Which union to join?

Esoteric_

Hey guys, sorry if this doesn't belong here but it seemed to be the most appropriate place!

I work in retail, but in the food industry. I want to join a union, but I'm not sure which to join. Everyone is telling me to join Mandate or SIPTU, but neither of them appear to take on food industry workers. I've googled to no avail.

So can anyone tell me what union I should be joining, or what unions deal with food industry workers? And if anyone could give me an idea of what unions do, how they work, etc, I'd appreciate it, as I'm only joining because I've basically been told that everyone should join a union in case of any issues in work

So any information would be great! Thanks guys

Delancey

In my experience unions are a total waste of ( your ) money - I certainly would never subscribe to one again.
Frankly fxxk all use when it matters as far as I'm concerned.

Esoteric_

Delancey wrote: »

In my experience unions are a total waste of ( your ) money - I certainly would never subscribe to one again.
Frankly fxxk all use when it matters as far as I'm concerned.

I appreciate the input, but that's not really what I asked, I want information on what they do and which one I should be joining, as I need representation.

Delancey

What union ( if any ) are your colleagues in ?
I would suggest joining whatever union they belong to , however if they are not in a union there really is very little practical value to joining one , if you are the only one in a union then management will probably refuse to deal with you via your union rep ( something they are entitled to do ).

Are your colleagues unionised ?

sarkozy

Delancey wrote: »

In my experience unions are a total waste of ( your ) money - I certainly would never subscribe to one again.
Frankly fxxk all use when it matters as far as I'm concerned.

A predictable comment.

Ask your colleagues of it you're not sure, I wonder if a call to ICTU would point you in the right direction.

UDP

Delancey wrote: »

In my experience unions are a total waste of ( your ) money - I certainly would never subscribe to one again.
Frankly fxxk all use when it matters as far as I'm concerned.

That may be true in certain industries and I would have thought similarly except recently my mother has been in a situation where she would have be truely screwed over only for she has a union behind her.

She is a primary school secretary and principals all over the country are trying to bully the secretaries into signing a contract that gives the boards of management a lot of power over the secretaries without giving anything in return back.

Also the department of education a few months ago sent out a notice requesting that ancillary staff take a pay cut in line with the public service staff even though the ancillary staff are not employed by the department (like teachers and SNAs) nor do they enjoy ANY of the benefits of being a public service worker.

As a result the chairman of the board of management and the principal are trying to force these upon secretaries making it difficult for secretaries to argue back due to the close working relationship they have with the principals and because they are just one staff member taking on the principal and board of management.

This is just one example of an industry that needs the protection of unions. There are plenty more.

OP, have you tried contacting the unions in question? Also are any of your colleagues in a union?

Lumbo

You could always ask your employer. They will either have a Union which the reconigise as having negotiation rights on behalf of their employees or they'll tell you they don't recognise Unions.

mikemac

Not much point in you joining on your own, what are your comrades in the workplace in?

I would think Mandate would be typical for your area

Lumbo

mikemac wrote: »

Not much point in you joining on your own, what are your comrades in the workplace in?

I would think Mandate would be typical for your area

SIPTU or UNITE would probably be better bets.

Esoteric_

Thanks for the responses, guys!

There is nobody in my specific shop in a union, not too sure about the other shops around the country. However, several of us are joining together, as we know that to be represented properly, you really do need more than one person, and we all anticipate the need for representation in the future. My employers are not people I could ask about a union tbh, I have no idea if they recognise them or not, but I'm not in a position where I could risk asking (don't want to give too much away here so I can't say more).

What happens if a company refuses to recognise a union? I'll try emailing mandate, but their website says they don't represent food service workers, and I'll email SIPTU and ICTU, too.

Can anyone tell me what, if anything, a union typically does? I'm really clueless on this but after speaking to several people about some issues, I'm being strongly advised to join one.

Delancey

As I understand it a company does not have to recognise a union , that is not to say an employer can prevent you joining one but it means that they can ignore it.
For example I worked in a US multinational that did not recognise unions . I could have joined one but when it came to pay rises , work practices, etc mangement dealt with on a one to one basis and being in a union was worthless.

I would have thought MANDATE would be the union applicable to you , be aware that just because your colleagues say they want to join a union doesn't mean they will join , in those circumstances you may not want to be the only member and possibly draw ' heat ' on yourself.

Without knowing the specifics it's only possible to give a very general idea what unions do - in a nutshell they represent their members and will meet with your mangement to adress areas of concern be they relating to pay , conditions , etc.
They often will also represent members involved in disciplinary proceedings.

I don't withdraw my earlier comments , I was a union member and frankly found it to be a waste of time and more to the point , my money , that was the union I was in ( branch secretary has since been kicked out for embezzling funds ) and I would never join a union again but then others have had more positive experiences than me.

ICTU should definitely be able to advise you on the appropriate union to speak to.

RATM

Delancey wrote: »

In my experience unions are a total waste of ( your ) money - I certainly would never subscribe to one again.
Frankly fxxk all use when it matters as far as I'm concerned.

Union fees are tax deductible so they don't end up costing anything, except the time to fill in a form and freepost it to revenue.

Also I wouldn't be too disparaging of unions, especially in lower paid jobs where employers are constantly sniping at wages and conditions. In these types of scenarios they can prove invaluable.

For example Mandate unionised premises typically page wages in the order of 20% more than non-union shops. When you're on €9 or €10 an hour an extra 20% is a massive difference to your standard of living.

KCTK

Tax deductions for union fees was abolished in the last budget, so whatever you now pay is a full cost to you.

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/credits/trade-union-subscriptions.html

Bandana boy

RATM wrote: »

Union fees are tax deductible so they don't end up costing anything, except the time to fill in a form and freepost it to revenue.

Also I wouldn't be too disparaging of unions, especially in lower paid jobs where employers are constantly sniping at wages and conditions. In these types of scenarios they can prove invaluable.

For example Mandate unionised premises typically page wages in the order of 20% more than non-union shops. When you're on €9 or €10 an hour an extra 20% is a massive difference to your standard of living.

They still cost something you only get tax relief on the cost of your sub.
And as you stated if your on a low paying job then your not paying top tax rate so your seeing an even smaller tax relief.

Also as mentioned that relief is now gone

The Unions in Ireland are really poor value for money
The wages they pay themselves are obnoxious and on the most part you can expect to neither see or hear from your rep from one end of the year to the next.
If a large dispute happens they will get involved but unless its a fully unionized company that can threaten to go on strike ,they offer very little of substance to the average worker.
The model has several flaws
For example if your company closes and they are there to negotiate your redundancy ,as you paid up front the incentive for them to bargain hard for your deal is gone. They often over react to small changes (often needed to keep a company a going concern ) because they need you to keep paying your subs often to the long term detriment of Both employee and employer.
In companies with large union membership ,the employer often has to recruit staff to deal with the union.this is skimming money from the wage pool on the employer side ,as well as on your take home pay

The number of union members has steadily decreased in Ireland since the 80s as the companies they have been involved in have nearly all closed.They are really a public sector/semi state entity these days.

The only real success they have is in collective bargaining ,but again this usually favors nonperforming employees who cannot negotiate on there own at the expense of top performing employees whose performance is not taken into account in pay reviews.
If they are "successful" in these negotiations "getting more" from the employer on pay ,long term this leads to the company becoming non competitive and closing or relocating.Of course the company does not even have to recognize the union ,so this bargaining on your behalf might never come into effect.
If the company is reluctant to allow a union organize ,then your joining it could hamper your career prospects long term.

Why not instead of starting a union ,approach the management team in an open and collaborative manner with what you would like changed and what the advantages are to both sides?