NTL box, not active

Globalomega

Hi,

I have two NTL boxes in my house. One downstairs and one in my bedroom. When i moved in with my UPC broadband they activated the one downstairs from outside the house and plugged my modem into it.
But also the box gives me about 10 channels if i attach my TV to it.

Now i would love to have the box upstairs acivated aswell, so i can move TV to my bedroom.

1. If i ask them to activate it, will they do it?
2. Are those 10 channels for free, or will they make me pay for them?

icdg

By "box" I assume you mean wall tap? The channels you are getting are the basic analogue service (and the reason you are paying a standalone charge for broadband, because UPC can't give you broadband without the TV too). Yes you can (or used to be able to) get a second analogue TV point, there is a small monthly charge.

Globalomega

With box i mean that i have something like this, but with NTL logo on it


The problem is, it's deactivated from outside the house

icdg

That's a tap, or TV point. If you say "box", people will think you mean set-top box (digital decoder).

You need to ring UPC if you want them to set up the additional point.

coylemj

There is no charge for a non-digital second or third point in the house. My house was wired with three TV points by the builder. When I went digital the UPC lads replaced all three of my wall boxes, they installed the Digital+ box downstairs which I was obviously paying for but there was no charge for the analogue signal I was getting in the bedroom or the kitchen.

Nowadays, beyond the charge for the basic connection to your house, all they care about are the digital boxes. This means that if you are paying for an analogue or digital service for one point in the house, they don't care how many analogue signals you draw from the connection inside your house. They used to charge for multiple analogue points but they don't care any more, you only pay for extra points (multiroom) if they have digital boxes.

lucernarian

coylemj wrote: »

There is no charge for a non-digital second or third point in the house. My house was wired with three TV points by the builder. When I went digital the UPC lads replaced all three of my wall boxes, they installed the Digital+ box downstairs which I was obviously paying for but there was no charge for the analogue signal I was getting in the bedroom or the kitchen.

Nowadays, beyond the charge for the basic connection to your house, all they care about are the digital boxes. This means that if you are paying for an analogue or digital service for one point in the house, they don't care how many analogue signals you draw from the connection inside your house. They used to charge for multiple analogue points but they don't care any more, you only pay for extra points (multiroom) if they have digital boxes.

That's not always true. Where UPC have fitted extra points themselves, there is an extra rent of €5 per point I understand. I know people who are paying extra per month for other TV points that were installed.

coylemj

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

That's not always true. Where UPC have fitted extra points themselves, there is an extra rent of €5 per point I understand. I know people who are paying extra per month for other TV points that were installed.

Thanks, I wasn't aware of that but it makes sense if UPC fitted the extra points, did all the wiring and installed a splitter in the attic.

amyk777

off-topic i know, but im hoping one of the above posters will be able to clarify:
im moving in the new few weeks, and my new apartment has a upc wall tap. im not interested in digital tv and intend getting decent broadband (and possibly the basic cheapo phone too), so if i get them from upc, does that mean i will also get the analogue tv service from them at no extra charge? im not interested in a second connection point, its an itty bitty flat... and importantly, is it a secret no one is supposed to know about?
tia,
amy

lucernarian

If you subscribe only for internet or phone, and you use the cable connection for analogue TV for example then I believe it is an offence under one of the criminal justice acts. So you mustn't do that under any circumstances. All their services come down the one cable. To get both their TV and broadband legally, I think you have to spend a minimum of €48 per month as of today's prices. Not that bad really.

amyk777

im afraid i dont entirely understand your answer. when globalomega asked very similar questions a short time ago, he wasnt told he had already broken the law. he wasnt even (specifically) told he would be charged for this usage, only that he might (contentious) for extra connections. i already said i dont want extra connections. and i already said im not interested in digital tv. the lowest priced package on offer was €22 - i dont see what i should pay something i dont have for something i dont want. upc do not appear to have any facility online for ordering/paying for analogue tv, so if their line is already connected to the analogue tv service, why would it bother them if i use it?

coylemj

amyk777 wrote: »

upc do not appear to have any facility online for ordering/paying for analogue tv, so if their line is already connected to the analogue tv service, why would it bother them if i use it?

If the analog TV signal is coming down the wire and you have any qualms about using it, ring UPC and ask them if it's ok to do so.

lucernarian

amyk777 wrote: »

im afraid i dont entirely understand your answer. when globalomega asked very similar questions a short time ago, he wasnt told he had already broken the law. he wasnt even (specifically) told he would be charged for this usage, only that he might (contentious) for extra connections. i already said i dont want extra connections. and i already said im not interested in digital tv. the lowest priced package on offer was €22 - i dont see what i should pay something i dont have for something i dont want. upc do not appear to have any facility online for ordering/paying for analogue tv, so if their line is already connected to the analogue tv service, why would it bother them if i use it?

