Mc Cains power of 10

longjump67

Are posters familiar with the ranking system in place in the UK sponsered by Mc Cains.
http://www.thepowerof10.info/aboutpowerof10/


http://www.thepowerof10.info/

I believe that we should adopt something similar here in Ireland. Starting with u-12 right up to senior athletes.

The power of 10 is a good way of Identifying young talent as well as tracking their progress, it is also gives every athlete a personal log of all their competition results and sets targets and rewards for hitting those targets.

Does anyone think that this would help with the athletes being more interactive with the sport of track & field?

ecoli

longjump67 wrote: »

Are posters familiar with the ranking system in place in the UK sponsered by Mc Cains.
http://www.thepowerof10.info/aboutpowerof10/


http://www.thepowerof10.info/

I believe that we should adopt something similar here in Ireland. Starting with u-12 right up to senior athletes.

The power of 10 is a good way of Identifying young talent as well as tracking their progress, it is also gives every athlete a personal log of all their competition results and sets targets and rewards for hitting those targets.

Does anyone think that this would help with the athletes being more interactive with the sport of track & field?

Its a good idea but a hell of alot of work. I know one of the boardsies here attempted to develop a database and some people helped him a bit but dont think it ever got off the ground.

Its a great idea alright

RoyMcC

Power of 10 is excellent. However it's paid for (I believe) by UK Athletics. Tim Grose and fellow stattos used to do the rankings for free but it's a full-time and pretty comprehensive setup now.

Realist Spy of this parish said he was developing a rankings system but I've heard no more of this.

The seniors rankings are pretty well tracked in Ireland but it would be great to include age groups. It can only help competitiveness and raise standards if athletes/coaches know what needs to be achieved.

ecoli

RoyMcC wrote: »

Power of 10 is excellent. However it's paid for (I believe) by UK Athletics. Tim Grose and fellow stattos used to do the rankings for free but it's a full-time and pretty comprehensive setup now.

Realist Spy of this parish said he was developing a rankings system but I've heard no more of this.

The seniors rankings are pretty well tracked in Ireland but it would be great to include age groups. It can only help competitiveness and raise standards if athletes/coaches know what needs to be achieved.

The database was developed and a few people gave him a hand filling in the info but that was as far as it went i think. Again bit of a double edge sword, you need someone wit a hige interest in the sport to keep it up to date but anyone that involved is usually too busy with their own training and commitments to do this full time without being paid

RoyMcC

ecoli wrote: »

The database was developed and a few people gave him a hand filling in the info but that was as far as it went i think. Again bit of a double edge sword, you need someone wit a hige interest in the sport to keep it up to date but anyone that involved is usually too busy with their own training and commitments to do this full time without being paid

Indeed, but I'm surprised that it hasn't been tried. Leaving Power of 10 aside there are plenty of unpaid statto 'nuts' in the UK and around the world who crunch mountains of data. Ireland must have a few. You'd only really need to track the regional and national championships, plus the few international competitions to lay down a solid database. The number of competitions and competitors aren't that vast.

A project for the A/R/T forum for 2012 - four interested posters, one for each province, then merge the data. Make it good enough maybe AAI will pay for it in due course.

longjump67

Well we could piggyback on the power of 10, I have my own daughter on it. She does not appear on the ranking lists as she is a not resident in the UK, however she appears on the bottom of the ranking as non resident.

She also has access to her personal log to track her progress and it's good that she can compare her performances with athletes of a simliar age in the UK.

Think if we informed the coaches in clubs throughout the country or regional boards to send results to the power of 10, the work would be done for us.;)

ecoli

RoyMcC wrote: »

Indeed, but I'm surprised that it hasn't been tried. Leaving Power of 10 aside there are plenty of unpaid statto 'nuts' in the UK and around the world who crunch mountains of data. Ireland must have a few. You'd only really need to track the regional and national championships, plus the few international competitions to lay down a solid database. The number of competitions and competitors aren't that vast.

A project for the A/R/T forum for 2012 - four interested posters, one for each province, then merge the data. Make it good enough maybe AAI will pay for it in due course.

