Why are Offaly so good?

harpsman

Im sure this will be locked but I do think its worth dicussing why counties with similar demographics have such wildly varying degrees of success.

Kerry seem to win multiple all-irelands every decade and a small county like Offaly won football and hurling all-irelands from the 70s to the 90s(maybe before as well).

Yet Wicklow and Westmeath have one provincial championship between them.They re both GAA counties-I know theres a bit of soccer in Bray and Athlone-with big enough populations.

Why?

StephenHendry

i think offaly were very lucky that a group of very talented players came together at the right time in the 1980s in both football and hurling. more so in hurling in the 1980s where with the small number of clubs produced so many good players, but they struggled in the 90s then to produce more good underage teams which meant that they went in to decline after 2000.

Mr. Incognito

Kerry have the tradition.

Which means they have the structures in place to produce competitive teams every year.

Then when a talented crop comes along they make hay.

Like New Zealand in Rugby or Kilkenny in Hurling.

Offaly had a good crop but no structure

Back in 1981, Offaly had a population of 58,312. Roughly the same size as Carlow's population today for example. However according to wiki (it never lies )

After a scheme developed by the Gaelic Athletic Association in the 1970s to encourage the playing of hurling in non-traditional counties, Offaly was one of the first teams to benefit from such a scheme. As a result the county won six Leinster titles in the 1980s, as well as their first All-Ireland Senior Hurling Championship in 1981.

The Carlows and Westmeaths of this world have improved the last 10 years but unfortunately so have some of the more traditional teams. However i see no reason why both those smaller counties and some of the ulster counties can catch up with the likes of the Wexfords and the Offalys if the GAA give them the support and encourage more All Ireland competition at younger ages to get youngsters playing the game against the traditional counties.

Wexford and Offaly are lobbying for all their worth to play against the 'big counties' in Division 1, as they think if they are not hurling will die away in these places. To be honest i dont buy that argument.
If that was the case why would Liam Rushe, Peter Kelly or Joey Boland from Dublin aspire to play for a non traditional hurling county instead of playing other sports? With all due respect to Dublin while they always had one or two good hurlers but would the teams performance prior to say the mid noughties inspire anyone to hurl for their county?

Damokc

misleading title...should read "were" instead of "are".you even clear that up yourself in your post.

maestroamado

I suppose when you ask the question?
I think it is probably something to do with the "BIFFO"factor
I am told that means big and thick but to be honest i don't know.
Please confirm.
Thanks

Fergus_Nash

Well from a Wicklow point of view I'll offer a couple of reasons. We never had good, successful underage development squads. One of the lasting legacies of Micko's stint with us, hopefully, is the emphasis put on the development of youngsters. More squads, I think the development of a dedicated centre of excellence (although that may have been shelved due to the current spot of bother we seem to be in), good coaches, etc.

Look at the rejuvenation of Dublin hurling, the legendary story about the Kilkenny County Board going mad because they lost a minor match and setting out to never let it happen again. Tipperary minor footballers and the new County chairman, I think it's him anyway, wanting Tipp to be contesting the Senior football final by 2020. The same emphasis isn't in Wicklow.

Also the same coaching isn't either. In my local club most of the juvenile teams are coached by the father of one of the players. At the last blitz day the two U.8 teams had fathers over them who had never played for the club in their lifetime. I remember watching a TG4 profile of Mickey Harte who goes down to coach some of the juvenile teams in his club. Never happens here.

This is Wicklow's story along with the fact that some previous managers let rivalries get in way of their selections.

homerjay2005

thread title is not exactly correct, they aint been good, at either sport, in about 10 years now...

J Cheever Loophole

Doesn't answer the original question, but I discovered this answer to Kerry's success, many years ago, on GAABoard. It was provided by an Offaly man - Bord na Mona man - and I thought was the best answer to the on going internet debate about why Kerry are always successful - hence the reason why I kept a copy.

• Large population (crucially no city)
• Competing sports aren't strong
• Tradition - which means: 1. An expectation of winning, 2. Good coaching, as the skills and knowledge are widespread and seamlessly passed through generations and 3. The knowledge of what it requires to win trophies.
• A reasonably high income county - Tourism, Fishing etc. Occupations that can be lucrative and not heavily taxed. This reduces emigration and also keeps the rural population healthy.
• Rural clubs are more efficient than urban ones in producing county standard players per capita.
• In a weak province for many years.and now the qualifier system work in Kerry's favour,
• A healthy club scene that would appear to be less parochial than in other counties.
• A county championship - Regional teams taking part in a very competitive structure.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

Out of curiosity, in what way is Kerry's club scene less parochial? Is the parish rule laxly enforced?

Lu Tze

Fergus_Nash wrote: »

Well from a Wicklow point of view I'll offer a couple of reasons. We never had good, successful underage development squads. One of the lasting legacies of Micko's stint with us, hopefully, is the emphasis put on the development of youngsters. More squads, I think the development of a dedicated centre of excellence (although that may have been shelved due to the current spot of bother we seem to be in), good coaches, etc.

Look at the rejuvenation of Dublin hurling, the legendary story about the Kilkenny County Board going mad because they lost a minor match and setting out to never let it happen again. Tipperary minor footballers and the new County chairman, I think it's him anyway, wanting Tipp to be contesting the Senior football final by 2020. The same emphasis isn't in Wicklow.

Also the same coaching isn't either. In my local club most of the juvenile teams are coached by the father of one of the players. At the last blitz day the two U.8 teams had fathers over them who had never played for the club in their lifetime. I remember watching a TG4 profile of Mickey Harte who goes down to coach some of the juvenile teams in his club. Never happens here.

This is Wicklow's story along with the fact that some previous managers let rivalries get in way of their selections.

Just to add to this, Micko managed (to some degree) to get players from rival teams to come together and play as a team. When i lived in Wicklow there seemed to be a great divide between the east and west teams, and also between Pats and Rathnew.

Never seen rivalry like it before, bordering on hatred. When pats won the county chanpionship, a sign was put up outside rathnew primary school, something along the lines of 156 county championship medals came out of this school.

Bizzum

There is no escaping the fact that Offaly are in decline the last decade or so.
The OP does however raise an interesting point, one I've often pondered.
I can't understand why so many other counties with greater population, greater structures and more money involved, have achieved much less.

I do know as an Offaly man, emotional baggage is never a problem, even when we are poor (and we can be!).
A factor I have noticed is the unusually large number of brothers that have represented Offaly in both codes over the years.
I've heard it said of the Offaly man too that you wouldn't drive him with an iron bar but you'd lead him with a thread!
Maybe there's something in it!