New Australian passports allow third gender option

azezil

From: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-14926598

Australians have been given a third choice when describing their gender on passport applications, under new guidelines aimed at removing discrimination.

Transgender people and those of ambiguous sex will be able to list their gender as indeterminate, which will be shown on passports as an X.

People whose gender was different from that of their birth were previously required to have reassignment surgery before they could change their passport to their preferred sex.

An Australian senator, Louise Pratt - whose partner was born female and is now identified as a man - said the reform was a huge step forward.

"There have been very many cases of people being detained at airports by immigration in foreign countries simply because their passports don't reflect what they look like," she told Australian radio.

"It's very distressing, highly inconvenient and frankly sometimes dangerous."

Sir Ophiuchus

This is fantastic news. Hopefully we in the EU will eventually follow this step.

TylerIE

Just seen it on RTE and came straight over:

Australia has brought in new passport rules allowing citizens to nominate their official gender as male, female or indeterminate, without having to undergo surgery as proof of a sex change.

Canberra had previously required a person whose gender was different from that of their birth to have reassignment surgery before they could change their passport to their preferred sex, and there was no "indeterminate" option.

Attorney-General Robert McClelland said the changes, which come into effect immediately, meant transgendered or intersex people would just need a doctor's letter of support to get a passport in what they considered their true gender.

"Most people take for granted the ability to travel freely and without fear of discrimination," Mr McClelland said.
"This measure will extend the same freedoms to sex and gender-diverse Australians."
For those who nominate the indeterminate option, "x" will appear in the gender category in their passport.

Senator Louise Pratt, Australia's first parliamentarian with a transgendered partner - born female but now a man - said the change was a huge step forward.

"There have been very many cases of people being detained at airports by immigration in foreign countries simply because their passports don't reflect what they look like," Ms Pratt told ABC radio.

"It's very distressing, highly inconvenient and frankly sometimes dangerous."
The move was welcomed by the transgender and intersex community.
They called for Australia's state governments to follow suit by allowing birth certificates to also be altered without the prerequisite of surgery.
Ms Pratt said she was pushing for national reform on the issue.

amen

This is fantastic news. Hopefully we in the EU will eventually follow this step.

Why ? This makes no sense. There are two sexes , male and female.

You are either one or the other. If you are transgendered then you have moved from male to female or vica versa.

You aren't suddenly indeterminate.

Links234

amen wrote: »

Why ? This makes no sense. There are two sexes , male and female.

You are either one or the other. If you are transgendered then you have moved from male to female or vica versa.

You aren't suddenly indeterminate.

what about people who are intersex? what about people who identify outside of the binary? there are plenty of people who are not either one or the other, and this option reflects people's realities and lived experiences.

TylerIE

amen wrote: »

Why ? This makes no sense. There are two sexes , male and female.

You are either one or the other. If you are transgendered then you have moved from male to female or vica versa.

You aren't suddenly indeterminate.

The Indeterminate option allows those who are pre-op or who identify with a gender other than how they appear to have a passport that reflects their true gender.

Just like some closeted gay men get tired of being asked about a wife or girlfriend, or worse still when are they getting [hetro] married, as its a kick in the teeth reminding them of their secret and that they cant get married, having a "Male" passport when you are female in all but anatomy is a big kick in the teeth...

Apologies in advance if I have gone a bit non PC above but its how I'd view it.

Sir Ophiuchus

amen wrote: »

Why ? This makes no sense. There are two sexes , male and female.

You are, bluntly, wrong. For one thing, intersexed people fall in between those categories.

Also, the words "sex" and "gender" are often conflated in public discourse, but they mean different things. "Sex" refers to biology. "Gender" refers to identity. Passports tend to specify "gender" rather than "sex" due to this fairly common misuse. So one might be physically sexed as male, but identify one's gender as female. Or vice versa. Or be sexed either way but identify one's gender as "indeterminate". Or be intersexed, and identify one's gender as male, female, or something else.

