New Build - 800euro budget

Dr Nic · 26-09-2011 3:03pm #1

Hi Guys,
This is going to be my 4th build or so...

800euro budget to run Autocad drawings and not much else.
Doesnt need a gaming processor or anything,

But i do want a solid state harddrive, + 1TB tape drive, + 23" monitor, 8gigs ram.

I got this the last time:
AMD Athlon II X3 450 "Boxed" 95W, Sockel AM3
No HV20X347DE 60,64 € 1 60,64 €
HKC Case 4673GD, mATX, 420Watt
No HV203H07DE 34,16 € 1 34,16 €
MSI 880GMA-E55, Sockel AM3, mATX, PCIe

Should i go with an i5? Or stay with AMD?

What do you think?
Thanks!

This is it so far....

Article No. HV21S24LDE entfernen
Samsung SyncMaster B2430L
ready for dispatch
141,36 €

141,36 €
Article No. HV20G325DE entfernen
8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9
ready for dispatch
33,65 €

33,65 €
Article No. HV1310F3DE entfernen
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ)
ready for dispatch
47,24 €

47,24 €
Article No. HV13OA21DE entfernen
OCZ SSD Agility 2 120GB 8,9cm (3,5")
ready for dispatch
150,14 €

150,14 €
Article No. HV207SBADE entfernen
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA
ready for dispatch
16,22 €

16,22 €
Article No. HVR550SADE entfernen
Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 550W
ready for dispatch
52,04 €

52,04 €
Article No. HV20I5K5DE entfernen
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155
ready for dispatch
182,69 €

182,69 €
Article No. HV1130RGDE entfernen
ASRock P67 Pro3 (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX
ready for dispatch
87,71 €

87,71 €
Article No. HV203NZUDE entfernen
Xigmatek Asgard, ATX, ohne Netzteil, schwarz
ready for dispatch
32,63 €

32,63 €

TOTAL - 743.68

Happy enough with it except i might go with the AMD instead of the i5?
Comments please?
Thanks!!!

deconduo · 26-09-2011 3:43pm

Did a bit of research on Autocad and found the following:

Its only threaded for a single core, so a quadcore won't help
2D doesn't use any GPU
3D benefits most from a DX11 card
RAM is most important.

With that in mind I would go with something like this:

Total build cost: €776.19 + €30 shipping
Xigmatek Asgard, ATX, ohne Netzteil, schwarz €32.63
Corsair Force3 120GB SSD 6,4cm (2,5") SATA €142.42
2 x 8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9 €33.65
Intel Core i3-2130 Box, LGA1155 €121.74
MSI PH67S-C43 (B3), Intel H67, ATX, DDR3 €78.53
Samsung SyncMaster B2430L €141.36
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ) €47.24
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €16.22
Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 450W €40.94
Club 3D Radeon 6770 1024MB, AMD Radeon 6770, PCI-Express €87.81

Monotype · 26-09-2011 4:42pm

So you already have the AMD system?

That board is compatible with AMD's new processors. It's a good board so it would be a waste to get rid of it. Wait a few weeks and see how the new processors perform. A different PSU would be good too.

Dr Nic · 26-09-2011 5:05pm

The amd rig i posted was for someone else.
Its working great - so im thinking about getting it all again maybe a little higher spec'ed as the budget is now a little higher

What do you think Guys? AMD or i5?
I think the mobo video chipset will do fine. No need of an extra graphics card at all for this particular build

Dr Nic · 26-09-2011 6:15pm

What do you guys think?
No video card, but Phenom X6, SSD, 24" monitor etc.
This should fly!

Total build cost: €736.62 + €30 shipping
2 x 8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9 €33.65
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ) €47.24
OCZ SSD Agility 2 120GB 8,9cm (3,5") €150.14
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €16.22
Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 550W €52.04
Xigmatek Asgard, ATX, ohne Netzteil, schwarz €32.63
Samsung SyncMaster B2430L €141.36
AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Box, Sockel AM3 €145.13
ASUS M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3, AM3, ATX €84.56

deconduo · 26-09-2011 6:39pm

Dr Nic wrote: »

What do you guys think?
No video card, but Phenom X6, SSD, 24" monitor etc.
This should fly!

Total build cost: €736.62 + €30 shipping
2 x 8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9 €33.65
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ) €47.24
OCZ SSD Agility 2 120GB 8,9cm (3,5") €150.14
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €16.22
Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 550W €52.04
Xigmatek Asgard, ATX, ohne Netzteil, schwarz €32.63
Samsung SyncMaster B2430L €141.36
AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Box, Sockel AM3 €145.13
ASUS M4A88TD-V EVO/USB3, AM3, ATX €84.56

As I said above, Autocad isn't threaded so the X6 would be completely wasted.

