How should Garda stop you?

dillo2k10

Is there any specific way that a Garda should pull you over or try to overtake?

I ask because I was driving today and I noticed a car behind me trying to overtake in dangerous ways. There wasnt enough room for me to pull in. So I continued driving a few moments later he was still trying. When he finally got around me I noticed that it was an unmarked Garda car with lights on (no siren)

Could I have been charged for failing to stop for the Garda?

Also if a Garda trys to pull you over on a motorway could you drive to the next exit? Since the hard shoulder isnt safe and is only for an emergency?

If a unmarked car trys to pull you, do you have to stop or can you go to a garda station? Anyone could easily buy blue lights and a siren on ebay?

heate

1. He wasn't stopping you - and you are under no real legal obligation to let the Gardai or indeed any emergency vehicle pass. It is simply good manners and you are assisting important duties as time is normally crucial. Should a crash result as people all move in liability is there.

2. He should have had at least his lights if not his siren on. Guards are actually expected to drive legally and set an example for other road users. If in pursuit they can drive as fast as safely possible!

3. Unmarked car - the Guard should identify himself pull your window down slightly and ask him for ID. Might get pissy with you though!

4. Generally have to pull in to the hard shoulder - very dangerous for all involved.

Saab Ed

"Police officers operating Garda vehicles must

provide a positive example for other road users
and management should develop policies to ensure
such is the case. In non-emergency situations,

police officers should fully comply with the rules
of the road in the operation of vehicles, observing
speed limits, traffic signals and refraining from the

use of mobile phones while driving"

taken from ......

http://www.gsinsp.ie/index2.php?opti...d=55&Itemid=53

Dont dare question guards in here. I had the audacity to do so in here about a week ago and got shouted down in a torrid of abuse and a hail of angry and threatening comments from guards. It ended in the thread being closed and most guards disputing the findings of the attached report.

Guy:Incognito

They should ALWAYS use spike strips imo.

spiggotpaddy

you may as well get the padlock out now. we can't talk about ags without the padlock.

heate

I think that the topic can be covered in a logical legal methodical manner without any offense being caused

challengemaster

heate wrote: »

I think that the topic can be covered in a logical legal methodical manner without any offense being caused

It probably could, until some members of AGS come on and despite what you say, will claim that you're garda bashing. Criticism, pff, forget about it. :rolleyes:

Guy:Incognito

spiggotpaddy wrote: »

you may as well get the padlock out now. we can't talk about ags without the padlock.

<snip>

I've never seen a reasoned debate locked up.

heate

it isn't really a debate when you point out the recommended protocol

-Chris-

Saab Ed wrote: »

"Police officers operating Garda vehicles must

provide a positive example for other road users
and management should develop policies to ensure
such is the case. In non-emergency situations,

police officers should fully comply with the rules
of the road in the operation of vehicles, observing
speed limits, traffic signals and refraining from the

use of mobile phones while driving"

taken from ......

http://www.gsinsp.ie/index2.php?opti...d=55&Itemid=53

But do the above apply in emergency situations, which you'd have to assume this was, because the blue lights were on and they were trying to get someone quickly.

spiggotpaddy wrote: »

you may as well get the padlock out now. we can't talk about ags without the padlock.

challengemaster wrote: »

It probably could, until some members of AGS come on and despite what you say, will claim that you're garda bashing. Criticism, pff, forget about it. :rolleyes:

Saab Ed wrote: »

Dont dare question guards in here. I had the audacity to do so in here about a week ago and got shouted down in a torrid of abuse and a hail of angry and threatening comments from guards. It ended in the thread being closed and most guards disputing the findings of the attached report.

Lads, if you don't want to contribute, don't contribute.

Threads will be locked if they start tarring people with the same brush or moving into vague, accusatory generalities rather than discussing points that can be refuted with information or experience.

Any Garda who disputes the findings of a report should be requested to show the same level of rigour in their dispute, as any other poster is when making accusations of the Gardai. Unfortunately, it rarely stays that civil.

