Considering going to UK for Teaching

Ms Mc

For anyone who has the experience or advice

NQT here in Cork, looking to go to U.K for a while (1 year maybe 2) to teach because of the complete lack of jobs or even a chance of a teaching job in Ireland. Fairly depressed about everything, looking to go to U.K to get some element of a start in my career, possibly London intially?

For people who have been there, what is the best way about getting a teaching post? I have been in contact with a few agencies but following my research on other education threads I am not sure of which agencies are or are not the best? Am I just best off doing the search myself?

Any other advice or experiences will be great too

raytray

I teach in the Uk and I would definitely recommend to apply to schools yourself. If you look at the TES website there are loads of jobs at the moment for a January start. If you are primary school look at eteach.com too. Pay and conditions are better when you apply directly to the school rather than a recruiter. However, it is very time consuming applying directly to UK schools because they expect 2 A4 pages on why you want the job and it has to be specific to the school you are applying to. Always read the OFSTED report of the school you are applying to also. Anything below Good is not worth applying to (if you are secondary anyway)

clartharlear

Just doubling up on everything raytray said.
Clartharlear - Cork NQT working in London...

Ms Mc

Thanks for the replies!

Quick question, regarding teaching council hours (300 hours) are ye concerned about getting them done or because of economic situation, just gonna work away in the u.k for the time being?

Any other advice or experience would be great also!

Thanks again!

getz

Ms Mc wrote: »

For anyone who has the experience or advice

NQT here in Cork, looking to go to U.K for a while (1 year maybe 2) to teach because of the complete lack of jobs or even a chance of a teaching job in Ireland. Fairly depressed about everything, looking to go to U.K to get some element of a start in my career, possibly London intially?

For people who have been there, what is the best way about getting a teaching post? I have been in contact with a few agencies but following my research on other education threads I am not sure of which agencies are or are not the best? Am I just best off doing the search myself?

Any other advice or experiences will be great too

good for you,recommend avoiding london,birmingham ect [cost of housing /living high] head north young man/woman ,head north.

clartharlear

Ms Mc wrote: »

Thanks for the replies!

Quick question, regarding teaching council hours (300 hours) are ye concerned about getting them done or because of economic situation, just gonna work away in the u.k for the time being?

Any other advice or experience would be great also!

Thanks again!

The TC would not recognise my many hundreds of hours teaching Leaving Cert in Ireland, but will recognise my 300 hours teaching in the UK!

raytray

To get the 300 hours to be fully qualified in Ireland you are better off going to England because you have a better chance of getting full time hours so will get it done quicker! As clatharlear said, the Irish TC will recognise the 300 hours in the UK. Your years spent in the UK will also be recognised on the pay scale when you go home too.

sitstill

Does anyone know, if a teacher has a number of years of experience teaching in Ireland, do UK schools take this into account when calculating pay? Thnx - considering going next year!

raytray

I would imagine most schools definitely would take this into account. It might depend on the finances of the actual school though as you get paid from the school budget not the department of Ed. Pay can be negotiable in certain schools and certain subjects also. My school started me at point 3 on the salary scale even though I should have started at point 1. I think its because I teach a shortage subject. There are 8 years on the UK scale. The closer you are to 8 years, the harder it becomes to get a job.

lofto

Hey guys, I'm in a similar position. I've been starting to apply more seriously for teaching work within the UK, but so far, only really through recruitment agencies. I've found that by not having an English teaching council number, as well as a UK national insurance number, my direct applications to schools seem to be doomed from the onset.. Does anyone have any suggestions? should I keep persisting with direct applications?

raytray

Lofto, when I was applying for jobs in the UK I found the same thing. I applied for about 20 jobs and heard from none of them. Then I got a call for 3 interviews in one day! Some principals will have hired foreign teachers before though and will know that this is not an issue. I would say keep applying if you have the time because it tends to be the same group of people applying to the same schools. When a few people then get the first few jobs, it starts getting easier then because its less people applying. Also, I got the 1st job I interviewed for. I think most schools would be reasonable in the sense they are not going drag you over from Ireland unless they think they will hire you so if you managed to get an interview you probably will have a really good chance of getting the job.

