Look I Just Jumped the Shark!

Motley Crue

So here we have three songs, on the face of it these songs have NOTHING in common, but they're all related.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alVf0BuN590

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6QGP0OUaV4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbmgsUAn3nk

These songs all represent three occassions on which these illustrious bands, leaders in their chosen fields, sold out....or did they?

A lot of people in America got really abusive when Metallica released Load in 1996, and the same people now object against Machine Head releasing a "power ballad", but what I want to know is what you guys think about a band "jumping the shark" to use an American expression and basically selling themselves out, supposedly, by betraying their loyal fans?

Do you see a band, who are established in a certain genre, releasing experimental music as a betryal or sell out - can you think Machine Head releasing this track is bad enough, but performing it live or appearing on Radio One's Live Lounge playing it would be appauling and crossing the line? Do you think Metallica sold out years ago before Mama Said and this made little difference, or do you think Queen betrayed their fans when the band went "a little too funk" in 1981?

And for those who don't understand the term, please read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

D.Q

Motley Crue wrote: »

So here we have three songs, on the face of it these songs have NOTHING in common, but they're all related.



These songs all represent three occassions on which these illustrious bands, leaders in their chosen fields, sold out....or did they?

A lot of people in America got really abusive when Metallica released Load in 1996, and the same people now object against Machine Head releasing a "power ballad", but what I want to know is what you guys think about a band "jumping the shark" to use an American expression and basically selling themselves out, supposedly, by betraying their loyal fans?

Do you see a band, who are established in a certain genre, releasing experimental music as a betryal or sell out - can you think Machine Head releasing this track is bad enough, but performing it live or appearing on Radio One's Live Lounge playing it would be appauling and crossing the line? Do you think Metallica sold out years ago before Mama Said and this made little difference, or do you think Queen betrayed their fans when the band went "a little too funk" in 1981?

And for those who don't understand the term, please read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

This is something that really annoys me. Fans that act like this seem to think that just because they bought a cd, they should have some sort of creative input into what a band does.

Music is art and musicians are artists. They should be free to do as they please. If a band wants to release a metal album, then an acoustic album, that is their choice.

I always welcome an evolution of a bands musical style. People say they are selling out, but look at the likes of slayer and acdc, and even maiden. These are the bands that people say "stick to their guns", when in reality, they have found a formula that works, and continue to use it for financial benefits.

Bands that change their sound are NOT selling out. They are just trying something different as musicians. Take Metallica as an example, people scorned them for trying something new, but if they hadn't tried something new back in the early 80's, ie. a ballad on a metal album, they wouldnt be the band they are today.

If you want a band to only play the style of music you want to play, there is a very simple solution, start your own fucking band.

Welsh Megaman

You could say a majority of the glam metal/hair metal bands jumped the shark when grunge arrived - less songs about sweet Cherry Pie and Girls Girls Girls

Swapping spandex and Aqua-net for flannel and stubble - Love/Hate, Bulletboys, Danger Danger, Skid Row, Tuff, Warrant - the list is endless.

EL_Loco

where would you then get the opportunity to say "but I prefer their earlier stuff"?

Bands are people, people get bored, people like to try new things. I think AC/DC are about the only crowd to stick to their sound and style over and over. (I'm sure there are others, but just as an example) so hats off to them. I don't mind a change in direction from a band, if you're not happy stick with their older stuff.

lastly, anyone using the term "jump the shark" should be forced to do so in real life. :-p I've yet to see it used consistently as meaning anything, it's almost a "when in Rome" ala the film anchorman.

nyarlothothep

Is it so bad to sell out? If you're a struggling musician and you just want to make some money for the future is there any real shame in adapting the sounds of the mainstream to your own style? Being a musician is hard work and badly paid, people who whinge about bands selling out don't know what its like.

On the issue of Metallica, they never sold out imo, Led Zeppelin wrote songs with a country influence, did they sell out? The Black Album which is a very good album, was an experimentation in writing very catchy direct songs as a departure away from the complex song structures of AJFA. They were experimenting with a different style of songwriting, that's not selling out. And they got tired of the thrash sound it would seem during the 90s, so they wrote slower more mellow mid tempo songs, no big deal. Also one thing that really grinds my gears are people who say that Hetfield is a better guitarist than Hammet, stop trying to sound cool with the pretence of knowledge, Hetfield is a good rhythm guitarist, Hammet is better at lead, both are different types of players, one isn't any better than the other!

In relation to Queen, their sound got more commercial, in fact I recall May once saying they never had any disputes with the record label execs because they were thinking along similar lines, We Will Rock You was written specifically to sell and to be a football chant. So maybe they did sell out a bit but then again, can you blame people for wanting the nice things in life? I know I'd sell out for nice things.

Furious-Red

I will admit i was kinda one of those people that when i heard Green Days American Idiot album i thought wow these guys are sell outs. However over the last number of years i take that back.

