Dublin-Derry Aer Arann Route withdrawn

Tazz T

Just found out that Aer Arann pulled the Dublin - Derry route last week, due to FF pulling the subsidy.

With no changes to the rail timetable, the quickest option is that bloody 'express' bus with the supplement. I use that flight a lot and heard nothing about it until I tried to book today.

We need a proper fast rail connection with the Northwest if there isn't going to be a flight.

Lapin

A bus from Dublin to Derry sounds like a nightmare of a journey. Even the train takes at least 4 and a half hours with the change at Belfast.

It might be quicker to fly via Prestwick.

Have Irish Rail / Translink ever considered a direct service from Dublin to Derry ?

dowlingm

Tazz T wrote: »

We need a proper fast rail connection with the Northwest if there isn't going to be a flight.

Nope - just better bus service to CFN - whose service remains.

Lapin - even if they did, both the Coleraine-Derry and Belfast-Newry sections are in dire need of TLC as well as better security against disruptions in the case of the latter. Coleraine-Derry is getting some work done but the other line's work has been deferred.

Terrontress

Lapin wrote: »

A bus from Dublin to Derry sounds like a nightmare of a journey. Even the train takes at least 4 and a half hours with the change at Belfast.

It might be quicker to fly via Prestwick.

Have Irish Rail / Translink ever considered a direct service from Dublin to Derry ?

I just don't think the demand is there to run that size of a train up to Derry. As long as it is timetabled so the Enterprise and Derry train meet.

As I understand it, the dismantling of the NI train network was done on political lines and there used to be a quicker route to Derry but that was ditched in favour of the one via Coleraine and Coleraine is a Protestant town, Derry Catholic.

patrickmooney

Flew it all the time. Needed to work on the way up so took the bus (with wifi), but when I tried to book the flight home, I found the route had been cancelled two days previous.

munchkin_utd

From the pso review report the subsidy for derry alone is 2.37 million euro a year working out at 111 euro subsidy each way per passenger
http://www.flyinginireland.com/news/dempseys-public-service-obligation-pso-route-decision-march-2011.html

Are you worth 222 euro subsidy (borrowed from the Ecb/ IMF etc) for your spins to Derry?
it's hard to justify to be honest even of it saves a few minutes journey time over an express bus from city centre to city centre

Tazz T

A few minutes?

The bus takes at least 4 hours.

The plane takes under 30 minutes.

The 'City of Culture 2013' now has no air connection to Dublin. One more setback like that and the airport will probably go under with a loss of jobs and new enterprise opportunities for the North West, so yes, the subsidy was worth reviewing at least.

LXFlyer

Tazz T wrote: »

A few minutes?

The bus takes at least 4 hours.

The plane takes under 30 minutes.

The 'City of Culture 2013' now has no air connection to Dublin. One more setback like that and the airport will probably go under with a loss of jobs and new enterprise opportunities for the North West, so yes, the subsidy was worth reviewing at least.

You are seriously exaggerating the time differences.

The 33 is scheduled to take 3 hours 30 minutes and the X33 2 hours 50 minutes.

Allowing 40 minutes to get from Dublin city centre, 60 minutes at the airport, 50 minutes on the aircraft (30 minutes is only the flying time, not the sector time) and say 30 minutes at the other end totals 3 hours.

sitstill

Last time I checked, Derry was in fact, in a different country so why should the tax payer/IMF subsidise flights there. I would like subsidised flights to Paris as I fly there often, not gonna happen though.

Tazz T

lxflyer wrote: »

You are seriously exaggerating the time differences.

The 33 is scheduled to take 3 hours 30 minutes and the X33 2 hours 50 minutes.

Allowing 40 minutes to get from Dublin city centre, 60 minutes at the airport, 50 minutes on the aircraft (30 minutes is only the flying time, not the sector time) and say 30 minutes at the other end totals 3 hours.

'is scheduled' is the phrase here. I have taken the 33 countless times and the X33 twice. The fastest either has done it is 3 hrs 50mins. The X33 timetable in particular is a joke. It can't be done in 3hrs in a car.

It takes 15 minutes through the port tunnel to the airport (check the bus eireann schedule for that). Personally I live closer to the airport than to the Busaras. Sure you've got check in time, but aren't you supposed to be at the busaras at least 20 minutes before the bus leaves. You sir are the one exaggerating.

killbillvol2

Tazz T wrote: »

A few minutes?

The bus takes at least 4 hours.

The plane takes under 30 minutes.

The 'City of Culture 2013' now has no air connection to Dublin. One more setback like that and the airport will probably go under with a loss of jobs and new enterprise opportunities for the North West, so yes, the subsidy was worth reviewing at least.

Would you be prepared to pay the full economic cost of the flight - 300+ return? That level of subsidy is unjustifiable, IMF or otherwise.

Tazz T

No, I wouldn't. I never said at any time that the level of subsidy wasn't too high. I said that it should be reviewed in an effort to keep the service.

In that case, let's shut down every subsidised route and airport in Ireland. Let's have no links with our nearest neighbour (on the same island) and let's destroy any chances of companies using these crucially important airlinks to invest in Ireland.

You just see a short term solution to fixing a monetary problem.

That's what got us in this mess. Fixing it demands investment in our infrastructure.

killbillvol2

Just for a bit of perspective here, before you get hysterical - we're talking about an average of 30 (thirty) people a day in each direction.

Tazz T

And... that's puts what in perspective.

LXFlyer

Tazz T wrote: »

lxflyer wrote: »

You are seriously exaggerating the time differences.

The 33 is scheduled to take 3 hours 30 minutes and the X33 2 hours 50 minutes.

