College exam - Legal Action

gaatipstr

Hi, i recently repeated an exam on my final year of a 3 year Ordinary Degree. I got 36% but would not let me be compensated. When i went to review the exam I used the marking scheme and answers that were giving to me and added up a total of 40%. Upon reviewing it again the college bumped up my mark to 37%. To be honest the college havent been very helpful. Only giving me my result AFTER I contacted them 2 weeks after my application went in, saying that its desicion by Exam Reviewer. Is there any way of actually going into the college and sitting down with them and showing them where i should of got marks on my exam. Im not been sour grapes but in my opinion there not helping me. I have a job now that i will have to give up to attend one class a week, my plans of going to Australia in Febuary will have to be cancelled to repeat the exam next may, and i will prob have to pay ridiculous fees in order to attend the one class every week. Im only writing this as I know of cases where students dont even turn up for the Repeat exam but yet are given a pass or a degree.

My arguement is why should my job and futher prospects for the coming year be jeopardised after I did the exam and missed out by 3% wheres some students who didnt even attend their said exams where given a pass into the next year or a degree?
Is there any Legal action i can take on getting the result i deserve as I know for a fact i passed.

Thanks

dats_right

You should talk to a solicitor, who can advise you fully on your options. It is possible, although far from assured, in a case such as this that a solicitors letter might progress matters favourably.

CIARAN_BOYLE

I'd talk to your tutor or some lecturer you know and get along with.

Maybe you can do an external repeat and keep your job just study yourself through the year and sit the exam at the end. Its probably more of an issue for an education forum than legal advice.

There are rules regarding passing by compensation in the college and I don't have a clue if you meet them or not

Reloc8

I'd go to your Student Union, if you have access to one, in the first instance.

Robbo

Get a copy of the colleges literature on marks and standards. This will tell you all the various criteria for passing, weightings etc. Bring this and the marking scheme to a solicitor.

gaatipstr

Thanks for the reply people. I meant to add in that I was planning to go to Australia/New Zeland in January/Febuary for a year at least. I have been in touch with a few companies that were interested in taking me on but know that will have to be scrapped.
The lecture of the subject in question is a no-go as we never got on and was never helpful during the term.
The head of the department hasnt replied to my email i sent him saying that I will take the matter further.
I dont think the Student Union will be interested as they seem to be mostly concerned with Organising entertainment in the college.

It seems my only hope is to contace a solicitor and see from there. Would I have good grounds to talk to a solicitor or am I wasting my time. Im as honest as I can be, I have failed before when I knew I failed and wasnt going to appeal when I knew I did bad but i Know I passed this exam as I have reviewed the exam and answers in the college only 2 weeks ago and saw for myself that I should of got 40%.

Has this ever happend before. I have a little bit of Information regarding other Students been passed on the sly, could I use this in my arguement?

Avatargh

gaatipstr wrote: »

Thanks for the reply people. I meant to add in that I was planning to go to Australia/New Zeland in January/Febuary for a year at least. I have been in touch with a few companies that were interested in taking me on but know that will have to be scrapped.
The lecture of the subject in question is a no-go as we never got on and was never helpful during the term.
The head of the department hasnt replied to my email i sent him saying that I will take the matter further.
I dont think the Student Union will be interested as they seem to be mostly concerned with Organising entertainment in the college.

It seems my only hope is to contace a solicitor and see from there. Would I have good grounds to talk to a solicitor or am I wasting my time. Im as honest as I can be, I have failed before when I knew I failed and wasnt going to appeal when I knew I did bad but i Know I passed this exam as I have reviewed the exam and answers in the college only 2 weeks ago and saw for myself that I should of got 40%.

Has this ever happend before. I have a little bit of Information regarding other Students been passed on the sly, could I use this in my arguement?

Is this a mechanical subject - i.e. one that you can absolutely and properly show that your paper, on objective criteria, deserved 40%? I can imagine how you could do that in maths, or accounting, or taxation etc. If, however, this is a humanities subject, I don't understand what you can expect. You were failed. Examiners can fail students. Examiners are entitled to reach a view on papers. I'm just not sure how you know you should have got 40%? Again, if its "that kind" of subject...fair enough.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Also are you sure that you counted any continuous assessment for example you got 40 in the exam but your continuous assessment score of 20 dragged you down to 37

mrs vimes

gaatipstr wrote: »

Is there any way of actually going into the college and sitting down with them and showing them where i should of got marks on my exam. Im not been sour grapes but in my opinion there not helping me.

