aside a large number of issues I have with your comments and offer this:

If it was available to a judiciary system to try and convict a person who, despite being a full citizen of that country and protected by national and European law, happened to "come from" another country and then have them serve their custodial sentence elsewhere, what do you think would happen?

In a similar vein would you allow Irish citizens be deported back to Ireland on the strength of a conviction from another country? Our jail system could not cope.

Would it be right that a man is convicted of beating a woman in Ireland who had exposed shoulders be then sent home to a hero's welcome in a strict regime country. Likewise should a person who stole food in Ireland be sent somewhere else by virtue of their birth to have their hands cut off?

Reloc8

I think your losing sight of the amount of homegrown sickos we have OP

caseyann

Reloc8 wrote: »

I think your losing sight of the amount of homegrown sickos we have OP

No i have full sight of them thanks.Just means more room for them when we get rid of non home grown ones.

Zambia

On a weekend can we bill Ireland for locking up Irish nationals in Melbourne?

MrJoeSoap

caseyann wrote: »

No i have full sight of them thanks.Just means more room for them when we get rid of non home grown ones.

Have you done the maths on it? The number of people we deport for committing crimes minus the number of people deported back here for committing crimes abroad is ___ ?

Reloc8

caseyann wrote: »

No i have full sight of them thanks.Just means more room for them when we get rid of non home grown ones.

So to be clear, you're differentiating between people based on nationality.

caseyann

MrJoeSoap wrote: »

Have you done the maths on it? The number of people we deport for committing crimes minus the number of people deported back here for committing crimes abroad is ___ ?

We are talking crimes that endanger others and have gone to the extremes.
Show me the figures for other countries of Irish crimes and then we can talk about Irish in other countries.
This is about the growing crime rate among non Irish and in Ireland and also the amount of criminals who are getting in here,they are only the figures which the garda actually know of.

Reloc8 wrote: »

So to be clear, you're differentiating between people based on nationality.

No you would be reading that into it because that is what you want to see.
I differentiate between those who are born here and commit crimes here who can not and do not change their names and disappear under the radar to another county to those who come in already with warrants and if not guilty would not have absconded said country in first place.Also those there is no record of their past anywhere and not likely to know what or who they are from their own countries.
I will keep saying i dont care if not Irish then they should be thrown out when they commit crimes such as the one above robbery or murder or abuse of children rape etc..

caseyann

Zambia wrote: »

On a weekend can we bill Ireland for locking up Irish nationals in Melbourne?

What the hell has that got to do with the thread.This is about Ireland if you want to moan about Irish abroad make your own thread.:) thanks

caseyann

jblack wrote: »

I will put aside a large number of issues I have with your comments and offer this:

If it was available to a judiciary system to try and convict a person who, despite being a full citizen of that country and protected by national and European law, happened to "come from" another country and then have them serve their custodial sentence elsewhere, what do you think would happen?

In a similar vein would you allow Irish citizens be deported back to Ireland on the strength of a conviction from another country? Our jail system could not cope.

Would it be right that a man is convicted of beating a woman in Ireland who had exposed shoulders be then sent home to a hero's welcome in a strict regime country. Likewise should a person who stole food in Ireland be sent somewhere else by virtue of their birth to have their hands cut off?

Might make them think twice about stealing in Ireland if the conviction was to be sent home.And i hardly think you can eqaute bread stealing in arab countries with what that so called woman (mother of three did to a 15 year old kid)
So if you have really no proper input,or you want to debate how would be made possible and laws brought in to protect our borders from heightened criminals arriving so easy.Then carry on.But if you tried to come here to try make me have some sympathy and care what happens to the likes of these people.You are barking so far up the wrong tree you have fallen out of the tree.:)

And on another note her children should be removed from her and never given back.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/courts/motherofthree-who-sent-schoolgirl-for-sex-with-man-64-is-jailed-for-six-years-2927897.html

The man involved in the transaction took his own life three days after gardai began investigating the allegations.

Nigerian-born Thomas pleaded guilty to two charges of using a child for the purposes of sexual exploitation at two locations in Dublin on dates between May 1 and 31, 2008.

The Dublin Circuit Criminal Court heard the man paid €50 to the girl for full intercourse on at least six occasions at his home and at another location.

