Caught Drink Driving

stupid driver

My story is as follows.
I am currently based in the UK and had a wedding down the country, i hired a car for the weekend. The wedding was on saturday and i drove back to dublin on sunday morning. On the way back i drove into a ditch and damaged the car so it was stuck there. A squadcar came and after checking on me asked a few questions and brought me to the station and i was found to be over the limit.
Im not in any way excusing how stupid i was driving the next day but i would like to know what i have to look forward to on the court day and in dealing with the car hire company.
1) Do i have to arrange for a solicitor for my court date or will there be solicitors there on the day.
2) Im planning on pleading guilty and take my punishment unless there is a reason not to??
3) Apart from wearing smart clothing is there any advise what i should do or say on the day.
4) In my dealings with the car hire company they have said that because i was over the limit i am responsible for all charges, is this correct?
5) How do i verify the costs of the car hire compnay, is there anything i do at this early stage.
6) Does the fact i live outside the country have any implications.

Im not in anyway going to excuse how stupid i was and am willing to accept all the consequances coming my way , im just trying to educate myself as to the process.

Andrew33

Did the Gardai actually find you in the drivers seat? if you were outside the vehicle when they arrived you might be able to wriggle out of a drink driving charge. Seek proper legal advice immediately.

stupid driver

No i was out of the car when they arrived but i said i was driving the car.

Paulw

Get a good solicitor as soon as you can.

Milk & Honey

Get to a solicitor immediately. The test for alcohol must be administered within 3 hours of the driving. If you weren't seen driving you might have a chance. You probably broke your contract with the car hire company. They will sue for their money. You are entitled to see the vouched expenses.

Andrew33

stupid driver wrote: »

No i was out of the car when they arrived but i said i was driving the car.

Don't mind what you said at the scene, you were in shock. you took a swig from a hip flask after the crash.

andre2010

Get a solicitor straight away anyway. dont wait till the day itself. There will be plenty of solicitors there ready on the day if you dont have one, but then you leave no time to go through your story etc.

Plead guilty if you are in fact guilty. You wont be in front of the judge long, about 5-10 minutes, although it may take a few hours to get to you, there will be a list of people there on the day.

You will more than likely face a fine of about 1000 euro and your licence revoked for 2 years. If its an irish licence anyway, not sure what happens if its a british one.

If its your first offence, ask the solicitor to request the judge doesnt ban you from driving, but only if its first offence.

Wear a suit, definately. I was there for driving without insurance and the judge went much harder on the guys who turned up in tracksuits or jeans than the ones in suits. It shows respect. Plus dont make any excuse for what happened, hold your hands up , admit guilt and you will be fine.

And the car hire company are correct unfortunately, you are liable for all costs if you were drunk when driving. although if you live in the UK, not too sure how they can pursue you for it

Paulw

andre2010 wrote: »

If its your first offence, ask the solicitor to request the judge doesnt ban you from driving, but only if its first offence.

It's a manditory ban. The duration of the ban is determined by the judge.

Fighting Irish

andre2010 wrote: »

Get a solicitor straight away anyway. dont wait till the day itself. There will be plenty of solicitors there ready on the day if you dont have one, but then you leave no time to go through your story etc.

Plead guilty if you are in fact guilty. You wont be in front of the judge long, about 5-10 minutes, although it may take a few hours to get to you, there will be a list of people there on the day.

You will more than likely face a fine of about 1000 euro and your licence revoked for 2 years. If its an irish licence anyway, not sure what happens if its a british one.

If its your first offence, ask the solicitor to request the judge doesnt ban you from driving, but only if its first offence.

Wear a suit, definately. I was there for driving without insurance and the judge went much harder on the guys who turned up in tracksuits or jeans than the ones in suits. It shows respect. Plus dont make any excuse for what happened, hold your hands up , admit guilt and you will be fine.

And the car hire company are correct unfortunately, you are liable for all costs if you were drunk when driving. although if you live in the UK, not too sure how they can pursue you for it

I absolutely hate this carry on :mad:

stupid driver

Thanks for all the responses, really appreciate it.
Andre, it is my first offense and the first time ive ever been in trouble ( im 35) and im not looking to make any excuse at all.
Ill have to get myself a hipflask........ prob no need for for another 2 years though.

MagicSean

If you admitted to being the driver at the scene then that is admissable. You should see a solicitor. If you intend to follow the retarded advice that you should claim you drank after the incident then you should know that it is up to the defence to prove that you would not have been over the limit otherwise. It also requires you to lie to a judge which is never advisable.

charlies_boots

In the circumstances you probably should seek legal advice as there may not in fact be sufficient evidence for the prosecution to bring the case home if you contest it.

One of the proofs is evidence that you were both the driver and that the test was administered within three hours of driving.

