Irish uprising of 23 October 1641

Rebelheart

So, today, 23 October 2011, is the anniversary of the 1641 insurgency, one of the most important events in the past 500 years of Irish history.

There are plenty of aspects to it which are worth discussing. At the moment, though, I'm wondering does anybody know where I can find an Irish version of the Oath of Association which all confederates had to take. The Oath* in English read as follows:

Oath of Association:

'I, A.B., do profess, swear, and protest before God and His saints and angels, the I will, during my life, bear true faith and allegiance to my Sovereign Lord, Charles, by the grace of God, King of Great Britain, France and Ireland, and to his heirs and lawful successors; and that I will, to my power, during my life, defend, uphold and maintain, all his and their just prerogatives, estates, and rights, the power and privilege of the Parliament of this realm, the fundamental laws of Ireland, the free exercise of the Roman Catholic faith and religion throughout this land; and the lives, just liberties, possessions, estates, and rights of all those that have taken, or that shall take this Oath, and perform the contents thereof; and that I will obey and ratify all the orders and decrees made, and to be made, by the Supreme Council of the Confederate Catholics of this Kingdom, concerning the said public cause; and I will not seek, directly or indirectly, any pardon or protection for any act done, or to be done, touching this general cause, without the consent of the major part of the said Council; and that I will not, directly or indirectly, do any act or acts that shall prejudice the said cause, but will, to the hazard of my life and estate, assist, prosecute and maintain the same.
Moreover, I do further swear that I will not accept of, or submit unto any peace, made, or to be made, with the said Confederate Catholics, without the consent and approbation of the General Assembly of the said Confederate Catholics, and for the preservation and strengthening of the association and union of the kingdom. That upon any peace or accommodation to be made, or concluded with the said Confederate Catholics as aforesaid, I will, to the utmost of my power, insist upon and maintain the ensuing propositions, until a peace, as aforesaid, be made, and the matters to be agreed upon in the articles of peace be established and secured by Parliament.
So help me God and His holy gospel.'

Confederate Oath of Association, July 1642.

Richard Bellings, for instance, notes 'The Archbishops and Bishops of the several dioceses were enjoined to take copies of the oath of association or union, which they were to translate into Irish and expound in the same language....'

Anybody know where I could get a copy of the Oath in Irish?

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* A quite different Oath of Association is found in the Propaganda Archives in Rome:



‘I firmly believe in each and all the articles which the Holy
Roman Catholic Church believes, and promise to the hazard of
my life and estate to uphold, with God's help, and defend unto
death the Catholic faith against all heretics, Jews, atheists, and other
enemies of the Holy Catholic Church; (2) I further believe in and
acknowledge King Charles as my king and sovereign prince and
the true king of Ireland, England, Scotland, and France, promising
God by vow to uphold, to the hazard of my life and estate, and
defend the privileges and prerogatives of the Crown against all
malevolent persons of whatever country or religion; (3) I likewise
promise and vow to God to be faithful to my afflicted fatherland, the
kingdom of Ireland, to the hazard of my life and estate, and to
liberate it from the servitude, oppression, and bad government
exercised there by the officials and ministers of justice, against the
most benign wishes of His Majesty; (4) I likewise promise and vow
to God not to molest the Catholics and not to usurp their property
and their lands, both those owned by them before 1610 and those
acquired or purchased since then; (5) Moreover, I promise God and
swear to make no distinction between Old Irish and Anglo-Irish;
(6) Finally, I promise, vow, and swear to maintain inviolate and to
have maintained always each and all of the above articles with the
help of God's grace, which is never wanting to those who defend
the holy Gospel.’ (Calendar of Volume 1 (1625-68) of the Collection "Scritture riferite nei congressi, Irlanda", in Propaganda Archives, Collectanea Hibernica, No. 6/7, 1963/1964, p. 53)

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jonniebgood1

Rebelheart wrote: »

So, today, 23 October 2011, is the anniversary of the 1641 insurgency, one of the most important events in the past 500 years of Irish history.

There are plenty of aspects to it which are worth discussing. At the moment, though, I'm wondering does anybody know where I can find an Irish version of the Oath of Association which all confederates had to take. The Oath* in English read as follows:

The 1641 rebellion was an opportunity missed by the Irish landowners. Like many Irish rebellions it was betrayed but would it have succeeded if this had not happened?

What is the significance of seeing the oath of association in Irish? I know this was the native launguage but will it tell something significant?
It is a lively period of time both in Ireland and in England and Scotland. Which aspects of this do you find most interesting Rebelheart?

Seren_

Most bishops couldn't speak Irish though, so how were they expected to publicise it?

The 1641 rebellion is extremely interestng, especially the depositions (which are available online). I got to see one of the originals a few months ago; seriously awesome!

dubhthach

Your Text Here wrote: »

Most bishops couldn't speak Irish though, so how were they expected to publicise it?

In 1641? the Catholic bishops would have all been Irish speakers apart from those in the "pale". The Anglophone nature of the church is a product of the late 18th/early 19th centuries, especially the setting up of Maynooth which was mandated to be english only. I recall reading that there were issues in 18th century Irish college in Paris regarding the teaching of Irish to priests destined for Leinster, it was standard part of curriculm during 17th/18th century. Likewise in other colleges/seminaries for Irish clergy on the continent.

Rebelheart

Today is the 371st anniversary of the 1641 uprising.

Rebelheart

Seren_ wrote: »

Most bishops couldn't speak Irish though, so how were they expected to publicise it?

The vast, vast majority of them, if not all, could speak Irish. The vast majority were native speakers.

Even the two most vociferously anti-radical/Rinuccini/Eoghan Rua Ó Néill bishops, the Archbishop of Dublin and the Bishop of Meath, spoke Irish. The Archbishop of Dublin was Tom Fleming, son of Baron Slane. Fleming was a member of the ultra pro-Irish Franciscan order, the most Gaelic and radical of the counter reformation orders which was both mendicant and most powerful in Gaelic Ulster. He does not appear in the baron of Slane genealogies from the 1630s because he was studying in the Irish College in Louvain, a bastion of Irish culture at the time, while his father was at home professing loyalty to the crown.

The Bishop of Meath, Tom Dease of Westmeath, was despite his anti-Gaelic politics a Gaelic poet of some note.

BFDCH.

Seren_ wrote: »

Most bishops couldn't speak Irish though, so how were they expected to publicise it?

The 1641 rebellion is extremely interestng, especially the depositions (which are available online). I got to see one of the originals a few months ago; seriously awesome!

what are these depositions and where are they?