Thomas took this money from the teenager each time, only giving €10 back to her on one occasion.

On another occasion the man paid €100, which Thomas took from the victim in full.

Kenneth C Fogarty, defending, said his client was a Nigerian national who was now living legally in the State and had three children who were born here. He said she had come here in 2000 and held down a number of jobs -- but from 2005 onwards she developed an addiction to cocaine and crack cocaine .

She began to perform sexual acts for money to "feed her habit".

Speaking directly to Judge Patrick McCartan, Thomas said she was sorry and pleaded for mercy.

She said: "I'm sorry for everything I've caused.

"I'm trying to fix my habit. I'm sorry for the shame I have caused the family of the victim."

After initially pleading guilty earlier this year, Thomas tried to change her plea last May but her application to do so was rejected.

The court heard that the victim came from a stable family.

Tried to change her plea aswell (how sorry she sounds)

jblack

caseyann wrote: »

So if you have really no proper input,or you want to debate how would be made possible and laws brought in to protect our borders from heightened criminals arriving so easy.

That doesn't make any sense.

Then carry on.But if you tried to come here to try make me have some sympathy and care what happens to the likes of these people.You are barking so far up the wrong tree you have fallen out of the tree.:)

I'm not interested in procuring your sympathy for "these people" I'm trying to show you how deeply flawed and impractical your suggestion of deporting criminals is.
However given the tone of your comments and your insulting remark to myself I feel trying to have a bit of debate about this (which BTW is one of the many reasons to use Boards) is a pointless exercise.

Zambia

caseyann wrote: »

What the hell has that got to do with the thread.This is about Ireland if you want to moan about Irish abroad make your own thread.:) thanks

The point was made you want other countrys to imprison their nationals for Irish crimes. So why can not the agreement go both ways?

caseyann

Zambia wrote: »

The point was made you want other countrys to imprison their nationals for Irish crimes. So why can not the agreement go both ways?

Ofc it can as you can see from my post above,Irish who commit such crimes sent back and banned from that country also.Works both ways.
But the main point needed is fingerprinting and dna available for all of these criminals especially the likes of robbery molestation and rapes or attempted murder etc..
Surely in this day and age they should have adequate systems in place in airports.And if they arent on the system then they are ok.
I read the new thing they are bringing in in Ireland,the card with all your information on it driver licence or something.Why cant they have that and there fore one swipe searches all systems for criminal past and warrants before they even come into the country.

Hippo

With the greatest respect this reads like an AH thread. Can it be moved?

schemingbohemia

caseyann wrote: »

Ofc it can as you can see from my post above,Irish who commit such crimes sent back and banned from that country also.Works both ways.
But the main point needed is fingerprinting and dna available for all of these criminals especially the likes of robbery molestation and rapes or attempted murder etc..
Surely in this day and age they should have adequate systems in place in airports.And if they arent on the system then they are ok.
I read the new thing they are bringing in in Ireland,the card with all your information on it driver licence or something.Why cant they have that and there fore one swipe searches all systems for criminal past and warrants before they even come into the country.

There is no evidence at all that the woman in this case committed any crimes before coming to reside in this State. So your proposal falls down there and gets to the nitty-gritty of your post which is don't let "them" in.

caseyann

schemingbohemia wrote: »

There is no evidence at all that the woman in this case committed any crimes before coming to reside in this State. So your proposal falls down there and gets to the nitty-gritty of your post which is don't let "them" in.

If you had bothered to read any of the posts you would see what i was referring to was the amount of warrants for non Irish who are murderers rapists etc..
I never even so much as hinted she had previous convictions or warrants,and i said she should be out on her ear for what she has done. Unfortunately she is legal here now so she is protected and can stay.
So go find another thread to try derail,with your witch hunt.:rolleyes:
If i wanted to say dont let them in i would say it, i am not a chicken and getting banned from a site wouldnt stop me either.:rolleyes:

schemingbohemia

caseyann wrote: »

