Why are the RUC called black?

Wolfe Tone

I've heard it said a fair few times, and I have heard a few explanations.


One is that they were called black bastards because their behavior was similar to the Black and Tans, kicking in doors, trashing houses and killing people, another explanation I heard was that RUC members where also members of some sectarian protestant group that was a bit like the OO but had "black" somewhere in the name.


Can anyone shed some further light on this and does anyone have any info on the protestant group?

jill_valentine

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

I heard was that RUC members where also members of some sectarian protestant group that was a bit like the OO but had "black" somewhere in the name.

I think this might be a sidelong reference to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Black_Institution ?

goose2005

I've also heard "black" being used for "completely", e.g a village being described as "black Protestant", or the Irish "dubh le daoine" (black with people, crowded)

Fratton Fred

Is it not a reference to the "Evil Protestants having a black heart"?

I consider it a bigoted phrase to describe "Prods".

Corsendonk

goose2005 wrote: »

I've also heard "black" being used for "completely", e.g a village being described as "black Protestant", or the Irish "dubh le daoine" (black with people, crowded)

Yeah I was up in Armagh 3 years ago and the guy I was visiting kept talking about his black neighbours, only copped it when he pointed the black neighbour house out with the Union Jack on the chimney.:D

Joe10000

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Is it not a reference to the "Evil Protestants having a black heart"?

I consider it a bigoted phrase to describe "Prods".

That is my understanding too.

Wolfe Tone

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Is it not a reference to the "Evil Protestants having a black heart"?

I consider it a bigoted phrase to describe "Prods".

Apparently not, seems the first answer was correct, I asked around a bit more and thats the reason I've been told.

jill_valentine

I dunno, it's my understanding that the Royal Black Institution was a bit more sober and thoughtful than the OO and chums. I would have thought that "black bastards" was more a comment on the perception of their character, myself.

Curious one though.

owenc

No it isn't a reference to Protestants it's a refrence to the ruc (sometimes the psni) I've been called this many of times by Protestants And I doubt they'd be calling themselves that somehow now.. All I can say is how foolish to tell someone something so dangerous about your parents

owenc

jill_valentine wrote: »

I dunno, it's my understanding that the Royal Black Institution was a bit more sober and thoughtful than the OO and chums. I would have thought that "black bastards" was more a comment on the perception of their character, myself.

Curious one though.

I somehow don't think they are respectful have you seen them! They ware big massive black coats and walk down the road not saying anything in silence it creeps me out the orange order is different in that they actually make noise these INS don't... Also have you seen the names of sone of them "black skull" that's just freaky I really don't think that's respectful

Fratton Fred

owenc wrote: »

No it isn't a reference to Protestants it's a refrence to the ruc (sometimes the psni) I've been called this many of times by Protestants And I doubt they'd be calling themselves that somehow now.. All I can say is how foolish to tell someone something so dangerous about your parents

Why would you be called it?

owenc

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Why would you be called it?

Simply because there is a lot of kids with parents who are in or were in terrorist organizations in my school who hate police But I don't care because I can't stand these people as they've all got pea sized brains and think they're above everyone despite the fact they're fat and live in council estates.... This is normal in ni anyway we are used to it im sure it's happened to others too..

Paddy De Plasterer

I've heard it said to describe committed Protestants. Also used is "deep"

Wolfe Tone

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Why would you be called it?

His father was/is a copper, perhaps thats the reason.


Does anyone have anything better about the RBI than Wikipedia? Not a fan of that site.

It says members had to first join the Orange Order.

To be eligible to join the Royal Black Institution one must be a Protestant male over the age of 18 who believes in the Trinity. What is more, the entrant must be a member of the Orange Order and the Royal Arch Purple Order (for at least three months). The potential member must also affirm that he is an active member of a Protestant denomination. On top of this, he must swear not to marry “a member of the Romanish Church or Papist, nor stand sponsor for the child of a Roman Catholic when receiving baptism by a Priest of Rome, nor permit a Papist to stand sponsor for my child at its baptism.” The Black must be satisfied that the potential recruit has been faithful to the secrets and mysteries of the lower Loyal Orders and that his behaviour is of an acceptable standard.

Prospective candidates do not normally apply to join the Black but are usually invited to become members by those already in the Institution. However, this procedure has been relaxed in recent times due to the dramatic fall in membership numbers. The Black has been forced to water down this policy, and to engage in a proactive recruiting campaign amongst Orange members and within the wider Protestant community. The Institution knows that if it continues to lose members as it has been over this past number of years many more preceptories will soon be faced with dissolution.

