Ryanair and health & safety! or should i say Greed

robertxxx

Hi all,

Just back from nerja in Spain, went with O Leary and Co. i booked priority boarding for 10euro each way.

I noticed you could reserve a emergency exit seat for 20euro each way which i didn't, so once boarded we sat at the back of the EMG row seats on the wing which was fine, then one passenger came up to ask if they are empty before take off could he sit in one and was swiftly told no as the flight is not full, so out of the 12 seats 4 were taken.
Then just before take off the attendant asked me if in the event of an emergency would i open the door/etc... and he also said it to the guy on the row beside me.

Now this is what i think is a health and safety issue, if by bad luck we crashed and by the grace of God we survived, its up to me to jump out of my seat and run around and open the door and while doing that the other guy has to do the same if he's still alive!

Now correct me if I'm wrong but is it not proven that in the event of a crash the odds of getting out alive depends on speed and location to the exit door's and if i have to jump out of my seat and bump off the guy doing like wise and others who are following there is a good chance i will not be able to open the door as it would be like a stampede effect or at best would struggle to open it while being jostled by passengers.


Now on the way back from Spain my wife asked the same question about the seats and the attended said he's doesn't know if the plane is full as the system is not working and he would let us know later, and true to his word he asked if we wanted to take those seats as the plane was full but only 2 of the 12 were sold! so that to me means Ryanair puts profit before safety.

Skyb

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highlydebased

I'm almost certain it's a legal requirement. In the USA the passenger is required to recite certain phrases to confirm commitment (from my experience).

Run around before opening the door? Goodness me! Human instinct if an accident occured would be to get out, doubt you'd think much about getting up and opening it.

Skyb

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ted1

Putting money above safety costs money not saves money. What qualification have you to say what their doing is wrong. I'm sick of ever body bad mouthing the most succesive company to come out of Ireland without a solid argument.

Mint Sauce

I always try and take an exit seat on a plane, mainly down to leg room. The question from the crew on would I be willing to open the exit door is not exclusive to Ryanair. I have been asked on EasyJet, AerLingus, and the odd time I have used Ryanair as well, as well as everyother airline I have used, everytime I have sat there.

robertxxx

irish-stew wrote: »

I always try and take an exit seat on a plane, mainly down to leg room. The question from the crew on would I be willing to open the exit door is not exclusive to Ryanair. I have been asked on EasyJet, AerLingus, and the odd time I have used Ryanair as well, as well as everyother airline I have used, everytime I have sat there.

Yes but on the flight over i wasnt sitting in those seats they were empty bar 4 out of the 12.

Munster64

robertxxx wrote: »

Then just before take off the attendant asked me if in the event of an emergency would i open the door/etc...

What would happen if you said no, or if you drank some whiskey and fell asleep, or became incapable of opening the door.
Should you be trained to open the door before you take on this responsiblity?

Skyb

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mikemac

What would happen if some guy with crutches books one of these seats?
Or maybe an elderly person who was clearly struggling.

Would they be shifted and put a fit and able person there

I'd imagine this has happened as people with their leg in a cast want extra legroom but the crew might not want them in those seats

AfterDusk

mikemac wrote: »

What would happen if some guy with crutches books one of these seats?
Or maybe an elderly person who was clearly struggling.

Would they be shifted and put a fit and able person there

I'd imagine this has happened as people with their leg in a cast want extra legroom but the crew might not want them in those seats

Only those who are physically able are allowed to sit in emergency exit rows.

And it's perfectly safe for the rows not to be occupied at all. I don't know where this idea that someone has to sit in every emergency exit seat is coming from.

robertxxx

ted1 wrote: »

What qualification have you to say what their doing is wrong. I'm sick of ever body bad mouthing the most succesive company to come out of Ireland without a solid argument.

No qualification, just an observation of poor safety practice IMO, who gives a sh1t about how successful they are, thats not what I'm talking about, if you want to talk about how "successful" they are set up a poll and ask how "successful" passengers are when they complain!

Cessna_Pilot

robertxxx wrote: »

No qualification, just an observation of poor safety practice IMO, who gives a sh1t about how successful they are, thats not what I'm talking about, if you want to talk about how "successful" they are set up a poll and ask how "successful" passengers are when they complain!