Also, have you written a personal statement tailored to every school? If you send the same generic statement to schools it will go in the bin. I used to print off the person specification and tick off each item as I added them to the personal statement.

lofto

Thanks for the feedback! I'll start on some more applications, and see what happens..

ICANN

Hi I'm currently in London teaching and it's tough but worthwhile to get the NQT over and done with. I'm working as a supply teacher so I don't know if the hours I do will count towards it though.

Does anyone know how can we prove that we have done 300 hours of teaching in the uk?

clartharlear

The condition of Post-Qualification Employment currently applies to Post-Primary Teachers, i.e. those registered under Regulation Four.
In order to become fully registered as a Post-Primary teacher, an applicant must complete a period of Post-Qualification Employment (PQE). They must provide evidence of 300 hours' employment as a teacher in a recognised Post-Primary school; this is verified and signed by the school principal.

http://www.teachingcouncil.ie/_fileupload/Application%20Forms/FORM_B_12486111.pdf

highlights:

• Teaching employment as a substitute teacher is acceptable for the purposes of fulfilling this requirement.
• This form may be completed in respect of state recognised second-level schools in any state where the service has been deemed satisfactory
• Please complete Part A and Part B and Part C if teaching service has been completed outside of the Republic of Ireland.

redddbop

I'm moving to London next week and have registered with impactteachers.co.uk. I'm a primary school teacher with 7 years experience. I've been following some threads on the TES website on supply teaching in London and the UK in general. There seems to be a lot less work than in previous years thanks to budget cuts and more schools using cover supervisors instead of qualified teachers.
I was hoping for some replies from teachers currently registered with agencies in London who are getting work (or not) and if they would advise to apply directly to primary schools for supply work (and how to go about this).
I'm a little worried reading the forum posts on the TES site as I know how expensive it is to live in London.
I'm hoping to live in South London so would be looking in those areas.
I have also been looking at private schools and maybe visiting them directly looking for supply work. No stone unturned and all that.
Thanks in advance for replies....

ICANN

I'm currently doing secondary supply but have a few friends doing primary supply who are getting enough work.

Register with more than one agency (I'm with 4 but get most of my work with 2 but no harm in having the other just in case). I'd recommend Protocol Education and Sanza teaching also as they're quite big so have lots of schools on their books. These agencies always let you know when there are longer term/maternity positions coming up that you could go for.

I don't go to schools directly because most go through agencies as it makes getting paid and taxes easier etc.


If you need any info on supply teaching (the ins and outs of it) or moving to London don't hesitate in sending me a pm

heidigirl13

Leeds is a great place to live and work- it is a much cheaper standard of living up north and easy to fly home too

lestat21

Im similarly thinking of moving to England to work but im waiting til next September because something might come up with the number of teachers retiring... Alot of secondary teachers are retiring in Feb but remaining in the school until June so exam years will not be disrupted.

I was wondering if anyone here had used the Impactteachers agencies, I've heard some good reports about them but Id be interested if anyone could share their experiences.

ICANN

lestat21 wrote: »

Im similarly thinking of moving to England to work but im waiting til next September because something might come up with the number of teachers retiring... Alot of secondary teachers are retiring in Feb but remaining in the school until June so exam years will not be disrupted.

I was wondering if anyone here had used the Impactteachers agencies, I've heard some good reports about them but Id be interested if anyone could share their experiences.

I'm with impact and have only gotten 3 days work with them as opposed to with protocol and A star who have kept me going since the school year began back in September. It could be because they don't deal with many schools in the area where I live though.

kraggy

Are there many primary teaching jobs in England these days?

kboc

I worked in london;

www.tes.co.uk is the place to find a job.

I worked in West London were there is many good schools with many Irish influences, teachers and pupils from irish families, so you will feel right at home.
Schools/Areas to consider without naming any particular ones!!!!!,
Hammersmith, a top notch state all girls' school, i think tony blairs daugther
went to this one,
Another top notch all girls' convent school in Isleworth
An excellent all boys' school in Brentford at TW8
An outstanding mixed school in Hounslow West London at TW3


Try and get a permanent job rather than supply, as you will have the obvious benefits of sick pay etc., but the SMT will throw all the cover of the day our way if you are a supply!

