Buying a repossessed house

DrPhilG

Looking at a property the other day, and I suspect it was a repossession/mortgage default. I asked the estate agent and he confirmed that it was under "bank ownership" but didn't expand any more than that.

The house has been stripped down pretty well, boiler removed, fireplace gone, even took the gates off the wall at the front which would support the idea that it was an unhappy owner taking what they could.

Anyone else bought a repo? Feels a bit strange, but on the other hand the house has been empty for about 2 years, so no sense leaving it to rot.

Are bank ownership houses likely to sell faster? I'm in a position to buy without a mortgage so I'm hoping that I'm in a good position to negotiate, plus people might be put off by the fact that it's a repossession.

the_syco

DrPhilG wrote: »

The house has been stripped down pretty well, boiler removed, fireplace gone, even took the gates off the wall at the front which would support the idea that it was an unhappy owner taking what they could.

Anyone else bought a repo? Feels a bit strange, but on the other hand the house has been empty for about 2 years, so no sense leaving it to rot.

If it was bought new, then repossessed, and left for two years, with the bad winter, amongst other things, problems may have gone unchecked, so I'd get someone to check the house out.

listermint

DrPhilG wrote: »

Looking at a property the other day, and I suspect it was a repossession/mortgage default. I asked the estate agent and he confirmed that it was under "bank ownership" but didn't expand any more than that.

The house has been stripped down pretty well, boiler removed, fireplace gone, even took the gates off the wall at the front which would support the idea that it was an unhappy owner taking what they could.

Anyone else bought a repo? Feels a bit strange, but on the other hand the house has been empty for about 2 years, so no sense leaving it to rot.

Are bank ownership houses likely to sell faster? I'm in a position to buy without a mortgage so I'm hoping that I'm in a good position to negotiate, plus people might be put off by the fact that it's a repossession.

That supports the idea that the metal staylers got to it

DrPhilG

listermint wrote: »

That supports the idea that the metal staylers got to it

Well the garage doors are still on, so not too bad!

the_syco wrote: »

If it was bought new, then repossessed, and left for two years, with the bad winter, amongst other things, problems may have gone unchecked, so I'd get someone to check the house out.

I think it was lived in for 4 or 5 years, then vacated. There has been a bit of a leak over the bathroom ceiling but not too bad but I will certainly check it out before offering. The floors in a few rooms have warped too due to being abandoned for a few years with no heat.

Raskolnikov

DrPhilG wrote: »

Anyone else bought a repo?

Often in a repo, the toilet has tape over it saying "Verified by XYZ - DO NOT USE", or something to that effect.

DrPhilG wrote: »

Are bank ownership houses likely to sell faster? I'm in a position to buy without a mortgage so I'm hoping that I'm in a good position to negotiate, plus people might be put off by the fact that it's a repossession.

You'd think that bank would just want shot of the thing, unfortunately there is still a lot of denial about the bank "not wanting to sell for less than what the property is worth".

DrPhilG

Raskolnikov wrote: »

Often in a repo, the toilet has tape over it saying "Verified by XYZ - DO NOT USE", or something to that effect.

Nothing like that, the only thing that suggests it is a repo is the fact that it's clearly been empty for a while, and my first thought was that the previous owners had stripped the place, rather than metal pinchers. There is no sign of break-in but the fireplace is gone.

Raskolnikov wrote: »

You'd think that bank would just want shot of the thing, unfortunately there is still a lot of denial about the bank "not wanting to sell for less than what the property is worth".

What surprised me is that the asking price seems reasonable. The same agent has a few properties that are priced way lower than similar houses, which makes me wonder if that's their strategy, start low to generate interest rather than start high and accept lower.

If we do offer I'll still probably open at about 25% below the asking price.

Raskolnikov

Feel free to lob an offer in if you're comfortable with it, just don't be surprised if it's rejected. A lot of the banks don't want to crystallise further property losses at this stage.

DrPhilG

Raskolnikov wrote: »

Feel free to lob an offer in if you're comfortable with it, just don't be surprised if it's rejected. A lot of the banks don't want to crystallise further property losses at this stage.

Yeah well there's no harm in offering. If it's rejected I can always bump it up a bit. Worth a shot!

the_syco

DrPhilG wrote: »

What surprised me is that the asking price seems reasonable.

Unless they know it's a lemon.

DrPhilG wrote: »

There has been a bit of a leak over the bathroom ceiling but not too bad but I will certainly check it out before offering.