-Chris-

dillo2k10 wrote: »

I ask because I was driving today and I noticed a car behind me trying to overtake in dangerous ways. There wasnt enough room for me to pull in. So I continued driving a few moments later he was still trying. When he finally got around me I noticed that it was an unmarked Garda car with lights on (no siren)

Can I ask - did they turn the lights on as they were passing you, or did they have the blue lights on while they were behind you trying to overtake and you didn't notice them?

Saab Ed

-Chris- wrote: »

Threads will be locked if they start tarring people with the same brush or moving into vague, accusatory generalities rather than discussing points that can be refuted with information or experience.

Any Garda who disputes the findings of a report should be requested to show the same level of rigour in their dispute, as any other poster is when making accusations of the Gardai. Unfortunately, it rarely stays that civil.

The only method left open to me to back up my accusations is to bring up a previuosly closed thread. This I'm not going to do as in my opinion it will only end up de-railing this very thread. That said (and I dont want the contents of my previous thread to be discussed here, more the tone of the posters) if anybody wants to search for a thread title " Gardai should lead by example " I think they'll see my accusations are well founded

-Chris-

Saab Ed wrote: »

The only method left open to me to back up my accusations is to bring up a previuosly closed thread. This I'm not going to do as in my opinion it will only end up de-railing this very thread. That said (and I dont want the contents of my previous thread to be discussed here, more the tone of the posters) if anybody wants to search for a thread title " Gardai should lead by example " I think they'll see my accusations are well founded

Noted, now let's all get back on-topic for this thread please.

bijapos

dillo2k10 wrote: »

Could I have been charged for failing to stop for the Garda?

I doubt they would go that far, a bit of a warning would be better.

Also if a Garda trys to pull you over on a motorway could you drive to the next exit? Since the hard shoulder isnt safe and is only for an emergency?

No, you should stop on the hard shoulder, then request that you go to the next exit/layby as you feel nervous or uncomfortable on the hard shoulder.

If a unmarked car trys to pull you, do you have to stop or can you go to a garda station? Anyone could easily buy blue lights and a siren on ebay

You should stop, if you are suspicious then tell them so and request to go to the next station.


Slightly OT but I've always felt that the blue lights in unmarked cars are very hard to see. No idea where they are sourced but the ones on unmarked German cars are much easier to spot.

challengemaster

bijapos wrote: »

I doubt they would go that far, a bit of a warning would be better.



No, you should stop on the hard shoulder, then request that you go to the next exit/layby as you feel nervous or uncomfortable on the hard shoulder.



You should stop, if you are suspicious then tell them so and request to go to the next station.


Slightly OT but I've always felt that the blue lights in unmarked cars are very hard to see. No idea where they are sourced but the ones on unmarked German cars are much easier to spot.

Who told you this or did you make it up yourself?

If anything the Gardaí will probably prompt you to continue to the next exit before pulling over if they have any cop on (not a dig) Motorways are extremely dangerous to be stopped on, and you shouldn't stop on the hard shoulder. Continue to the next exit and then explain (if necessary) to the garda.

And if you stop for a fake unmarked that's trying to steal your car, and tell them you're suspicious and want to go to the next station, what exactly do you think will happen? They'll agree? or they'll drag you from the car and kick the crap out of you before taking your car? Never heard anything like it in my life :rolleyes:

heate

I've been done for failing to stop! One Guard waved me thru the other didn't agree and nearly reefed me out of the car!
Failing for stop normally though I think is if you blatantly don't stop - i.e. joy riding or flying through a check point etc.

dillo2k10

-Chris- wrote: »

Can I ask - did they turn the lights on as they were passing you, or did they have the blue lights on while they were behind you trying to overtake and you didn't notice them?

I'm pretty sure that they were on while they were behind me and I didn't notice them because they weren't behind me a few moments before hand so would have had to overtake other cars.

I did look at the car briefly in the mirror but the lights weren't that obvious.

bijapos

challengemaster wrote: »

Who told you this or did you make it up yourself?

No I didn't make it up myself, its standard procedure in countries such as Germany, Italy and France amongst others and in light of there be no strong guidelines here its what I would recommend.