If you had bothered to read any of the posts you would see what i was referring to was the amount of warrants for non Irish who are murderers rapists etc..So why use the heading you did?
I never even so much as hinted she had previous convictions or warrants,and i said she should be out on her ear for what she has done. So every foreigner should be deported for committing a crime? Even if they no longer have links to their home country, a country they may have fled due to persecution for religious beliefs/sexuality/torture? Where in those cases should they be deported to?
Unfortunately she is legal here now so she is protected and can stay.
So go find another thread to try derail,with your witch hunt.:rolleyes: Is it a witch hunt to ask a few questions?
If i wanted to say dont let them in i would say it, i am not a chicken and getting banned from a site wouldnt stop me either.:rolleyes:

What if they were a former "foreigner" with Irish Citizenship? Should citizenship be removed from them if they commit a crime? Have you never seen the passport checks at the airports? Ever noticed how it takes a lot longer for the non-EU lines to get through? If when the Garda scans the passport and it has been flagged for an outstanding warrant do you really think they're let in?

caseyann

schemingbohemia wrote: »

What if they were a former "foreigner" with Irish Citizenship? Should citizenship be removed from them if they commit a crime? Have you never seen the passport checks at the airports? Ever noticed how it takes a lot longer for the non-EU lines to get through? If when the Garda scans the passport and it has been flagged for an outstanding warrant do you really think they're let in?

Why should they be given the privilege of having Irish citizenship after committing such crimes as above?They should be yes removed of Irish citizenship in disgusting crimes as i said(if you think because they obtained a piece of paper does not mean they are obliged to have it once they break the law here.
As i said in previous posts depends on crime and a piece of paper shouldnt be binding as obviously they dont care about having it in first place.
And have you seen the report about how many already in Ireland and warrants out for their arrest(and how many were deported? Obviously you havent looked at the link i posted before.So no they cant be scanning passports and seeing warrants or previous convictions as you would like to believe.
So tell me how that many are recorded in Ireland and being deported under warrants? If they dont let them in?
Maybe if they had the threat of the citizenship being revoked and sent back to where they came from they might not be so quick to commit crimes,and or criminals who see Ireland as soft touch wouldnt bother coming in first place.

schemingbohemia

So people who obtain Irish citizenship should have that removed from them when they commit a crime? What level crime do you want to start at? Speeding?

Again where do you suggest they be deported to?

Presumably people who automatically have Irish citizenship shouldn't suffer the same fate? Why not?

jblack

caseyann wrote: »

Why should they be given the privilege of having Irish citizenship after committing such crimes as above?They should be yes removed of Irish citizenship in disgusting crimes as i said(if you think because they obtained a piece of paper does not mean they are obliged to have it once they break the law here.
As i said in previous posts depends on crime and a piece of paper shouldnt be binding as obviously they dont care about having it in first place.
And have you seen the report about how many already in Ireland and warrants out for their arrest(and how many were deported? Obviously you havent looked at the link i posted before.So no they cant be scanning passports and seeing warrants or previous convictions as you would like to believe.
So tell me how that many are recorded in Ireland and being deported under warrants? If they dont let them in?
Maybe if they had the threat of the citizenship being revoked and sent back to where they came from they might not be so quick to commit crimes,and or criminals who see Ireland as soft touch wouldnt bother coming in first place.

Missing the point yet again. If they are not Irish citizens they can be deported, refused entry etc. If they are Irish citizens of foreign origin then they will not.

Personally I would prefer the State to have the ability to revoke citizenship for persons with xenophobic and racists opinions but we can't all get what we want.

Ashashi

There are two flaws here:

1. The principle of Ne Bis In Idem or double jeopardy, if they are tried here and jailed here, they cannot be tried again. This only applies to EU countries as well, and sending people back would cause chaos in other legal systems and our own legal system

2. What would happen if we charged someone with procuring an abortion and sent them back to their home country where it is not a crime the principle of double criminality would be breached, that would not stand in the EU and you would cause major political problems between Ireland and that country. Your method is draconian and should not even be given a moment's thought.

Dandelion6

caseyann wrote: »

Unfortunately she is legal here now so she is protected and can stay.

I don't see where you're drawing the conclusion that she is "protected". Irish law allows the deportation of most foreign nationals who commit crimes. Whether the government chooses to exercise that power is another thing.

Personally I would rather have someone who sells a child for sex imprisoned here than deported and possibly not imprisoned in their home country and allowed to sell children there, but maybe you're not concerned with what happens to children in other countries.