Jobs are definitely more scarce in more recent times, but you should get a job if you make a good impression. As a previous poster said, look up OFSTED for their report on each school.

It might be worth your while ringing up the school and ask to speak to the Principal, if you don't get him or her, ask to speak to the Head of Department of your subject, ask them for a job, tell them you are eager, and you would have no problem in teaching a sample lesson to one of their classes (this is common practice in England) as part of an interview.

Enjoy, a great place to cut your teeth as a teacher, you will learn far more than anywhere in Ireland.

lestat21

ICANN wrote: »

I'm with impact and have only gotten 3 days work with them as opposed to with protocol and A star who have kept me going since the school year began back in September. It could be because they don't deal with many schools in the area where I live though.

Well done Icann, but I was looking more for full time work in England. Im a secondary school teacher of Maths and History but Im not gettin much of a look in in Ireland because I lack essential experience. Does anyone know which agencies are good for getting full time post primary work? Any comments on Impactteachers or Uteach??

clartharlear

If you teach maths, you shouldn't have too much difficulty finding your own full time job. Agencies are more hassle than they're worth in the long run!

Bobsammy

I'm a Maths teacher and spent some time working in Kent through UTeach. They're fine to deal with and helped me sort out the admin stuff like NI numbers and GTCE registration but they tend to recruit for tough schools which find it difficult to get staff.

lestat21

clartharlear wrote: »

If you teach maths, you shouldn't have too much difficulty finding your own full time job. Agencies are more hassle than they're worth in the long run!

I have an honours degree with honours maths as a final year subject. Despite this, Im unemployed this academic year because there are so many experienced teachers out there. I assumed England would have a similar situation and I'd have a better chance of getting work through an agency... Or maybe Im just used of people looking down on me because of my lack of experience..

ICANN

lestat21 wrote: »

Well done Icann, but I was looking more for full time work in England. Im a secondary school teacher of Maths and History but Im not gettin much of a look in in Ireland because I lack essential experience. Does anyone know which agencies are good for getting full time post primary work? Any comments on Impactteachers or Uteach??

I'd agree with what people say about looking for a full time post on the tes.co.uk website. The thing about going through an agency like impact or uteach is that they can get you a full time position but you will more than likely have to do a bit of short term work first. Often agencies like these put ads up for jobs which don't actually exist.

raytray

Lack of experience should be an advantage in the UK. You are far cheaper to employ than an experienced teacher. Teachers salaries are taken from the school budget so with cuts money is tight so they look for people from the bottom end of the scale.

clartharlear

Bobsammy wrote: »

I'm a Maths teacher and spent some time working in Kent through UTeach. They're fine to deal with and helped me sort out the admin stuff like NI numbers and GTCE registration but they tend to recruit for tough schools which find it difficult to get staff.

Funny, I went through uteach, and they gave me no help with NI and GTCE and were quite snooty when I did ask for help with them. I'm still not registered with the GTCE actually, but the NI was really easy to sort out myself.
I wouldn't recommend uteach. I signed up with the website and had an interview and a fulltime job offer in a decent school (to teach physics, I also teach maths) within a week, which was good.
However, I get paid less than I would if I was directly employed and it is frankly irritating to have to fill out two separate time sheets and post one to the agency pay section and fax the other to uteach every week. Two more pieces of paperwork...

It depends a bit on the timescale you need. The main interview and hiring time is February/March, and that's for starting in the next academic year.

lestat21

raytray wrote: »

Lack of experience should be an advantage in the UK. You are far cheaper to employ than an experienced teacher. Teachers salaries are taken from the school budget so with cuts money is tight so they look for people from the bottom end of the scale.

That is so screwed up but brilliant for someone in my situation!! A question for people who have experience working in the UK - what kind of supports would a school provide for an inexperienced foreign teacher??
I mean in terms of adjusting to and maybe even training in the unfamilar curriculum...
Also would anyone know where to find the gcse and alevel maths syllabi?? Iv had a quick look online but couldnt find them

clartharlear

lestat21 wrote: »

raytray wrote: »

Lack of experience should be an advantage in the UK. You are far cheaper to employ than an experienced teacher. Teachers salaries are taken from the school budget so with cuts money is tight so they look for people from the bottom end of the scale.