A leaky lemon. Water has probably gotten in, and a puddle has formed in the attic. Also risk of rot in the timber that holds up the roof.

DrPhilG wrote: »

The floors in a few rooms have warped too due to being abandoned for a few years with no heat.

A leaky bendy lemon whose floors you'll have to replace, whose attic may be f**ked, whose entire infrastructure may cost many months and a small fortune to fix.

I'd really advise getting someone in to check it out.

DrPhilG

the_syco wrote: »

A leaky bendy lemon whose floors you'll have to replace, whose attic may be f**ked, whose entire infrastructure may cost many months and a small fortune to fix.

I'd really advise getting someone in to check it out.

The dip in the ceiling isn't very bad, but I'll be having a second viewing and getting it professionally checked out before I go anywhere. I had a look in the roofspace the other day but didn't have a light to properly investigate the attic over the leak.

I appreciate what you're saying, but I honestly don't think the damage is too major. Not that I'll be telling the agent that of course. Even if the leak is easily solved the bathroom ceiling will need replaced.

I will of course have it well checked out. Father in law is a plumber so I'll toss him into the roofspace for a while for starters.

DrPhilG

Submitted a low initial offer, and the EA has asked if that is my best and final offer!

What the hell do I do now? Only ever bought a house once before and never been asked this before.

bullpost

Tell him you'd need to know if it was successful before you could answer that.

OfflerCrocGod

DrPhilG wrote: »

Submitted a low initial offer, and the EA has asked if that is my best and final offer!

What the hell do I do now? Only ever bought a house once before and never been asked this before.

Say yes, if someone else beats you who cares? Don't jump at the first 'bargain' you find there will be plenty more coming along in the future in Ireland.

DrPhilG

OfflerCrocGod wrote: »

Say yes, if someone else beats you who cares? Don't jump at the first 'bargain' you find there will be plenty more coming along in the future in Ireland.

I know what you mean, and I'm sure there will be better houses that may come along. But it's all about location in this case, and in that respect I don't think this property can be beaten.

I replied that I could wiggle a bit but increasing my offer would leave me with no budget to renovate(this is true). I didn't actually submit a final offer, and I asked how many other bidders there are if any. Legally he has to divulge this information under freedom of information law doesn't he?

OfflerCrocGod

DrPhilG wrote: »

I know what you mean, and I'm sure there will be better houses that may come along. But it's all about location in this case, and in that respect I don't think this property can be beaten.

I replied that I could wiggle a bit but increasing my offer would leave me with no budget to renovate(this is true). I didn't actually submit a final offer, and I asked how many other bidders there are if any. Legally he has to divulge this information under freedom of information law doesn't he?

Location, price any criteria you want you will most likely get better in future as the property market moves downwards.

tsoparno

DrPhilG wrote: »

Submitted a low initial offer, and the EA has asked if that is my best and final offer!

What the hell do I do now? Only ever bought a house once before and never been asked this before.

tell him it is and that your not overly bothered bout it.tell him you've plenty others that you'd prefer but that your interested if they accept your offer.
you could always get someone else to ring EA to keep an eye on the price of it.he's trying to push you cause he's prob working on commision percentage's

ShadowHearth

Raskolnikov wrote: »

Feel free to lob an offer in if you're comfortable with it, just don't be surprised if it's rejected. A lot of the banks don't want to crystallise further property losses at this stage.

No point giving them offers. They don't give a **** m8. Been there, done that.

I am in the middle of buying repossessed property op. Trust me, it's wau more hassle then buying from individual.

It took 4 weeks for selling bank to get an Solisitor and send out basic letter of offer. Then when they send out basic do ima rations, they still did not send out the documentation on actuoll repossetion and court order etc. ( being safe there ).

You would think that it would be faster as there's feck all sales happening and we are paying full price, but nope.

It's more then a month and we are in dead still position, because the seller ( bank ) is just doing feck all.

DrPhilG

ShadowHearth wrote: »

It's more then a month and we are in dead still position, because the seller ( bank ) is just doing feck all.

Do you know which bank it is? Is there any way to find that out, other than asking the EA?

He has since answered me, saying that there are more viewings early next week and no decision will be made before then.

ShadowHearth

DrPhilG wrote: »

Do you know which bank it is? Is there any way to find that out, other than asking the EA?

He has since answered me, saying that there are more viewings early next week and no decision will be made before then.