There was a guy who used to be on the old Leevale message board who used to be great for compiling Junior results but he disappeared after the the site died but here is the ones from 2007-2008

http://www.createphpbb.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=1&sid=f76677cdce72fbd50013972fbfb406f2&mforum=leevale

It would be an idea but with the amount of work involved it would take some major work especially at younger ages are results arent always readily available online

longjump67

I know that the Northern Ireland results are sent to it as is the Dublin graded meets, All-Ireland schools, All-Ireland Senior, Junior and Juvenile indoor and outdoors also.

All that is needed is for 1 person (coach or club sec) to input the information of their athletes Name, DOB, events etc...

I'm going to suggest this to my own club to see if their is any interest among athletes/coaches, will keep you all informed on progress.

a_non_a_mouse

Poweroften is great alright, but it won't list athletes from the Republic in the ranking.
From what I thought NI athletes are included, and even if you add an athlete from ROI they won't show in the ranking page
So I'm surprised to hear longjump67 has a daughter who shows up at bottom of ranking as "resident non uk".
That doesn't seem to be the case for any other athlete I checked...and I checked for athletes in the same club who do have results listed if you search by name.
Also...even though on the face of it they do have Irish results...its very much GB &NI focused (as can be expected) so for example Irish Seniors..
http://www.thepowerof10.info/results/results.aspx?meetingid=54499
mostly only lists NI athletes...
So even getting the results sent might not be enough, but poweroften is defo better than nothing and if more results get sent/added so much the better.

ChickenTikka

I think powerof10 is an excellent site and often use it as its a useful benchmark for judging talent at different ages if you are a coach.

The closest thing I've found for it in Ireland is the universities results database:-

http://sindar.net/iuaa/results/

Way to go in my opinion would be to sponsor the extension of such a system to cover other Irish competitions and do it through a college ... e.g. sponsor a few M.Sc.s to do the necessary software development.

I believe that AAI are in the process of commissioning an online entry system for its championships. Not sure if it will extend to capturing results or feed into a results system but if the 2 were combined, it would require less maintenance.

robinph

PowerOf10 also only lists UKA registered races, along with any foreign ones.

I think that ARC is a kind of break away group of clubs and race registration type stuff, possibly cheaper for the clubs or something. Unfortunately far too many of the races I've been doing recently end up being ARC registered so I'm no getting my rankings updated or the handicap listing improvements on RunBritain either.

longjump67

a_non_a_mouse wrote: »

From what I thought NI athletes are included, and even if you add an athlete from ROI they won't show in the ranking page
So I'm surprised to hear longjump67 has a daughter who shows up at bottom of ranking as "resident non uk".

Maybe its because we are in Ulster that she is included at the bottom of the rankings. With the NI athletics and the Ulster Council running the championships together now, before the NI athletes would have been run under UKA rules.

RoyMcC

But Power of 10 does in fact include many elite ROI athletes (e.g. Cragg, Cuddihy, O'Rourke).

bazman

Powerof10 does include a lot of Irish athletes. I really like the website. So much so, that I've developed a similar website, which will be launched in advance of the 2012 season. Intention is for the admin team to add at least the top-20 performances from all race results we can get our hands on. There will also be a self-administration function so any athlete can put their performances up. It will also be retrospective, with ability to put up past results - I'm hoping to get my hands on as many results as possible, so plenty of work I expect.

If anyone is really interested in this area and would like to help out please let me know.

For Irish ranking, it's worth looking at http://www.athleticsireland.ie/content/?page_id=6210
and
http://www.athleticsireland.ie/content/?page_id=131

longjump67

bazman wrote: »

Powerof10 does include a lot of Irish athletes. I really like the website. So much so, that I've developed a similar website, which will be launched in advance of the 2012 season. Intention is for the admin team to add at least the top-20 performances from all race results we can get our hands on. There will also be a self-administration function so any athlete can put their performances up. It will also be retrospective, with ability to put up past results - I'm hoping to get my hands on as many results as possible, so plenty of work I expect.

If anyone is really interested in this area and would like to help out please let me know.

Well Bazman I would be willing to give you a hand, are you concentrating on track & field? Senior or Juveniles or both?

bazman

longjump67 wrote: »

Well Bazman I would be willing to give you a hand, are you concentrating on track & field? Senior or Juveniles or both?

Thank a mill for offer - will come back once website is finished (will be very soon) ...

Everyone who sets up an account will be able to add results, with a verificiation process - i.e. we'll need mods, like boards ...