If anything the Gardaí will probably prompt you to continue to the next exit before pulling over if they have any cop on (not a dig) Motorways are extremely dangerous to be stopped on, and you shouldn't stop on the hard shoulder. Continue to the next exit and then explain (if necessary) to the garda.

Yes, they probably will, but thats not what the OP asked, they asked:

Also if a Garda trys to pull you over on a motorway could you drive to the next exit?

If they try to pull you over you have to stop, you have to comply with instructions of a Garda, failing to stop is an offence. OK?

For all you know there could be something wrong with your car that they are warning you about, but to answer the OP: Yes you must stop if requested.

And if you stop for a fake unmarked that's trying to steal your car, and tell them you're suspicious and want to go to the next station, what exactly do you think will happen? They'll agree? or they'll drag you from the car and kick the crap out of you before taking your car? Never heard anything like it in my life :rolleyes:

Again you failed to read the OP, it says:

If a unmarked car trys to pull you, do you have to stop or can you go to a garda station?

The answer is yes, you have to stop for an unmarked car. If you realise its dodgy then drive on and ring 999, but if you are aware its a proper unmarked car you have to stop. This is what the OP asked.

BTW theres no need for the roll eyes and sarcasm either, its a discussion here, not a fight.

CharlieCroker

Op, the question as to whether to stop for an unmarked car has been asked and answered a number of times. If you're in a city/town, if it's legit and you fail to stop it won't be long before a marked patrol car shows up to stop you. In a rural area, it's not that easy but the gardai will make themselves known in other ways (I.d through the window etc), just don't be going through red lights, junctions etc

Anan1

In my experience the Gardaí are pretty reasonable about these things, as long as they don't feel you're taking the piss. If in doubt, pull in, keep the engine running and doors locked and only open the window a crack until you're happy they're genuine. Let's face it, in or out of uniform a real Garda is not that hard to recognize.:)

spiggotpaddy

Anan1 wrote: »

In my experience the Gardaí are pretty reasonable about these things, as long as they don't feel you're taking the piss. If in doubt, pull in, keep the engine running and doors locked and only open the window a crack until you're happy they're genuine. Let's face it, in or out of uniform a real Garda is not that hard to recognize.:)

lose the ha ha chewed

Anan1

spiggotpaddy wrote: »

lose the ha ha chewed

What's that?

MugMugs

I was complimented on my pulling in technique recently. he even asked if I was a member because I did it so well. Not slamming on the brakes nearly causing them to rear end you is a good start

And no, I'm not a member.

CharlieCroker

MugMugs wrote: »

I was complimented on my pulling in technique recently. he even asked if I was a member because I did it so well. Not slamming on the brakes nearly causing them to rear end you is a good start

And no, I'm not a member.

Yes, if you see blue lights behind you pull in when it's safe to do so (nobody is expecting you to drive into the ditch), if on a dual carriageway pull into left most lane. DO NOT brake because the emergency vehicle then has to brake harder as they're going faster. if you're doing 70 or 80 mph, keep doing it until it's safe to move into another lane (if they're after you, you're already caught) and don't slow down to pull in behind a car on your left, the nearest gap may be ahead of you so aim for that instead.

99% of the time they just want to get past and as they're already on a call, they're not gonna stop you to give you a bollocking because you went 5mph over the limit to get out of the way.

And I am a member.

Anan1

MugMugs wrote: »

I was complimented on my pulling in technique recently. he even asked if I was a member because I did it so well. Not slamming on the brakes nearly causing them to rear end you is a good start

And no, I'm not a member.

You also get brownie points for indicating left at the exact instant they put on the blues.

challengemaster

bijapos wrote: »

If they try to pull you over you have to stop, you have to comply with instructions of a Garda, failing to stop is an offence. OK?

For all you know there could be something wrong with your car that they are warning you about, but to answer the OP: Yes you must stop if requested.

I'm aware of that, but there's a difference between stopping and stopping safely in an appropriate place.

You wouldn't stop on a blind bend in the road with no hard shoulders either side if requested, would you?

