Is this legal?

Iwannahurl

Is this right turn legal?

Let's say the driver of the car (top of photo) wishes to either park alongside the kerb (left of photo) or else do a u-turn, is crossing the broken line at this point a legal manoeuvre?

I know parking against the flow of traffic is not officially recommended, and that parking alongside a continuous white line is supposedly illegal, but the fact is that parking happens here anyway.

However, I am only interested in whether it is legal to turn right as indicated by the arrow.

Traffic exiting the premises on the right is permitted to turn right.

If the turn indicated by the arrow is legal, is there any reference in law or the RoTR that makes it clear?

squod

Two broken lines at that point. I guess so.

johnos1984

I always assumed U-Turns were illegal

Could be wrong though

CiniO

I don't think you will find any reference in law, as most things that are permitted are not mentioned anywhere.

Generally if something is not forbidden, than you can do it.
U turning here doesn't seem to be forbidden here (to my knowledge).

challengemaster

Up with the handbrake and away ya go shure.

johnos1984

challengemaster wrote: »

Up with the handbrake and away ya go shure.

Sure if no one is looking

challengemaster

johnos1984 wrote: »

Sure if no one is looking

I love the way you instantly started a thread on it, LOL :pac:

CiniO

johnos1984 wrote: »

Sure if no one is looking

Could someone be fined for doing handbrake turn on empty road? (assuming no other cars in motion there)?
I'm asking seriously!

johnos1984

challengemaster wrote: »

I love the way you instantly started a thread on it, LOL :pac:

:D

I used to do it messing when I was younger out on the farm but didn't want to try in the Passat in case I fooked the brakes

johnos1984

CiniO wrote: »

Could someone be fined for doing handbrake turn on empty road? (assuming no other cars in motion there)?
I'm asking seriously!

Yep.

Dangerous driving

challengemaster

CiniO wrote: »

Could someone be fined for doing handbrake turn on empty road? (assuming no other cars in motion there)?
I'm asking seriously!

More than likely if you're unlucky enough that a garda sees you. I reckon either dangerous driving (which would be downgraded to careless driving in reality) or driving without due care and attention.

CiniO

johnos1984 wrote: »

:D

I used to do it messing when I was younger out on the farm but didn't want to try in the Passat in case I fooked the brakes

Why would they get fooked?

johnos1984

CiniO wrote: »

Why would they get fooked?

In the Passat the electric handbrake is temperamental enough with giving it reason to break.

Mine have been fine but don't want to cause unnecessary damage

CiniO

challengemaster wrote: »

More than likely if you're unlucky enough that a garda sees you. I reckon either dangerous driving (which would be downgraded to careless driving in reality) or driving without due care and attention.

:mad:
Bad news.

On the other hand - how could they class it as driving without due care and attention.
For doing handbrake turn you need extra care and attention to do it properly

CiniO

johnos1984 wrote: »

In the Passat the electric handbrake is temperamental enough with giving it reason to break.

Mine have been fine but don't want to cause unnecessary damage

Allright.
I didn't know it was electrical in passat.

Does it work on rear wheels?

vetstu

It's ok to cross the lines there. They are broken for the entrance at the blue walls - Coming out and turning right

johnos1984

CiniO wrote: »

Allright.
I didn't know it was electrical in passat.

Does it work on rear wheels?

Yep.

It's been known to get stuck in the on position.

I know if you hold the button pressed they will come on when the car is above a certain speed I just can't see it being as controllable as a normal handbrake as you have to press the brake pedal (all 4 wheel) to deactivate the handbrake

CiniO

johnos1984 wrote: »

Yep.

It's been known to get stuck in the on position.

I know if you hold the button pressed they will come on when the car is above a certain speed I just can't see it being as controllable as a normal handbrake as you have to press the brake pedal (all 4 wheel) to deactivate the handbrake

Yeah, that seems to be a bit tricky allright.
Only car with electric handbrake I drove was Prius, but in that one hand brake was on front wheel, so no joy using it for handbrake turns.

Victor

You aren't allowed travel ont eh wrong side of the road where there are solid white lines / ghost islands. To cross the road to park would require that. You are not allowed park within 5 metres of a junction (is this a junction or an entrance).

It is distinctly imprudent to do a u-turn where there are solid white lines. You may have to stop in the middle of the manouvre, which is something that people won't expect at such a junction.

One possiblly better manouvre would be to pull in to the side road and then make a right turn.

CiniO wrote: »

On the other hand - how could they class it as driving without due care and attention.
For doing handbrake turn you need extra care and attention to do it properly

The car is moving and you aren't in proper control.

johnos1984

Victor wrote: »

The car is moving and you aren't in control.

That's debatable but as a general point (for normal drivers like me) it's true

CiniO

Victor wrote: »

The car is moving and you aren't in control.

The fact that car is actually skidding, doesn't mean that driver is not in control of the vehicle.

Anyone trying to do handbrake turn in public place if they can't control a car while doing it, must be complete mad.

But after some practice, you can be doing it with full control.

johnos1984

CiniO wrote: »

But after some practice, you can be doing it with full control.

Pretty true

I used to be able to do some pretty mad stuff on the farm in all types of cars and machinery but I'm very much out of practice now. That and the electrics on the Passat let things go to far before I realise something is wrong.

I have an MGF with no electronics and it's far easier to control when you push on as you know whats going on with the tyres

CiniO

johnos1984 wrote: »

Pretty true

I used to be able to do some pretty mad stuff on the farm in all types of cars and machinery but I'm very much out of practice now. That and the electrics on the Passat let things go to far before I realise something is wrong.

I have an MGF with no electronics and it's far easier to control when you push on as you know whats going on with the tyres

Pretty much for that kind of stuff you need an older car without any electronics, or anything newer adequately modified electronics-wise.

I remember 2 years ago I managed to turn of ABS on my Mondeo MK3 just by taking the fuse off.
It was absolutely gorgous to do skids on bendy roads using left foot braking.
Then whenever I needed to return to normal traffic I was putting fuse back on.


Handbrake though is better for slower and tighter turns, like here (almost 4 years ago i one of amateur rallies in Poland):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTTbdeVAohM

Victor

CiniO wrote: »

The fact that car is actually skidding, doesn't mean that driver is not in control of the vehicle.

One wouldn't have proper control.

Anyone trying to do handbrake turn in public place if they can't control a car while doing it, must be complete mad.

But after some practice, you can be doing it with full control.

But ona public road, you may not be fully aware of what is on the surface, even if you use the road every day e.g. gravel, oil, other users, etc.

I don't think they should be done unless you also control the road

CiniO

Victor wrote: »

One wouldn't have proper control.

But ona public road, you may not be fully aware of what is on the surface, even if you use the road every day e.g. gravel, oil, other users, etc.

If there is gravel you should see it. Oil shouldn't be there, and if it is, you might skid anyway without a need for any handbrake, left foot braking, or excessive speed. Other road users should be seen by you as well.




Heh I remember arguing about it with policeman when he stopped me after skidding into my housing estate (I was maybe 19 then).
He wanted to issue me with fixed penalty for as he described: "endangering other road users".
I told him, there was no other road users around (this was middle of the night), so I couldn't endanger anyone.
Anyway he didn't agree with my opinion.

I don't think they should be done unless you also control the road

I generally agree.
I'm trying to be responsible driver now, so whenever I do it, I make sure there is no other people around, which means there is no guards as well
That way kept me quite problemless for last 8 years.