Dr Nic · 26-09-2011 6:45pm

I realise that but there isnt much point getting a single core processor is there?
Thanks for the help above by the way! Much appreciated!!

deconduo · 26-09-2011 6:49pm

Dr Nic wrote: »

I realise that but there isnt much point getting a single core processor is there?
Thanks for the help above by the way! Much appreciated!!

You'd be better off getting the much faster dual core sandy bridge CPU.

Monotype · 26-09-2011 6:56pm

IMO, go with deconduo's build but bin the graphics card in favour of a Z68 board and 2500K. It doesn't look like autocad benefits much from a graphics card (or have very high demands in general). An overclocked 2500K will give you the fastest performance per core around. Having the Z68 gives your system a longer life than the H67 too.

Dr Nic · 26-09-2011 7:08pm

That allmakes sense!

Hows about this?
Total build cost: €802.83 + €30 shipping
2 x 8GB-Kit G.Skill PC3-10667U CL9 €33.65
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ) €47.24
OCZ SSD Agility 2 120GB 8,9cm (3,5") €150.14
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €16.22
Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 550W €52.04
Xigmatek Asgard, ATX, ohne Netzteil, schwarz €32.63
Samsung SyncMaster B2430L €141.36
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €182.69
ASUS P8Z68-V LX, Sockel 1155, ATX, DDR3 €113.21

Is the ram i have compatible with the mobo?

Monotype · 26-09-2011 7:33pm

The Agility 2 is obsolete. Go for the 128GB M4 or the force3.

Dr Nic · 27-09-2011 11:11am

All order now...
875 total - got the 20euro pixel test on the lcd
Thanks Guys!

Dr Nic · 08-10-2011 9:12am

Just installing windows 7 64bit ultimate with windows xp virtual machine to run my old apps.

Now one question.
The pc seems to take ages to load. On pressing the power button, the cpu fan spins up for maybe 15 seconds, then it stops spinning. Then after another 15 seconds it spins again and only then starts to load the bios.

What the hell is up with that?
Anyone?
This is before any OS is even installed...
Could it be my sata configuration??
Any help appreciated!
Thanks

Dr Nic · 08-10-2011 4:39pm

Anyone any comments on 64 bit computing...
Is it a huge compatibility issue?

I would like to install office 32 bit, autocad 2007 32 bit etc and i dont know if im going to be able to...

Apparently this WOW64 thing is supposed to let office 32 bit etc install on 64 bit, but it wouldnt let me just now...
Anyone?
Thanks!

Monotype · 08-10-2011 5:30pm

Dr Nic wrote: »

Just installing windows 7 64bit ultimate with windows xp virtual machine to run my old apps.

Now one question.
The pc seems to take ages to load. On pressing the power button, the cpu fan spins up for maybe 15 seconds, then it stops spinning. Then after another 15 seconds it spins again and only then starts to load the bios.

What the hell is up with that?
Anyone?
This is before any OS is even installed...
Could it be my sata configuration??
Any help appreciated!
Thanks

Sounds like something is wrong. Could be anything like a bad board or CPU not in correctly. Check your RAM.
www.memtest.org - You need to boot it from USB or disc.
Check that all the connectors are in properly too.

Dr Nic wrote: »

Anyone any comments on 64 bit computing...
Is it a huge compatibility issue?

No, there's very few issues now. For older hardware, you might run into problems but program compatibility is great aside from 16-bit programs.

Dr Nic · 09-10-2011 10:09am

I'll look at it again today!
So i should be able to install all my old 32 bit software on this new 64 bit pc?

Dr Nic · 16-10-2011 5:30pm

I am sad to say that this build has gone wrong

Its the damn 64 bit processor and windows 7. Its wont install older versions of software such as Autocad 2000, 2007

Also boot time is crazy slow at 55 seconds.

And the motherboard has no ide connections

Dammit, im tearing my hair out here and i think my customer will not be coming to me again.

If i could just find a handy way of running autocad, i would be happy.
The booting issue is very annoying too.

The PSU and the CPU fan spin up for 20 seconds. Then it seems the psu turns itself off, and the cpu fan turns off too a split second later. Then 5 seconds later it all comes back to life and boots very quickly...

I've tried everything i can think of:
1 - Reseating the cpu fan.
2 - checking the ram is all correct
3 - putting the sata connections in to different orders/slots

Out of idea's and damn pissed off now

Why oh why didnt i get a damn 32 bit processor

Very, very mad with myself

Monotype · 16-10-2011 7:12pm

Don't worry about it so much.

First of all the OS - If you really want to have 32-bit, you can just install 32-bit windows. 64-bit processors that are out now support both. If you've already activated windows, you can back up your activation with ABR, then install the 32-bit OS. Keep in mind that all the additional RAM will go to waste. Perhaps a dual boot of Windows 7 64-bit and XP 32-bit would be better if you have an XP license?