He told me, but I can't remember. It was not ulster aib or bankof Ireland. Some weird name that I newer heard before.

When you facing bank, you face a faceless soulless machine. I know that last offer of 1k less then asking price was refused by bank ( not ours offer ). EA himself was shocked as he told me to offer 5k less then asking price for that house. He was 100% sure that we will get it.

Victor

You need to also have someone check out the electrics, to see if the wiring has been tampered with / removed.

You need to get a surveyor to check the place out and put together a budget for putting it back together.

dchitz

Have slot of experience in this, work in the industry, some banks are taking losses of up to 70% on theirproperties depending on location, time in repossession and property condition, most banks would hope to sell a repo in 6 to 9 months so if its been 2 yrs, I'd go quite low, have you checked valuations in the area at it's peaks and what similar props are selling for now

DrPhilG

dchitz wrote: »

Have slot of experience in this, work in the industry, some banks are taking losses of up to 70% on theirproperties depending on location, time in repossession and property condition, most banks would hope to sell a repo in 6 to 9 months so if its been 2 yrs, I'd go quite low, have you checked valuations in the area at it's peaks and what similar props are selling for now

It was originally on the market a few years ago, but was taken off as there was confusion over the property boundary. According to the EA, the boundary at the rear wasn't marked and they had to clarify where it was and erect a fence.

Not sure why this took so long to resolve and relist, but I've quizzed the EA and he assures me that there is no issue with any neighbours etc and there wasn't any dispute. I'm currently invesitgating this too btw, see if I can find out any other info.

It's only been 2 weeks since the house went back on the market so not that long really.

I'm getting back onto websites to look for alternatives, and weighing up the options for possibly building too. I've made the fatal mistake of getting my heart set on the place, so I have to start planning for what happens if I don't get it. That said, I know for a fact that there were at least 2 other viewings last week, and it seems that none of them have made an offer. Fingers crossed the viewings next week feel the same. There are a lot of things to put people off at first glance, plus the fact that it's a repo might make people uncomfortable. The weather forecast for next week is crap too, so hopefully they won't appreciate the view!

Going to sit tight til Thursday, see if he comes back to me.

Thanks for the advice everyone.

DrPhilG

Well now it's the dreaded wait to see what the EA comes back with and my mind moves to the inevitable (is it?) issue of phantom bids.

Is the situation still the same now that we're in a slump, i.e. no way to prove anything and no way of knowing if you're being taken for a ride?

Maybe the EA's initial question seeking my best price was an early way of finding out my limits, so that if no other bids come in he knows how high he can push me by himself if needed?

I'm still confused by the reason for that very early request for "best and final" offer. It seems that there were no other bids at that stage so why ask?

mari2222

It might be that the EA wants to convince the client that the EA has secured your "final" offer - otherwise there will be a client pushing the EA to get more.

Brando_ie

DrPhilG wrote: »

Well now it's the dreaded wait to see what the EA comes back with and my mind moves to the inevitable (is it?) issue of phantom bids.

Is the situation still the same now that we're in a slump, i.e. no way to prove anything and no way of knowing if you're being taken for a ride?

Maybe the EA's initial question seeking my best price was an early way of finding out my limits, so that if no other bids come in he knows how high he can push me by himself if needed?

I'm still confused by the reason for that very early request for "best and final" offer. It seems that there were no other bids at that stage so why ask?

Call their bluff on phantom bids!!.

It reminds me of negotiating with an estate agent about 7 or 8 years ago (when they were on the pigs back) for my mothers new place, between our first offer and the end there was apparently another 'extremely interested' party who pushed the purchase price to about 10 grand over asking and the estate agent would then only accept increases in multiples of 2k.

I finally got sick of it and refused to increase the offer to 12k over asking only to get a phone call a few days later indicating that the other party had pulled out and our offer (asking + 9.5k iirc) was now the preferred offer.

I on the spot decided to bluff him that we had moved on and would only be interested again if the house was available at asking only, sure enough the following day they rang and accepted the lower offer.

It left quite a bitter taste in my mouth I can tell you and will doubtless taint any dealing I have in the future regarding purchasing a house.

DrPhilG

Brando_ie wrote: »

Call their bluff on phantom bids!!.

Would love to, but the hateful thing would be if it backfires and there actually was another bidder.

It stinks that there is no accountability in the matter. Even ebay have methods in place to catch / deter fake bids, but when you're buying a house you're at the mercy of EA's honesty.

