I sold horse, now they wont pay, looking for VAT invoice etc..advice please

SRV

Hi ,

I sold a mare and foal to a couple. They paid deposit and I delivered the animals.
They were to pay end of mth when he got paid. That was 4 mths ago.


I asked for payment......they are playing games now saying


provide us with copy of the contract.

Also provide us with a VAT invoice a full statement and a bank account details.

We can not pay without any of the previously requested details.




Our contract would be verbal.

Whats the story with VAT on selling a Pony from my non vat registered farm to a non vat registered person.?

How would I deal with this VAT invoice easily? I can then give them the invoice and the bank account.

But i know they are chancing their arm and likely will not pay, but i might take them to court after issuing them with their invoice.


thank you for any help.

headmaster

srv,
i'm guessing these guys don't live close by. How did you meet them, where did you meet them, did they ring you out of the blue? I'm asking all of this because there's a couple doing the rounds picking up stock like this for the past few months.

SRV

Headmaster,

No its not them...im sure of it. They are about 1 hr 20 minutes from me.

Not sure re the VAT on horse sales etc...and how to give them an invoice.

thanks

Esroh

Finally, there is a special rate of 4.8%, which applies principally to the sale of livestock (by VAT-registered traders only)

This is taken from http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/vat/full-intro.html


As the buyers the vat would not be their problem so this is complete Bullsh*t.
Do you have the passports.
They have broken a verbal contract I would go and get your animals back

SRV

No i gave the passport for the mare to them, the foal was yet unregistered.

The passport is still in my name tho as a transfer form needs to be filled in.

I know, stupid to give this, but they were friends good as at this point, and so respectable. Theve just decided to not pay now, for whatever reason. They are dangerous too, legal wise, if i went to collect i dont know what they might conjure up.


I would like to issue them with an invoice as they requested it..

How would i format that? Taking into account im not vat registered etc. What would i write?

thanks very much

headmaster

In that case, do as I did. My problem was not much different to yours. I contacted a few good neighbours, told them the story and along with some other friends, 2 jeeps and a horsebox, visited my so called buyers. My visit was not expected, frightened the day lights out of them and got a couple of conemara's back, that money was overly due on. One great thing as well, was the fact that they had bred one of the mares with a stallion I had my eye on, that's over 4 months ago. I've heard nothing, don't expect to hear anything and will deal with it if I hear anything. I'm a happy camper, i've also seen this buyer family quite a few times lately. I always have my special smile for them and he knows it too.

Ave Sodalis

I would imagine if they haven't paid and your name is still on the passport, it'd be considered theft and within your rights to retrieve the horses(or so I would assume). I would do what headmaster did, and go and get your horse without telling the current ''owners''.

Esroh

Why would you issue an invoice. Its a reciept they should get After they Pay you.

There is no legal requirement for vat to be involve here as you are non-registered.
You could give them a reciept for the deposit but no more. And do not even think of giving them Bank details
If you think they are dangerous do not give them any paperwork of any sort re the sale.

I would agree with the others, get some help and go take your animals back.

convert

I would seek legal advice on this as soon as possible. Right now.

twomeys

Ok first things first I hope you've learned a valuable lesson? In a recession don't let a screw driver out of your site without payment. People are aware of the loop holes in law and often can embarrass people to the point where they won't call or collect payment.

Regarding the invoice you can not give a vat invoice if you are not vat registered. You can give a plain invoice stating your details, their details, animal details and amounts. Date it four months ago on the transaction date. By doing this you are liable for income tax on that amount.

These people are playing you a fool. They know that it is "technically" illegal for you to go onto their property and take "your" animals back. The other issue is that you don't have the passports. This means you are running out of options. In court they could say they paid you on the day sure how else would they have the passports. They could make you out to be a liar.

I think Convert is right, seek legal advise but I don't think you will not like what they say. I am a fan of headmasters approach but if it was me I'd take all my biggest and meanest looking friends and family. Arrive at the house unannounced with your invoice and demand payment, return of the animals or you are calling the Gardai and making a scene. Bring your horse box.

I wouldn't put up with this. I've had this before myself with a client. Thankfully the law says if I entered the premises and the staff allowed me to take all my stock back then I was legally allowed, if they refused I had to walk out even though they hadn't paid for one cent of it.

Keep us posted and I wish you the best. Their are other ways of doing this. U the way but they can't be sai publicly!!!

Regards

Eoghan

Btw way I forgot to say. This bull about needing a statement and bank details is load of rubbish. I do not need does when paying my business bills. Yes statements are for accountancy but one of sales don't require it. If you like a statement is the same as an invoice but invoice says invoice and statement says statement. I can give you examples if you pm me. Don't give them your bank details.

SRV

Thanks very much to everyone who have taken their time to write and advise.


Eoghan,

I understand what you say.

Also they have written much to me via facebook, including this.

provide us with copy of the contract.

Also provide us with a VAT invoice a full statement and a bank account details.

We can not pay without any of the previously requested details.

which shows they have not paid. I will pm you.

SRV

stargirl!

contacting you via facebook??!! how unprofessional is that?!

are you are a member of the BHS? if so they have a free 24/7 legal advice helpline for members, I have used it before and found to be very helpful.
if not i would recommend joining as they are really helpful.

doctor evil

OP print out the FB pages or any emails. You can use something like freezeframe to 'hold' the FB page in case anything gets changed.

Good luck.

MDFM

Lots of good advice already handed out to you here OP, but they are playing you for a fool & are likely to be professionals at this game. Take on board the legal advice as mentioned above and also consider the Small claims court?