Garda at Harold's cross

radiat

There's a lady garda stopping cyclists breaking the lights at Harold's cross in the way into town in the morning. She was taking the details of a cyclist the other morning. Anyone get caught?

DirkVoodoo

Of course no one here got caught, we all obey the law, religiously.

Regardless, I would like to see more police presence. I can't remember the last time I saw a checkpoint or someone being pulled over/stopped and the standard of driving/cycling in the city the last few weeks has been quite poor.

Good on her anyway, probably not the kind of job someone dreams of when they go to Templemore.

Captain Havoc

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Regardless, I would like to see more police presence.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vR6lQ34wSBk

hardCopy

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Of course no one here got caught, we all obey the law, religiously.

Regardless, I would like to see more police presence. I can't remember the last time I saw a checkpoint or someone being pulled over/stopped and the standard of driving/cycling in the city the last few weeks has been quite poor.

Good on her anyway, probably not the kind of job someone dreams of when they go to Templemore.

I wonder how they'll manage free-flow this year. It's always been heavily dependent on the now empty Garda College.

Moflojo

radiat wrote: »

There's a lady garda stopping cyclists breaking the lights at Harold's cross in the way into town in the morning. She was taking the details of a cyclist the other morning. Anyone get caught?

The Garda clamped down on that junction and Christchurch about 6 months ago and it was actually very effective. They spent 2 or 3 morning rush hours at HC and evening rush hours at Christchurch but the levels of RLJ at both junctions dropped noticably for weeks afterwards.

I always think those jumping the light coming from Kimmage at Harold's Cross are taking a big risk as buses and taxis are usually coming at full tilt from the Terenure side. I cycle past there from the Terenure side and RLJs from the Kimmage Road have put me in danger a couple of times. They're almost always oblivious to the danger though!

BostonB

Isn't there a ghost bike there?

Moflojo

BostonB wrote: »

Isn't there a ghost bike there?

That's at the bridge on the canal, I'm assuming the OP is talking about the Y junction at Harold's Cross where the Terenure Road meets the Kimmage Road. I don't think there's a ghost bike at that junction.

easygoing39

hardCopy wrote: »

I wonder how they'll manage free-flow this year. It's always been heavily dependent on the now empty Garda College.

Well there was no cop free flow last year and traffic moved better than in the years before.So best hope that the cops dont get involved with traffic this year either asnd we all will get around the town better.

alie

easygoing39 wrote: »

hardCopy wrote: »

I wonder how they'll manage free-flow this year. It's always been heavily dependent on the now empty Garda College.

Well there was no cop free flow last year and traffic moved better than in the years before.So best hope that the cops dont get involved with traffic this year either asnd we all will get around the town better.

There was a female gaurds outside the hospice on Monday stopping cyclists breaking the lights

fat bloke

What's the story with dismounting, walking past the actual light with a "Howyra guard", and then remounting and cycling off for yourself?

BeerNut

fat bloke wrote: »

What's the story with dismounting, walking past the actual light with a "Howyra guard", and then remounting and cycling off for yourself?

If it's illegal, I'll be a test case sooner or later. If I just miss those lights at Harold's Cross Park that's what I do.

I'm pretty sure I've seen it actually recommended by some official site or other.

lafors

I hate when a commuter jumps a red but what is an on foot garda going to do if the RLJ just ignores them and keeps going? He/she can't exactly pull them off the bike? and its not like a bike has a reg plate.

I hope they catch loads doing it but I wonder how many actually stop?

Dermot Illogical

lafors wrote: »

I hate when a commuter jumps a red but what is an on foot garda going to do if the RLJ just ignores them and keeps going? He/she can't exactly pull them off the bike? and its not like a bike has a reg plate.

I hope they catch loads doing it but I wonder how many actually stop?

Some might get away, but it's hard to outrun a radio. RLJ and fail to stop is going to ruin your day if you get caught.

PMC999

lafors wrote: »

I hate when a commuter jumps a red but what is an on foot garda going to do if the RLJ just ignores them and keeps going? He/she can't exactly pull them off the bike? and its not like a bike has a reg plate.

I hope they catch loads doing it but I wonder how many actually stop?

what does RLJ mean?

Dermot Illogical

PMC999 wrote: »

what does RLJ mean?

Red Light Jumper

galwaycyclist

BeerNut wrote: »

If it's illegal, I'll be a test case sooner or later. If I just miss those lights at Harold's Cross Park that's what I do.

I'm pretty sure I've seen it actually recommended by some official site or other.

Its against the law to dismount and wheel a bike through a red light IIRC case was Police v Wetheril circa 1953

NamelessPhil

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Its against the law to dismount and wheel a bike through a red light IIRC case was Police v Wetheril circa 1953

I can't find any reference to that case online. Is it an English case? In any event, the principal act is the Road Traffic Act, 1961.

galwaycyclist

NamelessPhil wrote: »

I can't find any reference to that case online. Is it an English case? In any event, the principal act is the Road Traffic Act, 1961.

Believe so its cited by Robert Pierse in his Road Traffic Law in Ireland text. Couldn't tell you which edition.

See here:
http://www.usenetmessages.com/view.php?c=other&g=5795&id=127&p=10

fat bloke

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Its against the law to dismount and wheel a bike through a red light IIRC case was Police v Wetheril circa 1953

Me hole.

Sounds like something from Flann O Brien:rolleyes:

CramCycle

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Believe so its cited by Robert Pierse in his Road Traffic Law in Ireland text. Couldn't tell you which edition.