Not trying to be smart OP and I sympathise with your plight, but if the exam included essay-type questions perhaps your grammar let you down?

Mr. Incognito

You would have very little chance of suceeding with this I'm afraid as you will have to sign up to the college terms and conditions.

Just take the resit and stop whining. If you had studied in the first place you'd have been fine. Accept it as a part of life and learning a lesson.

gaatipstr

Well hang on there moderator, No need to get on your high horse. If you did an exam and were failed when you should of been passed then you would react the same.

The exam is basically questions on building performance. I went into the college and was given my answer sheet back along with the marking shceme that Showed the answers in full and the marks for each point. There were 3 points i had in various questions that werent accounted for when its clearly the same answer as in the marking scheme book. Each point was worth 1% bringing my total to 40% - A Pass

And also moderator before you question anybody about studying maybe you could take into consideration that its a hard subject and maybe im just not that good at it but happy with just a pass in it?

Avatargh

gaatipstr wrote: »

Well hang on there moderator, No need to get on your high horse. If you did an exam and were failed when you should of been passed then you would react the same.

The exam is basically questions on building performance. I went into the college and was given my answer sheet back along with the marking shceme that Showed the answers in full and the marks for each point. There were 3 points i had in various questions that werent accounted for when its clearly the same answer as in the marking scheme book. Each point was worth 1% bringing my total to 40% - A Pass

And also moderator before you question anybody about studying maybe you could take into consideration that its a hard subject and maybe im just not that good at it but happy with just a pass in it?

What subject is this? Just answer that question, please.

You seem to think there is a mechanics to exam correction; "I had made a point, therefore I should get a mark". Maybe the way you made the point was rubbish? Maybe the point was rubbish?

gaatipstr

If you read back on my previous post I clearly say its an exam on Building Performance.
And once again il state that the college marking scheme shows how each point as in a sentence and i have it word for word so its not rubbish as you say

gaatipstr

gaatipstr wrote: »

If you read back on my previous post I clearly say its an exam on Building Performance.
And once again il state that the college marking scheme shows how each point as in a sentence and i have it word for word so its not rubbish as you say

I know you said how the Students Union are mostly concerned with entertainment, you seemed to be dismissive of them but they do so much more than that. There is surely an Education Officer in your Students Union? Even very small colleges have one. You should go to him/her ASAP. Look them up, send them an email, your college website should have their contact details. They are there to help you and other students in your situation, so use them.

Mr. Incognito

gaatipstr wrote: »

If you read back on my previous post I clearly say its an exam on Building Performance.
And once again il state that the college marking scheme shows how each point as in a sentence and i have it word for word so its not rubbish as you say

If you had the ability to quote large chunks of a sample answer word for word you probably would not have failed.

Perhaps though- you did quote a large chunk word for word but it was not what was asked in the question and was utterly superflous.

gaatipstr

Moderator are you actually for real?
Let me explain again...

I (that is me the OP) answered a question on an exam paper. I wrote the answer on my answer sheet (that was given to me by the college to write my answers on) word for word. The marking scheme and answer booklet (that was also given to my by the college to show where the marks in each section go) had the exact same answer as i had written on my exam sheet (the one the college gave me) but was not given any marks for it when it clearly states on the marking scheme booklet that i should have got 1%.

Does that clarify it for you?

PCPhoto

Gaatpstr

you need to look at it another way - you say you should have gotten marks for "X" answer ...is there anywhere on the booklet where you can loose marks for grammar or punctuation or any error that you could have made which would result in you not getting marks for that section.

you do realise that 40 is the bare minimum pass - every student should aim higher and to be fair you might have a point but you must realise that you are clutching at straws - hoping that if the college bump you up a few marks then you can pass the year and possibly graduate - which would allow you to travel to OZ and start work.

if the college does not pass you then you face postponing your travel, paying the college fees for a repeat of one exam - which you would have a whole 9months to study for - do you think your grade will increase by much after only having one subject to study ?

if I was to get all "conspiracy theory" on it you could claim that the college is refusing to give you a bare pass because they want the repeat fees - but I doubt that severely, IMO they wont pass you because they think that they should not be passing someone when they fail - if it was higher up in the grades going from a "D" to a "C" or of the difference between getting a "distinction" then the college would probably not have a problem increasing the grade ... but borderline pass/fail is strict... they cannot give you a pass unless you earn it on merit.