As a musician myself i like seeing bands evolve or try something new. Bands might take into account "ok well our last few records have been doing good , but we are still playing the same size gigs or venues so what next?" . When you start off in a band you might just like one genre and that could be what your band sounds like but after awhile you either play gigs with other bands or you listen to other bands and go "oh that kinda sounds good" and it changes their influences . So they might say lets try something new for the next record and try push the barrier and become bigger.
In saying that a lot of bands are happy not being that big and i respect that but people should not give out if other bands what to try out other sounds.

Since being in a well know band , it becomes your job so if you are not happy doing one thing you could go try something else , just like if you didnt like your job you could look for a new one

Mental Mickey

nyarlothothep wrote: »

Is it so bad to sell out? If you're a struggling musician and you just want to make some money for the future is there any real shame in adapting the sounds of the mainstream to your own style? Being a musician is hard work and badly paid, people who whinge about bands selling out don't know what its like.

On the issue of Metallica, they never sold out imo, Led Zeppelin wrote songs with a country influence, did they sell out? The Black Album which is a very good album, was an experimentation in writing very catchy direct songs as a departure away from the complex song structures of AJFA. They were experimenting with a different style of songwriting, that's not selling out. And they got tired of the thrash sound it would seem during the 90s, so they wrote slower more mellow mid tempo songs, no big deal. Also one thing that really grinds my gears are people who say that Hetfield is a better guitarist than Hammet, stop trying to sound cool with the pretence of knowledge, Hetfield is a good rhythm guitarist, Hammet is better at lead, both are different types of players, one isn't any better than the other!

In relation to Queen, their sound got more commercial, in fact I recall May once saying they never had any disputes with the record label execs because they were thinking along similar lines, We Will Rock You was written specifically to sell and to be a football chant. So maybe they did sell out a bit but then again, can you blame people for wanting the nice things in life? I know I'd sell out for nice things.

Nail. On. The. Head.

Roanmore

Can never understand people saying Queen sold out especially around Another One Bites the Dust. If you consider their catalogue before that such as Bring Back That Leroy Brown, Seaside Rendezvouz, Good Company, none of them would be considered "typical" Queen songs.
Having said that I hate Backchat.

jack presley

I'm not a big believer of the 'Metallica Sell Out!!' argument but even if I was I wouldn't used Mama Said as the best example.

Selling out to me is doing something against what you've done before to increase your popularity. I don't think Mama Said set out to do this. While it was wildly different to anything they'd ever done before, it was hardly ever going to be the next Nothing Else Matters and I don't think Metallica believed it would attract a whole new audience. it was just something they wanted to do. James has always been a big country fan apparently

120_Minutes

I'm reminded of the lyrics to "hooker with a penis" by Tool.

bnt

The only one of those with which I'm familiar is the Queen, and this is them under pressure (!) to repeat the commercial success of Another One Bites The Dust. John Deacon wrote Back Chat too, and played all the instruments except for the drums. No wonder he's smiling in the video. :cool:

Mental Mickey

jack presley wrote: »

I'm not a big believer of the 'Metallica Sell Out!!' argument but even if I was I wouldn't used Mama Said as the best example.

Selling out to me is doing something against what you've done before to increase your popularity. I don't think Mama Said set out to do this. While it was wildly different to anything they'd ever done before, it was hardly ever going to be the next Nothing Else Matters and I don't think Metallica believed it would attract a whole new audience. it was just something they wanted to do. James has always been a big country fan apparently

Brilliant song, and hilarious video to boot.

hidinginthebush

120_Minutes wrote: »

I'm reminded of the lyrics to "hooker with a penis" by Tool.

That's the first thing that popped into my head too! Brilliant lyrics :cool:

hellyeah

I would not call a band a sellout just cause they change there sound or cut there hair!! One of my all time favorite bands is Paradise Lost. They have gone from trash/pop like radio friendly songs
and i like most of there work. I think its called evolution and without it the music industry would be dead and this thread would not exist.

RayCon

From the other point of view ....

Im a late comer to Anathema, only start listening to them upon the release of "We're Here Because ....." Ventured back through their catalogue as far as Judgement but no further yet.

Was listening to Crestfallen from their new orchestral reworkings album, Falling Deeper, and I thought "I like that , wonder what the original sounds like ?" ...

:eek: Flurk me its absolutely, stupidly, sh!te. Thank Christ they've moved on from that crap.

Same with Opeth ... There's a legion of Opeth fans currently disgusted with their new offering, Heritage.

Mental Mickey

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Testament1

Motley Crue wrote: »

These songs all represent three occassions on which these illustrious bands, leaders in their chosen fields, sold out....or did they?

the same people now object against Machine Head releasing a "power ballad",

I like Machine Head but in fairness they do change their style of music more than people change their clothes. They always seem to just go with whatever seems popular at the time.