Flew Aer Lingus to Gatwick recently. It was a quiet flight and there was no one in the emergency exit row. NO biggie, no rules being broken, and certainly no safety implication. But this was Aer Lingus, so they have different rules right:D

pclancy

Its common practice throughout the industry. I've always been asked every time i've sat at the exit row. Some airlines have made me pay for that extra space, others have not. Its certainly not Ryanair doing anything wrong or mean. You'll find some long haul airlines punt it allmost like a premier class row!!

If the aircraft was in a position to be evacuated after a crash landing they would chose the front and rear doors way quicker then the overwing doors and they would be opened and manned by a crew member. The captain may call to evacuate a certain side due to fire/damage/wind direction so probably only one side would be open. The overwing doors are a last resort and would more then likely be opened by a crewmember, they're simply using common sense by asking you if you're able to open it. If you had a medical problem, were disabled in some way, drunk, sick etc it would probably not be best that you sat there and they would make arrangements elsewhere.

There's no absolute requirement for you to take on any responsiblity to open the doors or do any heroics of any kind. You're not expected to perform but I would imagine if you'd survived a crash landing, the plane was on fire and badly damaged, you'd find yourself becoming an instant expert in the pulling of the simple red lever to get out and away. If you're not happy to do that i'm sure there will be another hundred or so people behind you that will happily open if for you

robertxxx

Cessna_Pilot wrote: »

Flew Aer Lingus to Gatwick recently. It was a quiet flight and there was no one in the emergency exit row. NO biggie, no rules being broken, and certainly no safety implication. But this was Aer Lingus, so they have different rules right:D

Wrong.;)

amen

Would they be shifted and put a fit and able person there

I was on Southwest flight years. An eldery group of ladies were sitting in the exit rows and were asked to move by the fa as they told her they believed they couldn't open the door in an emergency.

robertxxx

pclancy wrote: »

Its common practice throughout the industry. I've always been asked every time i've sat at the exit row. Some airlines have made me pay for that extra space, others have not. Its certainly not Ryanair doing anything wrong or mean. You'll find some long haul airlines punt it almost like a premier class row!!

If the aircraft was in a position to be evacuated after a crash landing they would chose the front and rear doors way quicker then the overwing doors and they would be opened and manned by a crew member. The captain may call to evacuate a certain side due to fire/damage/wind direction so probably only one side would be open. The overwing doors are a last resort and would more then likely be opened by a crew member, they're simply using common sense by asking you if you're able to open it. If you had a medical problem, were disabled in some way, drunk, sick etc it would probably not be best that you sat there and they would make arrangements elsewhere.

There's no absolute requirement for you to take on any responsibility to open the doors or do any heroics of any kind. You're not expected to perform but I would imagine if you'd survived a crash landing, the plane was on fire and badly damaged, you'd find yourself becoming an instant expert in the pulling of the simple red lever to get out and away. If you're not happy to do that i'm sure there will be another hundred or so people behind you that will happily open if for you

But i wasn't sitting in the exit row.


Total crap, IF im sitting in the exit row if it crash lands and there is no fire on that side or a cliff face then im pulling that leaver and not waiting to be told of waiting for a crew member to clamber between the seat to open the door.


I have no problem with opening that door, but their asking me to open it even when im not sitting in the exit row and yet even when the plane is not full they will not let anybody sit there who hasn't paid for them, im do give a sh1t about the cost of the seat but a exit door thats not maned.

What if rows 15, 16, 17, 18 where unoccupied then nobody is anyway near the exit doors over the wings, would that be safe?

robertxxx

amen wrote: »

I was on Southwest flight years. An eldery group of ladies were sitting in the exit rows and were asked to move by the fa as they told her they believed they couldn't open the door in an emergency.

Yes that is the norm in that situation.

But what im talking about is the fa is not putting anybody in or allowing anybody to use those seat's because they haven't paid the extra even though the plane is not full.

IMO i thinks its a safety issue.

I don't think there is a law regarding this as these seat's (on other airlines when free) are always taken for the extra legroom, so there was never a issue with the doors NOT being maned, that is until some airlines charge extra to sit there and nobody takes up that offer due to additional expense, thats where i think the problem is.

AfterDusk

There is no requirement for anyone to occupy those seats and that's it!