Allowing 40 minutes to get from Dublin city centre, 60 minutes at the airport, 50 minutes on the aircraft (30 minutes is only the flying time, not the sector time) and say 30 minutes at the other end totals 3 hours.

'is scheduled' is the phrase here. I have taken the 33 countless times and the X33 twice. The fastest either has done it is 3 hrs 50mins. The X33 timetable in particular is a joke. It can't be done in 3hrs in a car.

It takes 15 minutes through the port tunnel to the airport (check the bus eireann schedule for that). Personally I live closer to the airport than to the Busaras. Sure you've got check in time, but aren't you supposed to be at the busaras at least 20 minutes before the bus leaves. You sir are the one exaggerating.

I think you can safely get to Busaras at least 10 minutes before departure or even 5.

Given the flights were at peak city travel times, allowing 15 minutes to get to the airport is not realistic. That's why I allowed 40 minutes.

The point is that city centre to city centre the two options were not that far apart time wise. 3 hours is a valid estimate for that trip by air.

cmccloskey56

Folks, I'll be coming to Ireland in September to do some family research. This will take me to Derry, both city and towns nearby.
I hear it is a long drive from Dublin and was looking for the most efficient way of getting there. I had hoped that I could fly there and pick up a car once there, but I don't see any air service to Dublin, nor *convenient* service from London (don't want to switch airports from Heathrow or Gatwick to Stansted). London and Dublin are the most convenient airports for me but I'll consider other places (Manchester?) if I can get a flight there from the US.

So, I'm reading about bus and train.
No direct service between Dublin and Derry on either?

What do you recommend? For an outsider whose hasn't ventured beyond DART in Ireland...

Colleen

L1011

cmccloskey56 wrote: »

Folks, I'll be coming to Ireland in September to do some family research. This will take me to Derry, both city and towns nearby.
I hear it is a long drive from Dublin and was looking for the most efficient way of getting there. I had hoped that I could fly there and pick up a car once there, but I don't see any air service to Dublin, nor *convenient* service from London (don't want to switch airports from Heathrow or Gatwick to Stansted). London and Dublin are the most convenient airports for me but I'll consider other places (Manchester?) if I can get a flight there from the US.

So, I'm reading about bus and train.
No direct service between Dublin and Derry on either?

What do you recommend? For an outsider whose hasn't ventured beyond DART in Ireland...

Colleen

There are direct buses:

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1309952642-33.pdf

The trains are poor and indirect, you need to take the Enterprise from Dublin and then a NIR train from Belfast to Derry.

ScouseMouse

Do you know you can fly direct to Belfast International Airport with continental?

Would that help?

cmccloskey56

Thanks for both suggestions - I hadn't considered coming directly in to Belfast; now I have to research that.

And taking the bus - brilliant! I'll check out duration, etc.

Thanks so much - all of these were options before but your experience and opinion about which is really practical is priceless.

Colleen

cmccloskey56

MYOB wrote: »

There are direct buses:

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1309952642-33.pdf

The trains are poor and indirect, you need to take the Enterprise from Dublin and then a NIR train from Belfast to Derry.

Just looked at the schedule - thanks for finding the exact schedule that I need! I see that there is an express picking up at the airport at 9:20 that gets me to Derry town before noon. I couldn't ask for anything more convenient than that.
US flights arrive about 6:30am so there is enough time to get through immigration and get my first Irish breakfast at the airport before catching the bus. Perfect!

L1011

There's a better breakfast to be had landside in Terminal 1 than 2 from memory; most US flights come in to 2....

cmccloskey56

Good to know. It depends on where the bus picks me up. If at T-1, then I'll slog all my junk over there - something else to research! I think I flew out T-2 last year - it was open last Sept?

I'll check in to the Continental flight to Belfast. If it flies out of Newark (EWR) - yech. I avoid the NYC-area airports if at all possible.
That's a gut reaction. I'll have to research the details first.

LXFlyer

The coach departs from the coach park - about a 4 to 5 minute walk from either terminal.

cmccloskey56

I was following up on suggestions made on these boards.
It looks like Continental flights from Newark directly to Belfast are fast and direct. No flying through LHR or transferring from Gatwick.
It then looks like hiring a car from there, considering that I want the freedom to explore the west.
Anything I should know?
First thing my family would say is 'Steer clear of Belfast!' but isn't that so ...1990s?

L1011

belfast is perfectly safe for a tourist now, you're not going to be wandering in to rough housing areas and a hire car will have a UK reg anyway. There are direct flights from Newark to Dublin also though are there not?

dowlingm

There's also a BFS-Derry bus
http://www.belfastairport.com/en/content/2/51/to-from-londonderry.html

Since BFS is west of Belfast and you want to go further west, avoiding Belfast city centre should be fairly easy.

markpb

cmccloskey56 wrote: »

First thing my family would say is 'Steer clear of Belfast!' but isn't that so ...1990s?

Belfast is a great (small) city for tourists to visit!

serfboard

dowlingm wrote: »

Since BFS is west of Belfast and you want to go further west, avoiding Belfast city centre should be fairly easy.

Agreed. Belfast International is miles away from the city - 'tis out in the country really.

cmccloskey56

Great suggestions, all!
Dublin is my comfort zone so all the suggestions about the bus (line 33X) is still valid.
However, someone suggested flying directly to Belfast, which, never having done that, I had to investigate. And I learned something - it's only 6.5 hours from Newark to Belfast. Other options take me through Dublin then bus or London and all its terminals, not to mention different airports.
My itinerary is changing as well.
While I may not be quite ready for Belfast city center, I now have lots of options that I hadn't considered before.

Brilliant!