Boot time is a bit slow for the M4 alright. Is that total boot or just windows itself loading? If it's total boot, there might be something wrong in BIOS - maybe even a wrong boot order slowing it down. If it's windows, I had a similar problem with an SSD and couldn't figure it out, but it turned out it was a driver missing.

Do you need IDE for old hard drives? You can get adapters for the drive.

What you're describing about the fan and the PSU, is that when you switch it on?

Monotype · 16-10-2011 7:52pm

I'm not sure if this would work or not, but since Windows activation is tied to motherboards, as far as I know, you could probably install a 64-bit and 32-bit version on the same computer, using the ABR program. You'd use the 64-bit one for the main work with newer versions and avail of the full RAM while the 32-bit could run the old programs.
Might be worth a go. Just don't write over a previous OS with data on it.

I read your posts again. It's an unusual problem. It sounds like the PSU or the board so. If you have a different PSU to try, you could swap it to see if it makes any difference. As for the board... maybe a BIOS update? Be careful when you're updating the BIOS and follow the steps carefully if you don't want a dead board.

Alternative solution for Autocad:

AutoCAD 2000 wouldn't install from the CD, due to some compatibility issues, between the installer and the 64 bit OS.

I did some searching and found a thread about the same issue with Vista, where someone said they had just copied the AutoCAD folder and system files, so I gave it a try.

I tried a few different things, and this is what I think it takes...

Copy the XP c:\Program Files\ACAD2000 folder to Win7 c:\Program Files (x86)\ACAD2000

Copy the files in XP c:\Windows\System to Win7 c:\Windows\System

I also copied the folder XP c:\Program Files\Common Files\Autodesk Shared to Win7 c:\Program Files (x86)\Common Files

but found that Acad.exe wouldn't run because it couldn't find the .dll files in the Autodesk Shared folder.

So, I simply copied all the files in the Autodesk Shared folder into the ACAD2000 folder, where the Acad.exe is, and it worked:>)

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/AutoCAD-2000-2000i-2002-Archive/Can-I-run-AutoCAD-2000-on-Windows-7/td-p/2577900/page/2
http://www.vistax64.com/software/178434-autocad-2000-onto-x64-2.html

It seems that running it is not an issue, it's just that Autodesk couldn't be bothered updating the installer.

Dr Nic · 17-10-2011 9:09pm

I had seen a page like that too and tried it with Autocad 2007. But it didnt work.
The page you found seemed to add some extra steps...
I will try them, thanks!

Dr Nic · 17-10-2011 9:16pm

Monotype wrote: »

Don't worry about it so much.

First of all the OS - If you really want to have 32-bit, you can just install 32-bit windows. 64-bit processors that are out now support both. If you've already activated windows, you can back up your activation with ABR, then install the 32-bit OS. Keep in mind that all the additional RAM will go to waste. Perhaps a dual boot of Windows 7 64-bit and XP 32-bit would be better if you have an XP license?

Boot time is a bit slow for the M4 alright. Is that total boot or just windows itself loading? If it's total boot, there might be something wrong in BIOS - maybe even a wrong boot order slowing it down. If it's windows, I had a similar problem with an SSD and couldn't figure it out, but it turned out it was a driver missing.

Do you need IDE for old hard drives? You can get adapters for the drive.

What you're describing about the fan and the PSU, is that when you switch it on?

Thats total boot time. One the initial mobo bios loading screen pops up, the pc only takes 10seconds to get win 7 running. But it takes 40 seconds for the screen to even activate...

It seems to be some problem with the PSU. It turns on, spins up, the cpu fan starts to spin up. Then both the psu and CPU turn themselves off. The after 10 seconds they spontaneously turn themselves back on again, and quickly boot win 7. Ive never seen behaviour like it

I did need an adapter for an old ide drive, but i just used a usb disk to strip the old harddrive instead. Took an entire day but got it done...

Monotype · 17-10-2011 10:33pm

That's very strange. If you have a spare PSU, I suggest that you try it. Update the BIOS on the board and if that doesn't work, consider RMA.

Edit 1:
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/293389-12-p8z68-slow-boot-slow-everything
That's an unusual solution but it might be worth a try, to plug it in somewhere else on its own.

Edit 2:
Similar board again and someone is talking about a double boot. Solution was to update the BIOS.
http://vip.asus.com/forum/view.aspx?id=20111017043147411&board_id=1&model=P8Z68-V&page=1&SLanguage=en-us

Update the BIOS as soon as possible, I think.

Edit 3:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4ApmQ4dcB8

Seems to be an issue with Asus Z68 boards.

-( i )- Wicker · 18-10-2011 11:48am

This might help