following criminals

kielmanator

Hi folks, I have a question that's a bit long winded, but it's been niggling me for ages, so hopefully I can put thought to paper!:)

All hypothetical

Basically, the scenario is thus. A member of the general public is driving on a busy road. Traffic is snarled due to a car a bit in front acting the maggot. The driver is erratic, potentially intoxicated. They're aggressive towards pedestrians trying to cross at lights (green man lit), they're blowing red lights endangering pedestrians, and the driver is getting out of the car a lot to throw abuse at people.

The member of the public rings 112 and gets put through to local Garda Central Control. The person gives descriptions of occupants and the vehicle (plate number included) and informs the Garda that they are still behind the vehicle heading towards "LOCATION" on "Yellow Road".

The dangerous car suddenly accelerates above and beyond 100 kp/h and vanishes from view. The person talking to the Garda asks for permission to follow the car until Traffic Corps units in pursuit (as to which the person was told) can apprehend the dangerous driver. What would the Garda say?

Second of all, same scenario as above except the member of the public is an off duty member of the Defence Forces. Can the off duty soldier follow the dangerous car without asking for permission or does such an exemption exist?

The following video is the kind of scenario I'm referring to!

MagicSean

No

Zambia

Good god no.

Our man in Havana

Not a chance in hell would that be authorised.

MarkR

It's time to stop watching "World's most amazing police chases".

They are trained. You are not. They are in a marked vehicle. You are not. They are legally allowed to. You are not.

Imagine you did get the go ahead. You race on down the road. Walter Mitty sees you tearing through red lights and calls it in. The powers that be also recognise him as a fellow man of justice, and he chases you.

In short, no. There are so many reasons why that would never ever happen.

kielmanator

MarkR wrote: »

It's time to stop watching "World's most amazing police chases".

I posted this question out of legal interest, as I just completed my FETAC 5 in legal studies, I didn't post this because I'm a couch potato and thought it would be cool to be a vigilante. Don't be so quick to jump the gun!;)

MarkR

kielmanator wrote: »

I posted this question out of legal interest, as I just completed my FETAC 5 in legal studies, I didn't post this because I'm a couch potato and thought it would be cool to be a vigilante. Don't be so quick to jump the gun!;)

Never said you were. Surely at some stage there was a chapter called "Vigilante Justice" with a big "No no" next to it.

Was there some kind of ambiguity in the road traffic act that made you wonder this?

Kind of reminds me of the American Wild West, and sherrifs deputizing the locals to back him up against a bad guy.

source

A Garda would never give you permission to follow a car that is driving like a lunatic is at the wheel. The reason? If you crashed and were asked what you were doing, you would say the Garda told you to follow the car, next thing the Garda is being investigated for causing a crash by sending an untrained driver into a dangerous situation. If you have the registration number, then it is easy to find the car after the fact.

I remember watching that video the first time and thought what the hell is he doing? If he had crashed he would have been liable for anything that happened, he also left himself open to repeating the initial incident, then where would he have been. Also in that video he followed off his own back, only calling the police when he caught up with the car. We also don't know what they police said to him as the audio for that was muted.

In this case it worked out okay, but it is a stupid thing to do, not only are you putting yourself in danger, but you're also putting other road users and pedestrians in danger. Give the registration to authorities and let them deal with it, they have the training and expertise to deal with this a civilian doesn't.

kielmanator

MarkR wrote: »

Was there some kind of ambiguity in the road traffic act that made you wonder this?

Actually no, but you're very close. I was thinking about the Criminal Justice (Surveillance) Act 2009.

3.— A member of the Garda Síochána, a member of the Defence Forces or an officer of the Revenue Commissioners shall carry out surveillance only in accordance with a valid authorisation or an approval granted in accordance with section 7 or 8 .

I know what it says, but was just curious to see if there was unofficial leeway when it comes to Defence personnel!:)

Because the member of the Defence Forces might suspect the car in front to be involved in gangland crime.

Victor

In such a situation, I imagine the Garda would merely not object to you being (and continue to be) a witness. However, sometimes witnesses become zealous and risk breaking the law themselves. Certainly the Garda can't authorise you to break the law.

Members of the Defence Forces can be deputised by a Garda of a senior rank for a limited number of hours and de jure become members of the Garda.