Why didn't you get a higher mark that mid 30's ? .... because you don't know or understand what they are teaching you - you cannot argue with this point ...if you knew and understood what you were taught in college you would not have gotten such a low mark.

from a legal perspective you are unlikely to win the case - but - best of luck with it.

*= I was in your situation about 10years ago and wouldn't have considered legal action, no offence intended to you but its almost as if you feel the college should pass you because you nearly got the right marks and are threatening legal action because they wont do as you request/wish.

Avatargh

gaatipstr wrote: »

If you read back on my previous post I clearly say its an exam on Building Performance.
And once again il state that the college marking scheme shows how each point as in a sentence and i have it word for word so its not rubbish as you say

No you didn't. What you said was

"The exam is basically questions on building performance."

Being "basically something" (your grammar aside) isn't the same as being something.

In any event, I'm asking you what subject it was? And that's being asked for the purpose of understanding your apparent assertion that there are "right" and "wrong" answers which will invariably attract a particular standard of marking - akin to maths, or taxation etc rather than, say, a humanities subject.

And maybe, just maybe, if your exam answers were populated with English along the lines of "And once again il state that the college marking scheme shows how each point as in a sentence and i have it word for word so its not rubbish as you say", you might just not be creating the best impression for an examiner.

FreudianSlippers

Attack the post, not the poster.

Avatargh

Avatargh wrote: »

Is this a mechanical subject - i.e. one that you can absolutely and properly show that your paper, on objective criteria, deserved 40%? I can imagine how you could do that in maths, or accounting, or taxation etc. If, however, this is a humanities subject, I don't understand what you can expect. You were failed. Examiners can fail students. Examiners are entitled to reach a view on papers. I'm just not sure how you know you should have got 40%? Again, if its "that kind" of subject...fair enough.

If a student is that borderline on a pass/fail, especially in a final year exam, (as is the case for the OP, a final exam subject of an ordinary degree), examiners will do everything to bring them up to that pass. For example - attendance, punctuality, general engagement in lectures and tutorials etc. is taken into account. They give them the benefit of the doubt, perhaps not feeling very well on the day of the exam, hence why it may have gone pear-shaped for them. Examiners can't fail students, students fail themselves. There also tends not to be 'trick' questions at third level also, as can be the case in Higher Level Leaving Cert subjects.

This should be a word of warning for people coasting along and being blasé in college:

You stroll in late, don't bother turning up to half the lecturers, are chatting/falling asleep down the back of the leture hall and think the lecturer, just because he/she isn't saying anything, doesn't notice believe you me, they are not stupid, they do notice. If you are on the cusp of passing but struggling to reach the 40%, and they see that you were any of the above, then you have failed yourself and only have yourself to blame.

Avatargh

Deleted User wrote: »

If a student is that borderline on a pass/fail, especially in a final year exam, (as is the case for the OP, a final exam subject of an ordinary degree), examiners will do everything to bring them up to that pass. For example - attendance, punctuality, general engagement in lectures and tutorials etc. is taken into account. They give them the benefit of the doubt, perhaps not feeling very well on the day of the exam, hence why it may have gone pear-shaped for them. Examiners can't fail students, students fail themselves. There also tends not to be 'trick' questions at third level also, as can be the case in Higher Level Leaving Cert subjects.

This should be a word of warning for people coasting along and being blasé in college:

You stroll in late, don't bother turning up to half the lecturers, are chatting/falling asleep down the back of the leture hall and think the lecturer, just because he/she isn't saying anything, doesn't notice believe you me, they are not stupid, they do notice. If you are on the cusp of passing but struggling to reach the 40%, and they see that you were any of the above, then you have failed yourself and only have yourself to blame.

Agreed, entirely. I'm just trying to understand the strength of the OP's view (as expressed in this posts, which I am attacking) that he is adamant that he knows precisely what mark he should of got.

Stop Lad!

First of all, I find it funny and irritating how some people here have been jumping to conclusion and taking pop shots at the OP... with statements like 'If you had studied in the first place you'd have been fine' and slating their English/spelling/grammer. For all we know maybe OP has tried their very best, maybe its a very difficult subject, maybe OP is simply crap at it! Condescending and smarmy remarks aint gonna help the situ.

Anyway, as someone else said, go to you're student union and education officer, hound them to help you out and make your arguement. From experience, its best also to go direct to these people, knock on their door rather than sending emails that they cant be arsed replying to. Dont just assume that they will be unhelpful. Also, I think you really should speak direct to your lecturer & course director. You seem to sound fairly convinced that you were wronged, so whether the lecturer thinks you're a tool or not, if you can persuade him you were wronged then he really has to help resolve the situ. Even if you do take legal action, would it be a quicker and cheaper solution as opposed to taking the hit and repeating in May? Im guessing you would need to have the legal issue resolved by Janurary to know whether or not you need to repeat the term/exam, or even sooner depending on your college dealines for these things.