I didn't cop that immediately. He would also be breaking the law from the discussions I've seen here before if he didn't pay UPC for any TV service and was then using the modem's cable for the TV instead (or split to feed both etc).

I don't know the exact status of the law to be honest but I don't think you could use the defence that you assumed you could receive UPC for free when it was already available in your house/flat.

In any case, the basic digital TV package costs slightly less than the analogue only package so that's why they probably stopped selling it. You could store the box away when you get it and just plug the cable direct into the tv if you wanted? You get the analogue channels no matter what TV service you subscribe to.

coylemj

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

I don't know the exact status of the law to be honest

But you still think it's ok to advise him to pay for a digital box, then not use it just because you think he might be breaking the law by receiving the analog signal, even though you don't know the law?

If UPC gives him the analog signal then let him clarify the situation by asking them if it's ok to use it. It's their signal, they choose to send it down the wire to his house, they could easily screen out the VHF TV frequencies for broadband and phone customers but they don't. Surely they are the people he should be asking and not a bunch of amateur lawyers on this forum?

If you don't know the law then stop dishing out legal advice.

lucernarian

coylemj wrote: »

But you still think it's ok to advise him to pay for a digital box, then not use it just because you think he might be breaking the law by receiving the analog signal, even though you don't know the law?

If UPC gives him the analog signal then let him clarify the situation by asking them if it's ok to use it. It's their signal, they choose to send it down the wire to his house, they could easily screen out the VHF TV frequencies for broadband and phone customers but they don't. Surely they are the people he should be asking and not a bunch of amateur lawyers on this forum?

If you don't know the law then stop dishing out legal advice.

If UPC charge for analogue TV and one watches their analogue TV knowingly without paying for it then it's theft of service. It's pretty simple really. I said that I wasn't certain of the exact wording of the law, not that I wasn't certain if it was right to watch UPC's tv without paying for it even if available. It's the same as accessing someone else's wifi network for internet access without permission, even if the wifi network is unsecured. Unless there was some reasonable grounds (mixed up identity with your own network etc) then you'd be breaking the law.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1990/en/act/pub/0024/sec0009.html#zza24y1990s9

And the basic digital subscription which comes with analogue channels anyway, is cheaper than analogue TV only! Of course I'd advise that. I'll be very interested to hear what UPC say.

amyk777

Do UPC charge for analogue tv? if so, i cant seem to find any explanation on their website...

and in case it wasnt obvious (and apparently it wasnt) im not particularly interested in analogue tv because i inexplicably believe its superior to digital tv - im interested because i dont have the money required to pay for a digital subscription, and if upc are feeding my line anyway with an analogue tv signal, i dont fully understand how it can be an offense for me to use it. why would it be there, unless its some sort of entrapment technique to entice people into biting the forbidden fruit?

yes of course it would be against the law to steal something without paying for it, and i have no intention of doing that. but i wouldnt be concerned that by tuning an aerial in to receive broadcast tv that is freely cast about by the rte transmitter, i might be involving myself in theft. (yes, tv license, yadda yadda, but thats a different matter.) if upc are including this signal on my line (for whatever reason), why else might it be there other than to be used?

coylemj

amyk777 wrote: »

Do UPC charge for analogue tv? if so, i cant seem to find any explanation on their website...

and in case it wasnt obvious (and apparently it wasnt) im not particularly interested in analogue tv because i inexplicably believe its superior to digital tv - im interested because i dont have the money required to pay for a digital subscription, and if upc are feeding my line anyway with an analogue tv signal, i dont fully understand how it can be an offense for me to use it. why would it be there, unless its some sort of entrapment technique to entice people into biting the forbidden fruit?

yes of course it would be against the law to steal something without paying for it, and i have no intention of doing that. but i wouldnt be concerned that by tuning an aerial in to receive broadcast tv that is freely cast about by the rte transmitter, i might be involving myself in theft. (yes, tv license, yadda yadda, but thats a different matter.) if upc are including this signal on my line (for whatever reason), why else might it be there other than to be used?

+1 the legislation quoted by to_be_confirmed is concerned with people who 'intercept' a signal. The definition of 'intercept' is given as follows...

(4) In this section “intercept” in relation to a service means receive, view, listen to, record by any means or acquire the substance or purport of the service or part thereof supplied by a licensee or service provider without the agreement of the licensee or service provider.

In your case you are paying UPC to run a cable to your house for BB and phone so you are not intercepting a signal i.e. it's not like you're piggybacking on your neighbour's Wi-Fi and if, as appears to be the case, UPC do not charge for analog TV then if I was you I would assume that it was a free part of the bundle so I'd plug it into my TV and watch it.

The suggestion that UPC would supply a signal to your house as part of a legitimate agreement and then haul you into court for availing of a part of the signal that you're not supposed to use is frankly laughable.