That is so screwed up but brilliant for someone in my situation!! A question for people who have experience working in the UK - what kind of supports would a school provide for an inexperienced foreign teacher??
I mean in terms of adjusting to and maybe even training in the unfamilar curriculum...
Also would anyone know where to find the gcse and alevel maths syllabi?? Iv had a quick look online but couldnt find them

the system is pretty different in the uk.instead of a state exam commission, they have several different exam boards, and even within one board, they offer several different qualifications.I think there are at least ten different qualifications under gcse physics, either on different topics or else slightly different takes on the same. times that by two for higher and foundation. And gcse is just one of the three secondary key stages...
It's immensely confusing!

raytray

As Clartharlear said there are a number of different boards all with their own specifications and numerous courses for the same subjects- OCR, AQA, WJEC, Edexcel and I think a Northern Irish one too. Just check out their websites and have a look but really it is very confusing until you get into a school and find out exactly what specification they are following.
I think it depends on the school as to what kind of support you get. My school would be considered supportive and I did a couple of courses for GCSE science and A level biology for NQTs and a general year induction to the school. If you really wanted you could ask a school to put you through the NQT year (it would not get you a cert or anything but you would have a mentor so some people like this). However at the end of the day it's really just down to the teacher themselves learning the syllabus, doing exam paper to get familiar with marking schemes etc. They just expect you to get on with it and ask questions when you are stuck. If you were to teach in the UK it is no harm going in and observing lessons during your frees. I do it all the time if I haven't taught a topic before or done a particular practical. They are very open with this kind of thing.
Beware though, England is very exam focused and at the end of the day you are judged on your results (in a lot of places anyway) so as a foreign teacher it's also good to mark exam papers to help with this.

lestat21

Thanks Raytay and Clartharlear, I was just gona do some prep b4 applying for jobs in case questions on syllabus come up in the interview bt it mite be best to wait like ye say... it does sound very different bt I like been exam focused and im not afraid of putting the work in!! Il def look sum more into the NQT year, raytay.

Thanks again for answering all my (fairly basic) questions

allprops

Worth doing a bit of research into where you want to go. A long long time ago when I was just finished the dip. I worked in England. Catholic schools were very open to Irish teachers at the time. Because they were semi-selective, the teaching wasn't as tough as the Lea schools. It was a great training in terms of getting yourself organised. I made millions of mistakes but It was the making of me as a young nqt.

marilynhappy

This has been really helpful to me also, thanks all for posting. It can be difficult to balance the negatives and positives when you have no experience of the UK system.

HiberniaSJ

I am graduating from Hibernia college Dublin next month and due to the lack of jobs in Ireland, I am planning to move to London this Summer to start work as primary teacher in school over there in Sep. I have already registered to a couple of agencies and all promised lots of work. I really want to get my Induction year complete over there, so I contacted the Irish teaching council who informed me that I CAN complete this over in London and to just provide them with the papers when I eventually come home to be recognised over here. However, after talking to the GTC on the phone, the man informed me that no we can not complete our induction over there. He said that we can only work as an unqualified teacher over there. I found this weird since both the Irish teaching council and the many different agencies never mentioned this.
Can anybody share their experiences with me? Irish teachers completing their induction in London?

Also one more question.... one of the agencies said that most principals don't like hiring NQT unless they have done some supply work for them. This agency kept saying that we should really do supply work first. But this doesn't suit as Induction year is FULL SCHOOL YEAR. It is hard to know who to trust!

Thanks in advance for anyones help on these matters!!

lestat21

What are the requirements for induction in ireland?? I know post primary teachers have to complete 300 hours in 3 years. You can count subbing hours towards this as you dont have to be in the same school for an extended period of time. I was also thinking of moving over and I found out that if I completed 300 hours in england then it counted towards my PQE here. This meant that I didnt have to complete the induction year in england unless the school I went to specifically wanted all NQTs to complete this year.

