Timber Frame Issues?

kboc

I am organising my next house.

The next time I will let somebody in to do it and a candle will heat it!

I am researching the method of build, I have 3 methods in my head;

Timber Frame
Single leaf 215mm block with EWI
Cavity wall with 250/300mm fully beaded fill.

I have a rough idea of pros and cons of each. One of the lesser issues is with timber frame. My dearest wife is deadly for making last minute decisions and asking for a picture frame here or a shelf there.

How do you account for this in timber frame without looking for a studs in the wall to grip? Other items which spring to mind include (high) kitchen units and built in wardrobes?

What are peoples experiences of this issue?

Kind regards
K

Poor Uncle Tom

Have you considered ICF, foundation, walls and roof?

I am not saying that as if it is the bees knees, it just seems as though you have ignored this type of construction.

kboc

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Have you considered ICF, foundation, walls and roof?

I am not saying that as if it is the bees knees, it just seems as though you have ignored this type of construction.

My current build was supposed to be ICF but the banks put a squeeze on the mortgage when things went pear shaped 3 years ago. I know the ins and outs of ICF, i think EWI or wide cavity offer better value for money than ICF (walls). I will however have an insulated raft foundation, after the detailing involved in taping my floor insulation, i seriously think insullated raft option is cheaper


What about timber frame, is the original questions real issues with those people that have timber frame?

BryanF

kboc wrote: »

I am organising my next house.

The next time I will let somebody in to do it and a candle will heat it!

I am researching the method of build, I have 3 methods in my head;

Timber Frame
Single leaf 215mm block with EWI
Cavity wall with 250/300mm fully beaded fill.

I have a rough idea of pros and cons of each. One of the lesser issues is with timber frame. My dearest wife is deadly for making last minute decisions and asking for a picture frame here or a shelf there.

How do you account for this in timber frame without looking for a studs in the wall to grip? Other items which spring to mind include (high) kitchen units and built in wardrobes?

What are peoples experiences of this issue?

Kind regards
K

you get the chippies to put a row of 'noggings' (not sure if thats the correct term) around the room at picture frame height, just like you do for socket backings etc

SC024

kboc wrote: »

I am organising my next house.

The next time I will let somebody in to do it and a candle will heat it!

I am researching the method of build, I have 3 methods in my head;

Timber Frame
Single leaf 215mm block with EWI
Cavity wall with 250/300mm fully beaded fill.

I have a rough idea of pros and cons of each. One of the lesser issues is with timber frame. My dearest wife is deadly for making last minute decisions and asking for a picture frame here or a shelf there.

How do you account for this in timber frame without looking for a studs in the wall to grip? Other items which spring to mind include (high) kitchen units and built in wardrobes?

What are peoples experiences of this issue?

Kind regards
K

You could fit 12mm plywood / mdf/ OSB to all the walls before slabbing them? gives you a lot more flexibility with picture/shelf heights?

SC024

beyondpassive

You could line in fermacell or OSB lined plasterboard, no big deal.

In regard to the best system between wide cavity, EWI or timber frame, they are inseparable, the big issue is attention to detail particularly in design and workmanship.

The question you should ask is how do I set benchmarks to achieve my goals. How do I get the low energy performance I desire, the cost certainty I need and the quality I deserve?

kboc

beyondpassive wrote: »

You could line in fermacell or OSB lined plasterboard, no big deal.

In regard to the best system between wide cavity, EWI or timber frame, they are inseparable, the big issue is attention to detail particularly in design and workmanship.

The question you should ask is how do I set benchmarks to achieve my goals. How do I get the low energy performance I desire, the cost certainty I need and the quality I deserve?

You have hit the nail on the head here. The only problem is i know what i want, if i was to use my preferred option of EWI, I am not sure I could "trust" the trades men, especially in this area i live in. The house I have just finished is "famous" in this area, because yer man (me) done this and yer man done that. (150 mm wide cavity, extra insulation in floors and (cold) roof and a HRV) With the benfit of hindsight my house is no were near good enough for me, so I will sell in a few years and go again!

This is why I am leaning seriously towards the factory quality control conditions of a timber frame company. There are some issues which I have to investigate and work out whether they are justified.

K

Do-more

SC024 wrote: »

You could fit 12mm plywood / mdf/ OSB to all the walls before slabbing them? gives you a lot more flexibility with picture/shelf heights?

Would a layer of 6mm or 4mm ply behind the plasterboard give enough grab for screws, surely enough for picture hooks and the like?

I would have certainly thought that it would provide enough additional strength to hang heavy shelves and kitchen cabinets from if you were to use the spring loaded plasterboard fixings like these.



I used to work in a place where containers from the far east would have two or three sheets of light ply securing the load with ropes at the back door. They were all dumped. Might be worth asking around for a free supply.

homewardbound11

I built a timberframe this year and used both 9mm ply and also fermacell. The fermacell is in the kitchen as you said the kitchen units is something that got shifted at least 20 times. So the fermacell is excellent. The units hang directly onto the fermacell and it looks no different when skimmed . Great stuff. My kitchen installer was reluctant initially but you can hang 50kg of a screw.

I used 9mm on all internal walls. Good enough for almost any hanging pictures.
I did use 18mm osb on external walls but that was purley for airtightness reasons. The curtain poles are on these.
All good.

kboc

homewardbound11 wrote: »

I built a timberframe this year and used both 9mm ply and also fermacell. The fermacell is in the kitchen as you said the kitchen units is something that got shifted at least 20 times. So the fermacell is excellent. The units hang directly onto the fermacell and it looks no different when skimmed . Great stuff. My kitchen installer was reluctant initially but you can hang 50kg of a screw.

I used 9mm on all internal walls. Good enough for almost any hanging pictures.
I did use 18mm osb on external walls but that was purley for airtightness reasons. The curtain poles are on these.
All good.

Will these not perforate the airtight layer?

sas

kboc wrote: »

Will these not perforate the airtight layer?

I read an article some time ago about early passive houses being tested after many years of occupation.

The airtightness by and large was maintained (regardless of construction method) assuming good workmanship to begin with.

This was despite pictures,units, curtain rails having been installed.

Very easy to get caught up with these little concerns too.

If that type of thing was really worrying me, I'd still a dolop of silicone over the hole and screw through it.

homewardbound11

The external walls have been counterbattoned to allow further rockwool insulation. That gave me the chance to slip in 9 by 2" for further support.
On the airtightness and screws. They did not get to penetrate all the way through the 18mm. I had thought about that even though I did make sure the osb airtightness was not penetrated in reality how could an air leak be formed by a multi threaded screw throught a thick plywood.

homewardbound11

SAS is correct.
My tightness test came in at 1.6 after all M&E were in. Even then there were known leaks to be resolved- Around flues and also the glueing of the air tightness layer to the floor.
The soleplate to frame to floor is one major detail that you rarely get to see and an airtightness test after that stage or pre finished floor will tell you alot about the attention to detail the intaller put into the airtightness.

KG_SouthTipp

Hi,

We built a timber frame two storey house and we used high density fibrboard instead of plasterboard. Its more expensive than plasterboard but you can hang paintings, tv's anywhere. Here is the product info:

http://www.gyproc.ie/pdf/rigiduronline3.pdf

Below is the info on the weight it can hold:

"Loads with a weight of less than 30kg per point of
attachment can easily be attached to the wall with suitable
screws, and 55kg using a suitable wall plug, without the

need for support noggings."

Hope this helps.