Strategy / Course Managment

k.p.h

So a couple of scenarios here, would just like to see what people think.

1st Hole
Par4 - 410y - Index 4
Uphill drive with OB on the right and tree lined on the left. Fast first green protected from short approaches left and right by 2 small bunkers. Further protection from substantial rough around the green with shots that over shoot the green requiring an extreemly difficult up and down.

This hole usually plays like Index 3 and occasionally gives up the least amount of points on the course.

Do you take a driver and risk a 6/7 for a bad drive, or bring into play a 4 with a good drive but still requiring a good mid iron, a poor second shot would still allow a chance of an up&down but more often that not lead to a 5.

Do you take a recovery off the tee, this would effectively take the OB out of play and significantly reduce the chance of a big score. but it also leaves a long second shot so it effectively reduces the chance of a 4 also.Always a chance of and up&down but his play more often than not results in a 5 also.

To further complicate things, this is the first hole and we all know the joys of the first hole, have not hit a shot, people staring at you, chatting in the background.

So this scenario encompasses two elements, a go for it (risk reward style) or play it safe , and also first tee box management .

Second scenario is

Par 3
155y

Severely sloping green. When the pin is in it's Medal position their is a landing area about 5y deep and from 4y to 8y wide.

Shots above the hole leave an extreemly fast down hill putt. If the putt is not made the ball will continue for between 8ft to 15ft below the hole, or if shot is far too long and putt is from the very back of the green it may roll completely off the green. A 4 is always probable from this location.

Shots in the landing area below the hole usually end up being a 3 as the green is that severe but their is obviously always a chance of a birdie. Shots short of the green if lucky will end up in a narrow landing area which also leads to a good chance of a 3. But shots short or even level (remember only about 8y wide) will end up in quite difficult bunkers. The one on the right almost impossible to get within 20 and still leaves a downhill putt. And the one on the left would require a skillful shot to make Par but more often and not results in a 4.

Iv seen the average score on this hole drift to 5.8 sometimes even though it's Index 18 :eek: The problem is it's only 155y downhill in a sheltered area of the course. It's only a gentle 9i for me or sometimes even a PW will do. The thing is would any of ye walk up onto a relatively simple looking hole and from the outset just give up on the par and play for the bogey.?

Also the descriptions are wrote from my perspective so maybe a low handicapper might not describe them as being as difficult as I have :rolleyes:

I'm obviously a little bored today but would seriously like to see what people think about these type of plays. And also how they deal with the first tee box etc.

Deco1983

What h'cap category are you?...Is this competition strategy?

k.p.h

16 handicap , Yeah lets say it's stroke play. Also the distance on the Par 3 is a solid PW and a gentle 9i so it's right in between for me. It might be a simpler call for someone who has a distance the suited.

Hitting the driver extreemly well the last few days for a change but it's on the first tee when I have not hit a ball the indecision comes.

Opics

16 handicap should play for a bogey on an index 3. Don't use driver off the tee if it's dangerous, get on in 3 and give yourself a putt at the par.

On the par 3...make sure you're below the hole

L.O.F.T

Hit driver on the first, the shorter the iron you have in the better. If your going to hit a hybrid as you have suggested to take the trouble out of play from the tee why not just hit 7 iron, 7 iron and PW to the green!
As for the par 3 stay below the hole or aim for the middle of the green.
From an outside perspective your over thinking. Just hit the ball, know your yardages and ability and live with it. Its only a game....

ssbob

k.p.h wrote: »

16 handicap , Yeah lets say it's stroke play. Also the distance on the Par 3 is a solid PW and a gentle 9i so it's right in between for me. It might be a simpler call for someone who has a distance the suited.

Hitting the driver extreemly well the last few days for a change but it's on the first tee when I have not hit a ball the indecision comes.

Hi KPH I have similar problems to yourself with course management but if in a competition I would in your position go for a bogey on the first ie. taking a bad drive out of the equation and take on the pin on the par 3, more often than not with your 9 iron/PW your not going to be that far out!

Keano

I actually wish I had the confidence to play a good steady iron off the first tee with people watching. I hit them so well but always go for the big drive and as of late losing balls of the first tee.

k.p.h

L.O.F.T wrote: »

Hit driver on the first, the shorter the iron you have in the better. If your going to hit a hybrid as you have suggested to take the trouble out of play from the tee why not just hit 7 iron, 7 iron and PW to the green!
As for the par 3 stay below the hole or aim for the middle of the green.
From an outside perspective your over thinking. Just hit the ball, know your yardages and ability and live with it. Its only a game....

Ah it's just boredom really and just looking to see what other people think, on the course I always just decided and go and never really get too emotionally invested. If anything I would say I under think sometimes. Except on the first tee , quite often I will standing over the ball thinking "shut up brain" :rolleyes:.

Decision making is an important aspect of getting the scores down right ..?

k.p.h

Keano A Legend wrote: »

I actually wish I had the confidence to play a good steady iron off the first tee with people watching.

I'v never seen that done actually. But I'v often seen people taking their 5th shot on the first tee box (I'v done that before two). I think it probably takes more bollox to play safe then to actually take the shot on TBH.

L.O.F.T

k.p.h wrote: »

Decision making is an important aspect of getting the scores down right ..?