HiberniaSJ

In Ireland for Primary you only have to teach for 100 days, but in England it is 3 full school terms, so the Teaching Council here said if we are doing it in England we must complete the full induction period there.

clartharlear

lestat21 wrote: »

What are the requirements for induction in ireland?? I know post primary teachers have to complete 300 hours in 3 years. You can count subbing hours towards this as you dont have to be in the same school for an extended period of time. I was also thinking of moving over and I found out that if I completed 300 hours in england then it counted towards my PQE here. This meant that I didnt have to complete the induction year in england unless the school I went to specifically wanted all NQTs to complete this year.

The Irish TC "form b" has a section for having done your 300 hours abroad.
I got my form stamped by my school in England, sent it to the TC and got a cert of full registration straight away. The least complicated interaction I've ever had with the TC!

delta_bravo

HiberniaSJ wrote: »

In Ireland for Primary you only have to teach for 100 days, but in England it is 3 full school terms, so the Teaching Council here said if we are doing it in England we must complete the full induction period there.

Hmm that doesn't sound right. The whole EU accreditation thing generally makes you follow the requirement of your home nation rather than the country you are working in.

UnLuckyAgain

Anyone know what the process is now that the GTC in England is gone and replaced with the Teaching Agency? Their information states that teachers no longer have to register with them and pay no registration fee?

Do you still need to apply to technically get QTS for recognition here in Ireland?

lestat21

Hey UnluckyAgain, were you able to find out what the story is with the GTC in England?? Not just for people like myself thinking of moving, but with the TC in Ireland reducing their fee it looks like they might be heading in the same direction here. I know theyre getting more involved in induction and professional guidelines but I just cant see it working out in the long run.

At least people in charge are realising that these organisations arent value for money and have very little impact on the reality of teaching. I emailed the Irish TC 6 weeks ago and again this week but still no reply ... was jst a simple question about the form b... I want my 90 euro back

UnLuckyAgain

lestat21 wrote: »

Hey UnluckyAgain, were you able to find out what the story is with the GTC in England?? Not just for people like myself thinking of moving, but with the TC in Ireland reducing their fee it looks like they might be heading in the same direction here. I know theyre getting more involved in induction and professional guidelines but I just cant see it working out in the long run.

At least people in charge are realising that these organisations arent value for money and have very little impact on the reality of teaching. I emailed the Irish TC 6 weeks ago and again this week but still no reply ... was jst a simple question about the form b... I want my 90 euro back

No I couldn't get any new information, I also emailed the TC here but haven't heard back yet. Might try ringing them tomorrow during their extremely accommodating 12-2 phoneline hours :rolleyes:

sparklyEyes111

HiberniaSJ wrote: »

I am graduating from Hibernia college Dublin next month and due to the lack of jobs in Ireland, I am planning to move to London this Summer to start work as primary teacher in school over there in Sep. I have already registered to a couple of agencies and all promised lots of work. I really want to get my Induction year complete over there, so I contacted the Irish teaching council who informed me that I CAN complete this over in London and to just provide them with the papers when I eventually come home to be recognised over here. However, after talking to the GTC on the phone, the man informed me that no we can not complete our induction over there. He said that we can only work as an unqualified teacher over there. I found this weird since both the Irish teaching council and the many different agencies never mentioned this.
Can anybody share their experiences with me? Irish teachers completing their induction in London?

Also one more question.... one of the agencies said that most principals don't like hiring NQT unless they have done some supply work for them. This agency kept saying that we should really do supply work first. But this doesn't suit as Induction year is FULL SCHOOL YEAR. It is hard to know who to trust!

Thanks in advance for anyones help on these matters!!

This whole thing is so confusing. I talked to the TC fast to face last year in college before I finished , and one of the members that came said you cannot do the Dip anywhere outside Ireland anymore, but only in exceptional cases sometimes, people do complete it through the english system. How then, do people become these exceptional cases.? Thats what he said to me any way. I would have moved if I thought I could complete my dip else where. . .it's impossible to get even long term subbing for a few weeks these days, never mind the dip . . . would be great to get it done but stilll, Dubai is on the horizon for me this september any way. . would be great to know though if you could for sure in England.