People have been stupid enough to Jam on the brakes in the overtaking lane of a motorway when being pulled over by AGS. The motorway is not a safe place to pull in and stop, neither for you or especially for the garda who's pulling you over who has to get out of their car.

Again you failed to read the OP, it says:

The answer is yes, you have to stop for an unmarked car. If you realise its dodgy then drive on and ring 999, but if you are aware its a proper unmarked car you have to stop. This is what the OP asked.

By the time you realise its dodgy once you've pulled over you're screwed. Especially at night, when you won't be able to see much of the car except the blues in the mirrors.

No offense but I'll take CharlieCroker's word on this before I take yours.

MugMugs

Anan1 wrote: »

MugMugs wrote: »

I was complimented on my pulling in technique recently. he even asked if I was a member because I did it so well. Not slamming on the brakes nearly causing them to rear end you is a good start

And no, I'm not a member.

You also get brownie points for indicating left at the exact instant they put on the blues.

They're lucky if you make to the hard shoulder before your "oh my god I am going to replicate the performance of ceramic brakes" maneuver.

challengemaster

MugMugs wrote: »

They're lucky if you make to the hard shoulder before your "oh my god I am going to replicate the performance of ceramic brakes" maneuver.

Would be slightly more impressive if the brakes caught fire too though

sean1141

challengemaster wrote: »

Who told you this or did you make it up yourself?

If anything the Gardaí will probably prompt you to continue to the next exit before pulling over if they have any cop on (not a dig) Motorways are extremely dangerous to be stopped on, and you shouldn't stop on the hard shoulder. Continue to the next exit and then explain (if necessary) to the garda.

i seen a marked garda car with a bmw pulled just under the crossover bridge at junction 14 of the m7 about a month ago. i thought it was a dangerous place as the guard was leaning in the drivers window of the bmw.. maybe he was giving the driver a bolliking for not going up the off ramp!!

Bosco boy

Saab Ed wrote: »

"Police officers operating Garda vehicles must

provide a positive example for other road users
and management should develop policies to ensure
such is the case. In non-emergency situations,

police officers should fully comply with the rules
of the road in the operation of vehicles, observing
speed limits, traffic signals and refraining from the

use of mobile phones while driving"

taken from ......

http://www.gsinsp.ie/index2.php?opti...d=55&Itemid=53

Dont dare question guards in here. I had the audacity to do so in here about a week ago and got shouted down in a torrid of abuse and a hail of angry and threatening comments from guards. It ended in the thread being closed and most guards disputing the findings of the attached report.

does anyone have the right to question you? You didn't get the reaction you wanted and got the hump. You weren't abused by anyone you just couldn't cope with the other side of the debate!!!!

Our man in Havana

They should learn to stop cars properly!

mattser

Can the Gardai stop this thread ?

-Chris-

-Chris- wrote: »

Lads, if you don't want to contribute, don't contribute.

Threads will be locked if they start tarring people with the same brush or moving into vague, accusatory generalities rather than discussing points that can be refuted with information or experience.

Any Garda who disputes the findings of a report should be requested to show the same level of rigour in their dispute, as any other poster is when making accusations of the Gardai. Unfortunately, it rarely stays that civil.

-Chris- wrote: »

Noted, now let's all get back on-topic for this thread please.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Please see above for two on-thread warnings.

Bosco boy wrote: »

does anyone have the right to question you? You didn't get the reaction you wanted and got the hump. You weren't abused by anyone you just couldn't cope with the other side of the debate!!!!

You are off topic, and continuing the disagreement that occurred on the previous thread despite a specific instruction to leave it alone.

Either post constructively, on-topic, and civilly, or don't post at all.

ArphaRima

I nearly killed a Garda a few years ago. I was up the mountains on the way home from a friend's house. I had stopped for a ciggy at the side of the road (it wasnt Dublin View but it was a major road on the way up overlooking the city).

A car screamed to a halt beside me (boxing me in) at 2am in the morning and a big man jumps out, runs in front of my bonnet towards my/the driver side window. I had my car in gear the moment they stopped, and was about to floor it with the guy in front of my car a second later. Only for the fact I spotted what looked like their light assembly on the dash did I stop.