Any admission that you made at the scene may not be admissible if the judge's rules weren't complied with (i.e you weren't properly cautioned prior to being asked if you were driving).

If the case is defended along these lines there is no necessity for you to lie to the court as an application would be made, prior to any evidence being called by you, for a direction that there is no case to answer.

stupid driver

Thanks for that Charlie, i wasnt cautioned at all at the scene it was only when i had to blow into the machine that they formally said i was under suspision of been under the influence.

charlies_boots

Don't tell me - get yourself a solicitor

Andrew33

MagicSean wrote: »

If you admitted to being the driver at the scene then that is admissable.

Not if he was in shock after the crash, most definitely not reliable. And its up to the State to prove he was over the limit behind the wheel. It's technicalities and splitting hairs but that's what a good solicitor will do to get their client off, poke holes in the States case. (I'm not saying he deserves to get off BTW). Boards is the last place he should be seeking advice.

the_syco

stupid driver wrote: »

4) In my dealings with the car hire company they have said that because i was over the limit i am responsible for all charges, is this correct?

Did you take out any insurance with the company, or do you have insurance yourself that would cover this? Something you should consider going through with your solicitor.

MagicSean

Andrew33 wrote: »

Not if he was in shock after the crash, most definitely not reliable. And its up to the State to prove he was over the limit behind the wheel. It's technicalities and splitting hairs but that's what a good solicitor will do to get their client off, poke holes in the States case. (I'm not saying he deserves to get off BTW). Boards is the last place he should be seeking advice.

This is what you said

Andrew33 wrote: »

Don't mind what you said at the scene, you were in shock. you took a swig from a hip flask after the crash.

You are advising him to lie to the court. Reckless at the least.

stupid driver

I am not going to and would not consider lying to the court nor am i looking to get off, im simply trying to educate myself. I will get in contact with a solicitor.
Thanks for all the replies.

Speak Now

stupid driver wrote: »

I am not going to and would not consider lying to the court nor am i looking to get off, im simply trying to educate myself. I will get in contact with a solicitor.
Thanks for all the replies.

How much over the limit? Between 50 and 80 miligrams is a fine and points but no ban. I'm guessing you were over 100 miligrams if you're going to court?

stupid driver

57 milligrams of alchol per 100 millilitres of breath, thought it was a 2 year ban.

CharlieCroker

you go to court regardless of the reading.

OP, if you're going to plead guilty tell your solicitor this from the off and get it dealt with on the day. If not, you're just paying him for nothing as he'll try to get as many court dates as possible to make his money (free legal aid isn't available for Section 49 (drunk driving)). Bare in mind that drink driving is the most contested piece of legislation in the country and every loophole has been discovered at this stage so getting off would require a howler from the guard in question.

If you've got an irish licence, you're looking at both a fine and a ban.

charlies_boots

CharlieCroker wrote: »

you go to court regardless of the reading.

OP, if you're going to plead guilty tell your solicitor this from the off and get it dealt with on the day. If not, you're just paying him for nothing as he'll try to get as many court dates as possible to make his money (free legal aid isn't available for Section 49 (drunk driving)). Bare in mind that drink driving is the most contested piece of legislation in the country and every loophole has been discovered at this stage so getting off would require a howler from the guard in question.

If you've got an irish licence, you're looking at both a fine and a ban.

This area is one of the most contested pieces of legislation hence the loopholes. There are so many of them that it is very difficult for the Gardaí to comply with them all. Of the contested cases I've been involved in I would say that approximately 50% of the cases have been defended successfully.

A decent solicitor won't advise you to run the case if there is a good chance of defending it as there is a mandatory disqualification even with a guilty plea meaning there is little incentive to plead guilty.

If you are worried about fees then discuss it with your solicitor in the initial consultation and get a written estimate from them.

Speak Now

stupid driver wrote: »

57 milligrams of alchol per 100 millilitres of breath, thought it was a 2 year ban.

CharlieCroker wrote: »

you go to court regardless of the reading.

OP, if you're going to plead guilty tell your solicitor this from the off and get it dealt with on the day. If not, you're just paying him for nothing as he'll try to get as many court dates as possible to make his money (free legal aid isn't available for Section 49 (drunk driving)). Bare in mind that drink driving is the most contested piece of legislation in the country and every loophole has been discovered at this stage so getting off would require a howler from the guard in question.

If you've got an irish licence, you're looking at both a fine and a ban.

I thought the the new laws mean a driver with a reading of between 50mg and 80mg will not be banned from driving but will receive three penalty points on their licence for a three-year period and an on the spot fine of € 200.

One month ago you'd have been under the limit.

Milk & Honey

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

I thought the the new laws mean a driver with a reading of between 50mg and 80mg will not be banned from driving but will receive three penalty points on their licence for a three-year period and an on the spot fine of € 200.