See here:
http://www.usenetmessages.com/view.php?c=other&g=5795&id=127&p=10

It's still an english case (Sheffield Magistrates court), while he may have been referencing it as a possibility, as far as I know it has not come up in Ireland. The ruling was also called into question by several cases thereafter that ruled in the cyclists favour, alot of which are referenced in the thread you linked.

I could be wrong but this is my understanding. I can only see it being illegal if the cyclist/pedestrian hybrid mounts the bike before he is clear of the junction or in a place where they may be causing a danger.

christeb

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Its against the law to dismount and wheel a bike through a red light IIRC case was Police v Wetheril circa 1953

Oh yeah? I do this a bit, a Garda told me it was an option after giving me a post-RLJ lecture a while back

seamus

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Its against the law to dismount and wheel a bike through a red light IIRC case was Police v Wetheril circa 1953

If challenged, I imagine it would boil down to whether the bike was pushed down the road or down the path. Pushing it down the road, it's still a vehicle on a road, and so must obey those laws. But dismount, onto path and the bike becomes luggage or whatever, not a vehicle.

OldPeculier

seamus wrote: »

If challenged, I imagine it would boil down to whether the bike was pushed down the road or down the path. Pushing it down the road, it's still a vehicle on a road, and so must obey those laws. But dismount, onto path and the bike becomes luggage or whatever, not a vehicle.

Spot the experienced RLJ with pre-emptive excuse in case he’s caught!!;)

BeerNut

seamus wrote: »

But dismount, onto path and the bike becomes luggage or whatever, not a vehicle.

Exactly. Otherwise everyone in possession of a bike but not actually riding it on the road at that moment is breaking the law.

Of course walking through a red light is illegal, and it doesn't matter whether you have a bike or not, I'd say.

check_six

BeerNut wrote: »

Exactly. Otherwise everyone in possession of a bike but not actually riding it on the road at that moment is breaking the law.

Of course walking through a red light is illegal, and it doesn't matter whether you have a bike or not, I'd say.

Does this mean if I am standing at a crossroads (on foot) and the lights change green for pedestrians in both directions I am not allowed walk diagonally across the junction, and I must walk north then east (or whatever direction)? I've just realised I am a serial offender and I must be stopped! I'm turning myself in immediately.

BeerNut

check_six wrote: »

Does this mean if I am standing at a crossroads (on foot) and the lights change green for pedestrians in both directions I am not allowed walk diagonally across the junction, and I must walk north then east (or whatever direction)?

Eh? Of course not. If the lights change green for pedestrians in both directions you're not walking through any reds, are you?

Lumen

seamus wrote: »

If challenged, I imagine it would boil down to whether the bike was pushed down the road or down the path. Pushing it down the road, it's still a vehicle on a road, and so must obey those laws. But dismount, onto path and the bike becomes luggage or whatever, not a vehicle.

I don't think the law is specific to bikes.

It might also be legal to get out of your car, push it onto the footpath, past the red light and back on again, "remounting" and driving off.

galwaycyclist

BeerNut wrote: »

Exactly. Otherwise everyone in possession of a bike but not actually riding it on the road at that moment is breaking the law.

Of course walking through a red light is illegal, and it doesn't matter whether you have a bike or not, I'd say.

Yep I reckon this is the nub. Possibility probably doesnt arise as much in Dublin as likely all the traffic lights have a pedestrian phase. We still have lights in Galway with no pedstrian stages.

Of course theoretically that is a model Dublin should be looking to move to but thats another days argument.

BeerNut

galwaycyclist wrote: »

We still have lights in Galway with no pedstrian stages.

We do too. Just down from Harold's Cross is Leonard's Corner, a crossroads that only has ped crossings on two sides.

check_six

BeerNut wrote: »

Eh? Of course not. If the lights change green for pedestrians in both directions you're not walking through any reds, are you?

But what if I am just about to step onto the footpath, the traffic lights are red, pedestrian lights green, and I decide I want to head back the way I came on the other side of the road? I go through the red light (on foot) and walk diagonally through the stop line and across to the other corner of the junction. Have I become a lawless street punk who must be put away?

I'm just looking for the most ludicrous interpretation of these laws by the way, I can't see how walking a bike through a junction is more of a problem than walking through on foot. Perhaps we need to cyclocross style it and start lobbing our bikes onto our shoulders at each junction and hurdling onrushing cars?

BeerNut

check_six wrote: »

what if I am just about to step onto the footpath, the traffic lights are red, pedestrian lights green, and I decide I want to head back the way I came on the other side of the road?

I can't picture what you mean.

check_six wrote: »

I can't see how walking a bike through a junction is more of a problem than walking through on foot.

Me neither. That's why I said "it doesn't matter whether you have a bike or not". Did someone say it was?

BostonB

People who get into the habit of crossing diagonally are most likely to do it when theres only a green in one direction and end up in the middle of the road with a truck heading for them.

You see diagonal crossers stuck in the middle of junctions quite often.

check_six

Okay, imagine that I have just got out of a taxi at red lights. the pedestrian lights are green. I fail to step on to the footpath before following the green man across the road. Do I go straight to jail?

Again, I'm just trying to think out some silly situation which may be technically illegal for a pedestrian and is a bit similar to walking your bike through a red light.

BeerNut

check_six wrote: »

I fail to step on to the footpath before following the green man across the road. Do I go straight to jail?

Yes. Every time someone gets out of a car and places their foot on the road they are jaywalking. In this case, you will get the same punishment every other jaywalker gets.

Once you've walked through the red light, however, you're in the pedestrian zone created by the ped lights and can walk there, regardless of whether you're wheeling a bike or not.

check_six

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