And I also don't know where the idea that cabin crew will open the overwings exits came from. They wouldn't brief you if they were going to open them.

robertxxx

neil2304 wrote: »

There is no requirement for anyone to occupy those seats and that's it!

And I also don't know where the idea that cabin crew will open the overwings exits came from. .

pclancy

Cessna_Pilot

robertxxx wrote: »

Wrong.;)

In what way? I was being sarcastic by the way.

IngazZagni

robertxxx wrote: »

Yes that is the norm in that situation.

But what im talking about is the fa is not putting anybody in or allowing anybody to use those seat's because they haven't paid the extra even though the plane is not full.

IMO i thinks its a safety issue.

I don't think there is a law regarding this as these seat's (on other airlines when free) are always taken for the extra legroom, so there was never a issue with the doors NOT being maned, that is until some airlines charge extra to sit there and nobody takes up that offer due to additional expense, thats where i think the problem is.

Where are you getting this nonsense from? No one needs to occupy the overwing exit rows. The only requirement is that those that are sitting there would be capable of opening the door and not block others from getting out. If no one is sitting there, that's fine, the first person to reach the door will open it. In other words children under 16, old/frail/disabled pax or those that are unwilling to open the door in an emergency can't sit there. That is the same with all airlines.
Lots of "legacy" carriers charge a premium for people to sit here. Ryanair are testing this out currently.

Ryanair cut corners in lots of areas but one area that is not cut is safety. Their safety record speaks for itself.

Locker10a

robertxxx wrote: »

But i wasn't sitting in the exit row.


Total crap, IF im sitting in the exit row if it crash lands and there is no fire on that side or a cliff face then im pulling that leaver and not waiting to be told of waiting for a crew member to clamber between the seat to open the door.


I have no problem with opening that door, but their asking me to open it even when im not sitting in the exit row and yet even when the plane is not full they will not let anybody sit there who hasn't paid for them, im do give a sh1t about the cost of the seat but a exit door thats not maned.

What if rows 15, 16, 17, 18 where unoccupied then nobody is anyway near the exit doors over the wings, would that be safe?

I dont know what the exact rules are but i have seen Aer Lingus cabin crew asking people "would you mind sitting in the exit row for take off and landing" on not so full flights! Now this could just down to them personally taking safety searously and wanting someone to be ready at that door or company policy! I dont know! Dont know if its a legal requirment or not!

Jamie2k9

Ryanair cut corners in lots of areas but one area that is not cut is safety. Their safety record speaks for itself.

Well said.

scotty_irish

shut up and look the their safety record (accident rate) http://www.planecrashinfo.com/rates.htm

Tenger

A thing to remember is that while all Irish airlines operate under IAA regulations they do have differing SOP's. So lets say that IAA rules do not stipulate that you must have the exit row occupied, thus FR are quite within the regs to leave them empty. But then perhaps EI themselves have a company rule that the exits must be occupied. Neither is safer then the other but both comply with IAA regs.

Remember, all 5 Irish airlines are regularly inspected by the IAA and their SOP's would have to be cleared with this body as well.

LadyTBolt

neil2304 wrote: »

There is no requirement for anyone to occupy those seats and that's it!

I think there might be a requirement with Aer Lingus.

Recently I was coming back from CDG and the flight was about 1/3 full (Guess). As I had booked my seat online I was already assigned to an aisle seat up near the front.
Before departure the F.A. approached me and asked if I was travelling alone. I said I was. She asked me if I wouldn't mind sitting back in one of the seats on the exit row as it was a requirement to have at least one passenger on each row at either side. She also said the same to another pax who sat on the row opposite me. I was thrilled as I now had an entire row with loads of leg room all to myself.:)

castie

Aer Lingus have been charging for exit seats for years now.

sunnysoutheast

As far as I'm aware the only regulations are that anyone who sits nearest the exit in an exit row has to be physically capable of opening the door and nobody sitting in that row can impede the exit of anyone else. Many airlines charge extra for exit rows, but even if you've paid the fee you can still be moved if you breach the above.

I believe MOL is on record as saying that the only thing that keeps him awake at night is safety. You can dislike Ryanair for many reasons (and, frankly, I do) but they take your safety as seriously as any other airline.