Best of luck any way lad

Avatargh

Stop Lad! wrote: »

For all we know maybe OP has tried their very best, maybe its a very difficult subject, maybe OP is simply crap at it!

Or maybe he/she said above, they were happy just to get a pass? Presumably, the basis for saying this is that because a "pass" was all that was in the sights of the OP who prepared accordingly.

Reloc8

gaatipstr wrote: »

Moderator are you actually for real?
Let me explain again...

I (that is me the OP) answered a question on an exam paper. I wrote the answer on my answer sheet (that was given to me by the college to write my answers on) word for word. The marking scheme and answer booklet (that was also given to my by the college to show where the marks in each section go) had the exact same answer as i had written on my exam sheet (the one the college gave me) but was not given any marks for it when it clearly states on the marking scheme booklet that i should have got 1%.

Does that clarify it for you?

If its that simple all you need do is seek a meeting with your tutor and/or your lecturer for that subject, armed with your exam script and the marking scheme and answer booklet, and ask them to explain where your 3% went.

It does seem odd that the original marker and a supervisory marker don't agree with you though - but you can only find out the answers by having that meeting.

There's neither need nor point in running around looking for a legal solution. You need to speak to your faculty staff.

gaatipstr

See the thing is that all I want is to sit down with the lecturer or whoever corrected the exam and let him explain where i didnt get marks and let me explain where I think I got marks and if it comes to a conclusion that I did indeed fail, i'll be the first one to admit my mistake and thank them for clarifying the result. But if it comes to a conclusion that i did deserve just the bare pass then i'll be happy that justice is served.

But the college department of my subject and my lecturer will not meet with me even though i try contacting them.

The reason im taking Legal is that I know for fact that some students missed there repeat exam due to sickness,mixing up of times etc.
But instead of actually doing the exam another time they are giving a pass straight into the next year.
My case is how is one student made suffer and not told exactly where he failed after doing the exam while another student is giving a pass into the following year with out doing an actual exam?

gaatipstr

gaatipstr wrote: »

See the thing is that all I want is to sit down with the lecturer or whoever corrected the exam and let him explain where i didnt get marks and let me explain where I think I got marks and if it comes to a conclusion that I did indeed fail, i'll be the first one to admit my mistake and thank them for clarifying the result. But if it comes to a conclusion that i did deserve just the bare pass then i'll be happy that justice is served.

But the college department of my subject and my lecturer will not meet with me even though i try contacting them.

The reason im taking Legal is that I know for fact that some students missed there repeat exam due to sickness,mixing up of times etc.
But instead of actually doing the exam another time they are giving a pass straight into the next year.
My case is how is one student made suffer and not told exactly where he failed after doing the exam while another student is giving a pass into the following year with out doing an actual exam?

This sounds most strange. Have they given you a reason or just refusing point blank (which sounds quite out of order) to meet you ? Is this why you're seeking to go down the legal route?

Most colleges have structured guidelines in place to deal with students who wish to make an appeal against a result if they think they are wrongly given a particular mark. Is your lecturer going against College Policy by refusing to meet you? They are out of order as I said, if they are. Have you gone to your Students Union Educational Officer, like I and others have advised you? This person will be equipped to deal with the appeals policy with you on your behalf. If they're worth their salt as I'm sure he/she is they will be more than happy to help you.

gaatipstr

Thanks for all the Replies. Contacted the SU and got through to the College rep and told her what happend.
Got an email today saying upon a re-review and taking into consideration of my years work i have been upgraded to a pass meaning I can Graduate next week

Thanks eveyone. Its been emotional

Zambia

I have a question what sort of subject is "Building performance"?

Grolschevik

Zambia wrote: »

I have a question what sort of subject is "Building performance"?

One that you can apparently pass by learning off and supplying verbatim the answers provided in the "answer booklet"...

gaatipstr

Grolschevik wrote: »

One that you can apparently pass by learning off and supplying verbatim the answers provided in the "answer booklet"...

Haha Laughable. The main point is I fought for justice and I won.

And to answer your early question - Building Performance Technology is a subject on the performance of a Building .i.e How it copes during bad weather, What materials to use and what not to use etc etc