Intention is for an all road/track/CC/duathlon/triathlon inclusive website.
Standard events for ranking at the moment are, but I'm happy to add more:
Road: 5km | 4mls | 8km | 5mls | 10km | 10mls | HalfMar | Marathon | 50km | 50mls | 100km
Track: 60m | 60mH | 100m | 110mH | 200m | 400m | 400mH | 800m | 1500m | 1mile | 3000m | 5000m | 10000m | 3000mSC
Indoor: i60m | i60mH | i200m | i400m | i800m | i1500m | i3000m
Tri: Duathlon55 | SprintTri | OlympicTri | HIMTri | IronManTri |

There is also an option to add results for non-standard events for personal athletic profiles, but these will not show on ranking lists.

Haven't added field events yet as website it time focused. Should I consider this as an important website change?

I'm not overly familiar with the junior scene - what age categories should we have by default?

RoyMcC

Seems to me the seniors are already fairly well catered for.

If there's anything I can do from an offshore location let me know.

Great initiative bazman. Have you thought about how you would filter out the 'dodgy' results e.g. standard of officiating, lack of wind readings etc? As my club's statistician I simply refuse to look at results unless they stand up to scrutiny.

bazman

RoyMcC wrote: »

Seems to me the seniors are already fairly well catered for.

If there's anything I can do from an offshore location let me know.

Great initiative bazman. Have you thought about how you would filter out the 'dodgy' results e.g. standard of officiating, lack of wind readings etc? As my club's statistician I simply refuse to look at results unless they stand up to scrutiny.

At the moment, website simply has unverified & verified results. Only verified results will be used for rankings, but unverified will show on athlete profiles.

bazman

By the way - any athletes out there with PHP skills and free time to work on this project? Would be useful to team for making changes. My PHP is ok, but I'm no expert

Got website developed in India - using personal funds. Unlikely to use India for maintenance. Not expecting to make profit from website - in time may add banner advertisments to fund maintenance of website.

longjump67

bazman wrote: »

Thank a mill for offer - will come back once website is finished (will be very soon) ...

Everyone who sets up an account will be able to add results, with a verificiation process - i.e. we'll need mods, like boards ...

Intention is for an all road/track/CC/duathlon/triathlon inclusive website.
Standard events for ranking at the moment are, but I'm happy to add more:

I'm not overly familiar with the junior scene - what age categories should we have by default?

Well juveniles start at U-12, athletes must not be 12 in year of competition. eg athlete U-12 born 2000 can compete in 2011
U-13 born 1999 2011
U-14 born 1998
etc...
Then Junior is U-20 & U-23 then Senior.

Could be a problem with athletes who are minors using the website, would suggest that coaches should be in charge of input of results and info.

What do you think?

PS don't think I'm the man your looking for cause I don't know what PHP is? lol

bazman

longjump67 wrote: »

PS don't think I'm the man your looking for cause I don't know what PHP is? lol

We need moderators for results and that's where you'll fit in. PHP is just the development language used for the website - I'm looking after it - help would be nice, but not essential - I can look after the technical side.

Where real help is required is loading and verifying results - without that website will be useless ...

climbhigh

It would be great to have an integrated database of Irish athletics performances across age groups, disciplines, and years. I have previously downloaded many of these results from the AAI website, e.g. http://www.athleticsireland.ie/XCC_CTY/MENSEN/XCC_IND0.HTM

It would be a lot of work to convert these stand alone results sheets into a database but it is possible. However it would be better if these results were integrated with the AAI registration database so that date of birth, club etc. could be added to each athlete from the outset.

The real challenge is how to most efficiently capture future results. The smart way would be along the IMRA lines so that results are produced in a format that can be directly input to the database. Ideally there would be a link between the athlete registration number in the AAI member database, the capture of entries for national championships, and the production of those results. That would still leave plenty of work for the input of selected results from county championships, schools races etc. It could also significantly reduce the amount of work by AAI officials in compiling entries and results for each championship.

A meeting with AAI, to look at going forward options, would be a good strategic start before signing off on the design of the system.

longjump67

climbhigh wrote: »

AAI website, e.g. http://www.athleticsireland.ie/XCC_CTY/MENSEN/XCC_IND0.HTM

Just clicked on your link to results and spotted a rather famous agent having a decent run in 42nd place, one Richard Simms sports agent to Bolt, Farrah etc...