I got that from here:

http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/black.html

I just did a quick google so I don't know how accurate it is, it claims to "expose" secret societies.

Brother

---

before being admitted a member of the Royal Black Institution it is necessary that you take upon yourself a voluntary yet solemn and binding obligation. Are you willing to do so? Yes.

Kneel upon your right knee in token of your humility, place your right hand on the Holy Bible in token of your sincerity and repeat after me.

I (full name) do most solemnly and sincerely promise that I will keep all matters and things confided to me in this Royal Black Institution and shall not by any means discover or entrust them (unless previously authorized so to do) to another person except to a Brother of the same Colour and Degree.

I will not initiate any person unless duly empowered so to do by the proper authorities holding a warrant for that purpose under the Independent Grand Black Chapter of the British Commonwealth (say in full) the same having been transferred into their hands legally.

I will as far as in my power aid and assist all Brethren of the "Royal" Black Institution And not wrong or see any of them wronged if in my power to prevent it.

I will to the utmost of my power support and defend her present Majesty, her heirs and successors being Protestant and maintain the Protestant Religion and Constitution of 1688 against all foes foreign and domestic.

I now become a member of the Inst. Of my own free will and accord and will not debase the Institution by receiving hire or gain for admitting persons into its Precetories nor for a less sum than that authorized xxx by the Independent Grand Black Chapter of the British Commonwealth or by permitting to be received less than the said sum, namely 50p which sum I now pay (or have paid).

I will have such a sense of my duty as a Protestant that I will not marry a member of the Romanish Church or Papist, nor stand sponsor for the child of a Roman Catholic when receiving baptism by a Priest of Rome, nor permit a Papist to stand sponsor for my child at its baptism.

I will obey without scruple or reserve in all things lawfull the rules of this Institution. Of which I now become a member.

And furthermore do most solemnly and sincerely promise that I will not write, indite, cut, carve, stamp, stain, paint, imboss, or engrave upon any thing moveable or immovable any of the signs, secrets or passwords of this Royal Black Institution whereby or whereon the same might become legible or intelligible to any person under the whole Canopy of Heaven. So help me O Almighty God and keep me steadfast in this my solemn but voluntary obligation being that of a Royal Black Knight of the Camp of Israel.

Thats supposedly the oath they take, from the same site.

Fratton Fred

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

His father was/is a copper, perhaps thats the reason.

Does anyone have anything better about the RBI than Wikipedia? Not a fan of that site.
It says members had to first join the Orange Order.

I got that from here:

http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/black.html

I just did a quick google so I don't know how accurate it is, it claims to "expose" secret societies.

Thats supposedly the oath they take, from the same site.

Sounds like a fun place.

jonniebgood1

owenc wrote: »

No it isn't a reference to Protestants it's a refrence to the ruc (sometimes the psni) I've been called this many of times by Protestants And I doubt they'd be calling themselves that somehow now.. All I can say is how foolish to tell someone something so dangerous about your parents

I don't think you are correct with this. It is commonly used as a derogatory description of people of the protestant faith. There is an example of a recent well known happening of this:

‘Black’, in this case, was a reference not to the colour of his skin but to his religion. It is short for ‘Black Protestant’, a long-standing term of sectarian abuse.

http://www.lrb.co.uk/v29/n17/fintan-otoole/diary .

The term black has been used in negative terms many times in history, the black death, black 47, etc.

Magic Beans

For extra vehemence the adjective enamelled is sometimes added, viz "black enamelled bastards".

There is little doubt that the phrase comes from the Royal Black Preceptory.

Fratton Fred

Imo, where the phrase comes from is largely irrelevant, the manner in which it is used denotes if it is derogatory or not.

Manic Moran

Don't suppose it was as simple as the colour of the uniform? It was such a dark green, it could be confused with black sometimes.

NTM

jill_valentine

I dunno, the green uniform distinction was pretty widely known and often remarked upon. I remember hearing a lot of rhetoric about it, and how the RUC looked more like an occupying army rather than keeping of the peace, etc etc.

Snickers Man

Contemporary joke from the 70s 80s which might answer your question.

Why are the police called black bastards?

Because they are, you see.

Simples.

Magic Beans

Snickers Man wrote: »

Contemporary joke from the 70s 80s which might answer your question.

Why are the police called black bastards?

Because they are, you see.

Simples.

For the mentally bereft...

Because they R U C.

jonniebgood1

I think the OP question is answered now so thread is closed. Any queries by PM.