One month ago you'd have been under the limit.

You are confusing the blood alcohol level with the breath machine reading.
The old limit for breath was 35 which equate to 80 in blood. The o/p was well above the minimum even under the old limit. Given the alcohol reading, it is likely that the o/p consumed a large quantity of alcohol at the wedding and was badly hungover driving the day after the wedding.
The insurance will be of no avail as he will have breached the conditions attaching to it.

CharlieCroker

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

I thought the the new laws mean a driver with a reading of between 50mg and 80mg will not be banned from driving but will receive three penalty points on their licence for a three-year period and an on the spot fine of € 200.

One month ago you'd have been under the limit.

Thats 50-80mg of alcohol per 100ml of blood as per section 49(2) RTA whereas the OP was charged under Section 49(4) breath where the limit is 22microgrammes of alcohol per 100ml of breath. anything over 35microgrammes is an automatic ban.

slimjimmc

the_syco wrote: »

Did you take out any insurance with the company, or do you have insurance yourself that would cover this? Something you should consider going through with your solicitor.

I doubt it, many motor policies specifically state that accident claims are not covered if you are found to be over the legal alcohol limit.

OP, if you are convicted and ban imposed by a court, I believe the authorities here can apply to the UK authorities to have the ban recognised there too (under the mutual recognition agreement which came into effect in 2010, I think). That means you are also banned from driving in the UK. I don't think it's automatically sought though and probably won't occur where others weren't involved, but I'm not sure.

Pkiernan

OP - do not take the high road in this - you will regret it.

Fight it.

Absolute bull**** rule, and should be fought to the max (how come we never had all out carnage on the roads after every Irish football game under Jackie Charlton???).

You have ways out if the situation is as described.

If you don't fight it, in about 18 months you will be thinking - "Why the fu** didn't I fight?"

If you don't believe me, bookmark this page and revisit in 2013!

Oranage2

Probably best just fleeing op, many charges are dropped by the garda by people fleeing, worst thing they can do is put a warrant out for your arrest and they're hardly going to get interpol to drag you back to Ireland over a drink driving charge.

As for the rental car, you're insurance will most likely be void cause you were drink driving, you'll have to pay that as they have your credit card details.

Pkiernan

To the Judge - "I was not drunk whilst driving"

To the car hire company "I was not drunk whilst driving"

houseplant

Pkiernan wrote: »

OP - do not take the high road in this - you will regret it.

Fight it.

Absolute bull**** rule, and should be fought to the max (how come we never had all out carnage on the roads after every Irish football game under Jackie Charlton???).

You have ways out if the situation is as described.

If you don't fight it, in about 18 months you will be thinking - "Why the fu** didn't I fight?"

If you don't believe me, bookmark this page and revisit in 2013!

Wow! You're a real asset to the country. Are you giving this advice even though the op was drink driving?

My opinion is if you were drink driving then plead guilty and save everyone the money and time of dragging it through the courts.

and if you were taken to court unfairly and you were not drink driving then plead not guilty and clear your name.

Victor

You address the Judge as "Judge", "Yes, Judge", "No, Judge". Keep answer to the point, but get your solicitor to go through this with you.

It might be useful to get some alcohol awareness education before the day, demonstrate that you are worthy of lenience, e.g. you realise that you have done wrong and would like to apologise for wasting the court's and the State's time, you are making good the loss to the car hire company, you haven't done this before, you participate in society - you have a job, you do voluntary work with the disadvantaged, etc.

Fighting Irish wrote: »

I absolutely hate this carry on :mad:

Its about gravitas, about taking the matter seriously, not about how good your tailor is. Would the undertakers at a funeral get away with wearing tracksuits? If you can't afford a suit, have your solicitor plead poverty.

Victor

Pkiernan wrote: »

(how come we never had all out carnage on the roads after every Irish football game under Jackie Charlton???).

Eh, I'm not sure I'd completely agree with you there.

MagicSean

Just to clear up a few things op.

Failing to show up in court will result in a bench warrant for your arrest and a possible deniqal of bail when you are arrested in the future. They won't just drop the charges.

Lying to the court will result in a charge for perjury and most likely the maximum penalty being imposed in your drink driving case.

Your admission to being the driver will most likely be admissable despite not being cautioned as you were not suspected of drink driving at the time and there is no requirement to caution a person until they are suspected of something.

If you claim that you drank after the incident it will be up to your defence team to prove that this had an affect on the end result and you would not have been over the limit otherwise. In addition it leaves you open to a charge of frustrating a prosecution.

Getting a good solicitor and barrister is really the only way of contesting a drink driving case successfully. Listening to people on the internet is a bad way to form a defence. And wear decent clothing to the court.