SSE

pclancy

Total crap? Sheesh. Ok i don't seem to be able to get my point across, it was that if you were not able to open the overwing doors, or there was nobody sitting there or nearby, somebody (crew or pax) would open the door. ..its okay, everything will be fine. There are 4 more doors to use which would be chosen quicker then the overwing exits.

Fr_2010

pclancy wrote: »

Total crap? Sheesh. Ok i don't seem to be able to get my point across, it was that if you were not able to open the overwing doors, or there was nobody sitting there or nearby, somebody (crew or pax) would open the door. ..its okay, everything will be fine. There are 4 more doors to use which would be chosen quicker then the overwing exits.

Firstly its an exit not a door and also a crew member would never open an overwing exit.

daddydick

This sort of a post enrages me.

For God sake you got a return flight to Spain for €20 - the price of 50 cigarettes.

It is standard for every airline to ask this question. Do you think that if a plane is in trouble the flight attendant is going to be able to go around and open every exit door? She is merely letting you know how to get out if the flight is in trouble and she is not there.

Standard practice in airlines worldwide, not just Ryanair.

No matter what anyone says Ryanair has opened up the skies for cheaper travel and it is so so typical for someone to give out about something so trivial as this. You could have flown BA for €600 and be asked to do the same thing.

robertxxx

A gentle reminder why these doors should be maned.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/5366151/Cheers-turn-to-screams-as-jet-overshoots-runway/

robertxxx

daddydick wrote: »

This sort of a post enrages me.

For God sake you got a return flight to Spain for €20 - the price of 50 cigarettes.

It is standard for every airline to ask this question. Do you think that if a plane is in trouble the flight attendant is going to be able to go around and open every exit door? She is merely letting you know how to get out if the flight is in trouble and she is not there.

Standard practice in airlines worldwide, not just Ryanair.

No matter what anyone says Ryanair has opened up the skies for cheaper travel and it is so so typical for someone to give out about something so trivial as this. You could have flown BA for €600 and be asked to do the same thing.

€20!! When was the last time you booked a flight?

I paid €680 total for the flight (for 2) so please stop trolling.

Fr_2010

robertxxx wrote: »

A gentle reminder why these doors should be maned.

All 4 A/C doors are manned

L1011

castie wrote: »

Aer Lingus have been charging for exit seats for years now.

You can still get them for free at checkin if nobody was willing to pay for them in advance (which is often the case).

As an aside I'm virtually certain that KLM's checkin pods in AMS will put a Gold Circle member in an exit row if one is available, the default seat I've been offered has been an exit row more often than not...

pclancy

Fr_2010 wrote: »

Firstly its an exit not a door and also a crew member would never open an overwing exit.

Ok. On many of the flights i have flown with many airlines around the world there is often a crew member seated at the exit row as well as the passengers. Different types, different airlines, different countries and policies...

Either way whats the point here?

This thread began as saying Ryanair have some kind of health and safety issue regarding their exit seating policy. I think the majority of posters here conclude that is not the case. Is there any reason to keep going?

castie

robertxxx wrote: »

A gentle reminder why these doors should be maned.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/5366151/Cheers-turn-to-screams-as-jet-overshoots-runway/

"but a taxi driver appeared from nowhere and charged me $20 to take me to the terminal. I had to pay, but in times of emergencies, you don't charge people for a ride,"

What the....

Fr_2010

pclancy wrote: »

Ok. On many of the flights i have flown with many airlines around the world there is often a crew member seated at the exit row as well as the passengers. Different types, different airlines, different countries and policies...

The point I was making is a crew member would never open an overwing exit on a 737. What you are referring to are larger a/c (eg) 757 , 767 , A330 etc, where there are regular doors in the centre of the a/c. Thats why there are crew sitting there (hence thats why they would operate them). On the 737-800 there are exits, not doors in the centre of the cabin. When was the last time you boarded a Ryanair flight from the wing?

pclancy

Yes, you are correct. I have never boarded a Ryanai flight from the wing.

I don't think the fact that there are no crewmembers nearby or that you sometimes must pay to sit in an exit row, often leaving exit rows empty as a result, makes a 737 belonging to Ryanair or any other airline any more dangerous then another type.

I would however happily pay a small fee to pop the exit and depart the plan from over the wing rather then jostle with some of the knobs who feel like they need to get off the plane before the other 170 of us.