I almost ran over a Garda and trashed a patrol car. There were no lights, no sirens, nothing shouted, and they drove stupidly aggressively. I genuinely thought I was about to be attacked. As it was the garda left me and my mate in my car in absolute ignorance about how close he came to dying. All he did was ask me for my driving licence.
I'm sure that had I done what I had planned in panicked self-protection AGS would have had their story straight in court..

MugMugs

fluffer wrote: »

I nearly killed a Garda a few years ago. I was up the mountains on the way home from a friend's house. I had stopped for a ciggy at the side of the road (it wasnt Dublin View but it was a major road on the way up overlooking the city).

A car screamed to a halt beside me (boxing me in) at 2am in the morning and a big man jumps out, runs in front of my bonnet towards my/the driver side window. I had my car in gear the moment they stopped, and was about to floor it with the guy in front of my car a second later. Only for the fact I spotted what looked like their light assembly on the dash did I stop.

I almost ran over a Garda and trashed a patrol car. There were no lights, no sirens, nothing shouted, and they drove stupidly aggressively. I genuinely thought I was about to be attacked. As it was the garda left me and my mate in my car in absolute ignorance about how close he came to dying. All he did was ask me for my driving licence.
I'm sure that had I done what I had planned in panicked self-protection AGS would have had their story straight in court..

And you were doing so well.

Thankfully nobody was hurt though. Did you query his reasons for such a harsh stop ?

ArphaRima

Did you query his reasons for such a harsh stop ?

No. To be honest I was quite shaken. I thought I was being attacked, then I decided to kill the person, and then realised it was a garda; all in about 1 second.
Not an everyday occurence.
My heart was about to explode.

Anan1

CharlieCroker wrote: »

99% of the time they just want to get past and as they're already on a call, they're not gonna stop you to give you a bollocking because you went 5mph over the limit to get out of the way.

And I am a member.

Let's imagine i'm overtaking a dense stream of traffic on a motorway, doing 120km/h, when a Garda car comes up behind me, lights flashing. Does not being an obstruction come ahead of the speed limit, ie would it be better for me to accelerate to 160km/h, rather than say 140, before moving left if this eased the passage of the Garda car? I'm more interested in the outlook of the average Garda than the legal position.

ArphaRima

I'd imagine if the Garda car had his sirens on to catch someone doing 155kph he would just stop you instead..

My point just being that we dont know enough to make a decision like that. Flout the law to help law enforcement when there is a law enforcer behind you? I'm not going near that one!

Anan1

fluffer wrote: »

My point just being that we dont know enough to make a decision like that. Flout the law to help law enforcement when there is a law enforcer behind you? I'm not going near that one!

Which is why i'm asking a Garda.;)

ArphaRima

Haha!
Alright you win. My point was that each Garda will decide on a different course of action depending on the situation so it's of limited use to ask. There is no (traffic) law that says a citizen may break the law to help a Garda..

challengemaster

fluffer wrote: »

Haha!
Alright you win. My point was that each Garda will decide on a different course of action depending on the situation so it's of limited use to ask. There is no (traffic) law that says a citizen may break the law to help a Garda..

Nope, that's the thing. But you'll be damn sure if you cause an accident in doing so it's on your head. Anyway AFAIK you're not obliged to get out of the way for ES vehicles, it's just helpful if you can

Blazer

heate wrote: »

3. Unmarked car - the Guard should identify himself pull your window down slightly and ask him for ID. Might get pissy with you though!

Doesn't matter what he thinks...he's still obliged to show you...Gardai in uniform aren't required to show you their official ...however plainclothes are and to be fair none of them I've encountered before never had a problem with this.
Remember locking up the pub I worked in a couple of years ago and I set off the alarm by mistake...thought nothing of it and continue upstairs.
2 mins later a knock on the outer door, opened 2 and 2 guys were outside, identifying themselves as gardai and wanting to examine the premises...they were the scummiest looking gardai going (plainclothes so they really fit in in Limerick) and I didn't budge until they produced ID...they was a bit taken back but still handed them over no probs