ShadowHearth

i dont know if OP still on this, but just an advice: Be very carefull with repossesed property.

Long story short: today i finded out, that the repossessed house we were after was not properly taken over. Soliciter explained us situation and its written DODGY all over it. basicly we just wasted 2 month. back to square one to look for our home.

DrPhilG

ShadowHearth wrote: »

i dont know if OP still on this, but just an advice: Be very carefull with repossesed property.

Long story short: today i finded out, that the repossessed house we were after was not properly taken over. Soliciter explained us situation and its written DODGY all over it. basicly we just wasted 2 month. back to square one to look for our home.

Sorry to hear it SH.

I'll certainly investigate it well, but I'd hope everything is final given that it's been 2 years since the property was vacated! My wife actually knows someone who knows the previous owners so she might be able to do some fishing about any hidden surprises.

Still no word from the EA. As far as I know our original offer (20% below asking) is still on the table. He never said it was rejected, just that he was holding off on a decision because there were more viewings due "early this week".

Tomorrow is Thursday and it will be a week since I last had any contact. So assuming that the people who viewed last week haven't made an offer, and none of the people this week have either (or he'd have come back to me to say I was outbid) then fingers crossed we may be the only party interested.

We do have some other places in the pipeline in case this one gets out of reach though.

djmcr

DrPhilG wrote: »

We do have some other places in the pipeline in case this one gets out of reach though.

Always have an alternative so that you don't get too emotionally attached to a property which could cloud your judgement. If possible have alternative with the same EA so you could play the sellers off of each other

ShadowHearth

DrPhilG wrote: »

Sorry to hear it SH.

I'll certainly investigate it well, but I'd hope everything is final given that it's been 2 years since the property was vacated! My wife actually knows someone who knows the previous owners so she might be able to do some fishing about any hidden surprises.

Still no word from the EA. As far as I know our original offer (20% below asking) is still on the table. He never said it was rejected, just that he was holding off on a decision because there were more viewings due "early this week".

Tomorrow is Thursday and it will be a week since I last had any contact. So assuming that the people who viewed last week haven't made an offer, and none of the people this week have either (or he'd have come back to me to say I was outbid) then fingers crossed we may be the only party interested.

We do have some other places in the pipeline in case this one gets out of reach though.

thanks m8, i really wish best of luck in your War.

As for my war, i am in bits after today. A phone call from solicitor, then talking to EA, then meeting solicitor and having a good chat. when 2 separate solicitors tell you its not recomended, you better listen, becouse after there will be only one person to blame.

Misses quite "upset" too. :rolleyes:

DrPhilG

Finally got a reply. EA says that he will be updating the vendor in a few days and will inform them of my offer.

He says that the offer is well below what he feels the bank will accept and he expects it to be refused.

2 things...
1 - Is he not obliged to bring my offer to the bank/vendor's attention when it is made? It's been over a week.

2 - This pretty much confirms to me that there is no higher offer. If so, he'd have told me mine was no good.

DrPhilG

Shadowhearth, if you don't mind me asking, how far from asking price did you buy for before it all went under?

My offer was about 20% below asking.

ShadowHearth

DrPhilG wrote: »

Shadowhearth, if you don't mind me asking, how far from asking price did you buy for before it all went under?

My offer was about 20% below asking.

It was 80k, we tried 75k and they refused, then we finder out that bank had already refused 79k offer before. So we just accepted to give full asking price as property was a great bank for your money even at full asking price.

I wouldn't be surprised if they will refuse your offer m8. Thought I domt know what sort of money you buying it for.

Just before you really go for it, make sure there was a proper repossetion procces, as you will get in limbo state as me and will waste time and money.

DrPhilG

I pushed the EA on what the bank would consider, and he came back to me saying that another bid has come in €15k higher than mine...

Smells like BS, but might not be.

ShadowHearth

DrPhilG wrote: »

I pushed the EA on what the bank would consider, and he came back to me saying that another bid has come in €15k higher than mine...

Smells like BS, but might not be.

no one bids by 15k lol. real bids go by 1-2k maybe 5, but not 15k lol. i smell bull**** m8.

if not secret how much is asking price? you can pm me if you want. i really dont think 2 of us in competition as its not same region or price range?

Damie

DrPhilG wrote: »

I pushed the EA on what the bank would consider, and he came back to me saying that another bid has come in €15k higher than mine...

Smells like BS, but might not be.