Trans people might well put down the gender as which they now identify, but some trans people might also appreciate a third option, whether because they find it makes things clearer to others or because they identify their own gender in a more fluid way than male/female.

Conor30

This is a good idea. Why not?

Annasopra

Conor30 wrote: »

This is a good idea. Why not?

what about trans people who want to identify as their preferred gender identity and don't want to identify as "x"

TylerIE

mango salsa wrote: »

what about trans people who want to identify as their preferred gender identity and don't want to identify as "x"

From above

Attorney-General Robert McClelland said the changes, which come into effect immediately, meant transgendered or intersex people would just need a doctor's letter of support to get a passport in what they considered their true gender.

They can identify as their true gender or X?

Its better than writing "Indeterminate" on it - imagine getting into almost any African country with anything other than Male or Female or a fundamental Blank (X) on your passport.

yawha

mango salsa wrote: »

what about trans people who want to identify as their preferred gender identity and don't want to identify as "x"

Australia has brought in new passport rules allowing citizens to nominate their official gender as male, female or indeterminate, without having to undergo surgery as proof of a sex change.

.

Conor30

mango salsa wrote: »

what about trans people who want to identify as their preferred gender identity and don't want to identify as "x"

What about them? Nobody is stopping them identifying as their preferred gender either. Didn't you understand the article or something?!

azezil

Conor30 wrote: »

What about them? Nobody is stopping them identifying as their preferred gender either. Didn't you understand the article or something?!

And if you'd read the article you'd see that some people are stopped at customs where their gender listed on their passport doesn't match their physical appearance.

Killer Pigeon

amen wrote: »

Why ? This makes no sense. There are two sexes , male and female.

Ehh, *cough* hermaphrodites.

rainbow kirby

Killer Pigeon wrote: »

Ehh, *cough* hermaphrodites.

Intersex would be the more technically correct term there.

Killer Pigeon

rainbow kirby wrote: »

Intersex would be the more technically correct term there.

Just out of interest, is the word "hermaphrodite" regards as less-PC, or is it too broad or specific?

rainbow kirby

It's frequently regarded as offensive, and it's also a little too specific in terms of describing possible intersex conditions - for example, someone with complete androgen insensitivity syndrome will look very feminine, will have external female genitalia but have a 46XY karyotype. The term "hermaphrodite" carries with it the implication that both male and female genitalia are present.

Killer Pigeon

rainbow kirby wrote: »

It's frequently regarded as offensive, and it's also a little too specific in terms of describing possible intersex conditions - for example, someone with complete androgen insensitivity syndrome will look very feminine, will have external female genitalia but have a 46XY karyotype. The term "hermaphrodite" carries with it the implication that both male and female genitalia are present.

Thanks for that info. I didn't mean to offend anyone either. If I did, I'm sorry.

Conor30

azezil wrote: »

And if you'd read the article you'd see that some people are stopped at customs where their gender listed on their passport doesn't match their physical appearance.

I know that and I'm not denying that. That's why I think the option of an x is a great idea, for those who may like to choose it.

Resi12

It's a nice idea but surely it's just putting transgendered people into another label/box outside the norm. It's not very unifying, I mean I am sure they go through all that surgery to be identified as that sex, not an X.

A better law would have been that any patient who has surgery to become another sex must have their passport cancelled and once healed take a new one. They wouldn't be doing much travelling during healing anyway.

TylerIE

Resi12 wrote: »

It's a nice idea but surely it's just putting transgendered people into another label/box outside the norm. It's not very unifying, I mean I am sure they go through all that surgery to be identified as that sex, not an X.

A better law would have been that any patient who has surgery to become another sex must have their passport cancelled and once healed take a new one. They wouldn't be doing much travelling during healing anyway.

LOL I have little / no doubt that you can take out a new passport to reflect the new gender.

Really you cant win. This gives people the option to have an interim passport or one that covers you while your transitioning.