Decision making is important. Play to your strengths, never play a shot you've not practised, and get your self a range finder or laser so that you know your carry distance over a hazard be it a bunker or water hazard to the green or fairway hazard.
Middle of the green is never a bad option. You have to know how far you hit each club in order for any of the above to be relevant. Its a basic but you would be surprised how many dont. The laser has been the best addition to my bag in the last year and a half, fairway markers are useless if you dont know how far the pin is on the green.

f22

Sounds very like the opening 2 holes in Rathdowney KPH?

k.p.h

f22 wrote: »

Sounds very like the opening 2 holes in Rathdowney KPH?

Yup f22 I have a sneaky feeling that a large amount of people come to the third tee box just about ready to finish up TBH. In recent medal 121 starters both holes only gave up 25 Pars or better. And the Par 3 is Index 18 :eek:

Actually just a quick question about the index's. They are set up with Cat1 players in mind yeah.?

Think thats spot on about distances LOFT. But since I'm trying to improve my swing I'm getting a big dispersion with my distances at the moment.Slowly getting more accurate but since I'm not entirely comfortable with my swing yet the contact is not consistent yet. Could have up to 20m difference between my top end and bottom on my mid irons. That something for next year though I guess.

GreeBo

Guys this has been handled, move on.

Cubenio

Lads - language please!!!

Deco was out of order and got a bit hot under the collar

optics - you seem to be able to do condescending pretty good yourself given a post I just read by you

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056368200

See you in 7 days I'd say

nocal

Keano A Legend wrote: »

I actually wish I had the confidence to play a good steady iron off the first tee with people watching. I hit them so well but always go for the big drive and as of late losing balls of the first tee.

The confidence comes from planting your first shot in the middle of the fairway. I know because I always play an iron off the first tee. I am not great with my woods so tend to only get them out if I am hitting the ball well.

Even when I am hitting the woods well there are one or two holes where I revert back to the trusty 4 iron - if the tee shot is uphill.

I've had comments about this but simply reply with it suits me better on this hole. I've also had opponents think that I had the honour on the first tee because I am waving an iron about in my hands.

As for the OP - play the percentages - especially at the beginning of the round. Play the first hole safely and work out how to hit that 9 iron of yours just off full so that it is in between a normal 9 iron and a PW. Always better off standing on the 3rd tee with 2 or 3 points rather than 0.

f22

KPH, was a member ther for 6 months about 5 years ago so know the course well. Always favoured driver on the first, always favoring the left side, the further over the hill the better. It's not the easiest of approaches with an uphill lie and mid iron so I'd rather take the risk with the tee shot.

The 2nd is a tough cookie and all depends on the pin. I always dropped a club and punched the ball in with less spin.

Have very fond memories of the course and won my first medal there. Saw a chap put 3 balls OB on the first one day and get back in his car!

chalkie 501

I would advise going to the range/practice pitch before any round,just to loosen out a bit,20 balls is probably enough.you could try to envisage the opening tee shot and see how your hitting the driver/rescue/4iron,then at least when you get to the first tee you wont feel as tense or nervous with a few people watching and you'll have an idea how your hitting the driver or whatever club you decide on(i would advise going with the driver option myself:p)
As for the second it sounds like below the hole is the only play,so just make sure you hit something that cant go long

k.p.h

Actually some mixed responses here, I was actually expecting the take the recovery/iron response to be more prominent.

Actually think you have a point about taking the 2pts Opics. But it's knowing when to do it is the thing. Sometimes playing for the 2 you end up making a balls of a shot and ending up with 1. Then when playing for the 3 its a lottery at times could end up with anything from a birdie to a scratch.

I'm starting to think that it's not something you can just decided to do. Maybe it's more about experience or maybe some people just have a good head for it. It's definitely worth a shot or two, maybe even more the higher the handicap so worth considering anyway.

f22 wrote: »

Always favoured driver on the first, always favoring the left side, the further over the hill the better. It's not the easiest of approaches with an uphill lie and mid iron so I'd rather take the risk with the tee shot.

I reckon you probably have the right play here f22 (although you do have the adventage of actually knowing the hole ). Keeping left takes the OB out of play unless you hit an absolutely horrendous drive. It bring trees and rough into play, but once you don't get unlucky you are still going to have a line go gain some yardage when putting it back in the fairway so it all adds up to a bogey in the end anyway..

Well done on the medal by the way .

golfnut1

Hi guys

Can anyone here recommend a good book on course management/ strategy?
Appreciate any suggestions
thanks

snowy666

Damage Control by Dave Pelz is ok. I've a copy I'd be happy to lend if you're ever near Loughlinstown (work) or Tyrrelstown (home).

For what it's worth, you may have better luck opening a new thread for future questions, as a lot of people ignore threads they've looked at previously.

golfnut1

snowy666 wrote: »

Damage Control by Dave Pelz is ok. I've a copy I'd be happy to lend if you're ever near Loughlinstown (work) or Tyrrelstown (home).

For what it's worth, you may have better luck opening a new thread for future questions, as a lot of people ignore threads they've looked at previously.

Thanks a million Snowy for your kind offer but I might just pick myself up a copy online. I might take while reading it. thanks anyway.
I hear you about new threads you might be right.

Thanks again.