Take 1k off your original offer and give it to the EA, tell him your offer will be -1k every week until you withdraw altogether, do not get emotional about this house, the EA is trying to squeeze you, why not squeeze back.

DrPhilG

Damie wrote: »

Take 1k off your original offer and give it to the EA, tell him your offer will be -1k every week until you withdraw altogether, do not get emotional about this house, the EA is trying to squeeze you, why not squeeze back.

Agree it's a squeeze but I think I'll just leave my initial offer.

I'm feeling about 60/40 confident that the other offer is BS for 3 reasons;

1. If the other bidder knew what my offer was, why bump it by so much? Even if they were making an agressive move to try and scare away other bidders, €15k is extreme, especialy in a slumped market!
2. If they didn't know about my bid (why not) then who in today's market goes in only €10k under asking?
3. It's too coincidental that a few hours after I try to squeeze the agent for info on the lowest the bank will accept, suddenly an offer comes in at around the value I expected the answer to be.

I'm looking for alternatives, including maybe building from scratch. I had fallen for the house, but the next best thing is to take the elements of the layout etc that I liked and build from that!

Victor

DrPhilG wrote: »

2 things...
1 - Is he not obliged to bring my offer to the bank/vendor's attention when it is made? It's been over a week.

Its quite possible that he told them immediately but the bank's disposals committee hasn't met yet.

DrPhilG

Victor wrote: »

Its quite possible that he told them immediately but the bank's disposals committee hasn't met yet.

Maybe, but I asked if the bank had responded and his words were "I'll be updating them within a few days including details of your offer". I got the impression that he hadn't told them anything yet.

Angryvermin

DrPhilG wrote: »

Agree it's a squeeze but I think I'll just leave my initial offer.



I'm feeling about 60/40 confident that the other offer is BS for 3 reasons;

1. If the other bidder knew what my offer was, why bump it by so much? Even if they were making an agressive move to try and scare away other bidders, €15k is extreme, especialy in a slumped market!
2. If they didn't know about my bid (why not) then who in today's market goes in only €10k under asking?
3. It's too coincidental that a few hours after I try to squeeze the agent for info on the lowest the bank will accept, suddenly an offer comes in at around the value I expected the answer to be.

I'm looking for alternatives, including maybe building from scratch. I had fallen for the house, but the next best thing is to take the elements of the layout etc that I liked and build from that!

There really should be some independant arbitrator, ombudsman who can verify the offers that an EA has recieved.... only the crooked EA's should have any ssue with this.

I'm in the process of buying myself at present, and have found the EA simply horrible to deal with, rude and pushy at every opportunity.. I really hate giving them my business, but the house was 40k less than any other similar in the estate in last 6 months (aparently these guys were in a rush to sell) I managed to get another 30k off that after some severe pressure from EA, basically telling me the offer was rejected... then 2 weeks later, the phone rings :cool:

Now I'm only wondering how much more I could have gotten off the price though:rolleyes:

I was given every line in the book, personal favourite was 'the bank wont let them sell for anything less than 10k below current asking price', also had an absolutely packed viewing on the first occassion, which I would bet my left one were all/mostly shills.
Same EA has had another house up as 'for sale' for the last 3 months, but every time I asked, they said it was really sale agreed, but they just weren't ready to change the signs yet and keeping names of interested partys in case anything changed...? Odd to say the least.
They tried pulling similar cr*p with me then after I put my deposit down... I called them 3 times, then eventually showed up at their office in person before they changed it to sale agreed.

/rant

(There are some nice EAs out there too that I've dealt with )

Anyway OP, the point of my meanandering prelude is, don't trust them... In this market, there is usually only one real buyer in contention, if any at all!
If someone really has bid 15k more than you, then its probably them.
You'd realistically need to be prepared to out bid them by another 10k to have a fair shot... everyone leaves about that much wiggle room above their offers if they are serious, and the EA's are well aware of that, and the good ones can smell the 'want' off you, and bleed every drop... really interesting psychology behind bidding wars - but there is no need for any of that in this market - there will be another house!
I let many the one's go by me... hard as it is when your heart is set.

Say you've had an offer accepted on another property at the same price, and that the other EA is waiting on you to get back to them to confirm - but that you'd REALLY prefer this house, but will go have to go with the other one now...
That other offer could disappear miraculously quickly!!

If not, you just gotta accept it wasnt for you

shawnee

Is there any way of finding out what bank owns a property ??

cyrusdvirus

shawnee wrote: »

Is there any way of finding out what bank owns a property ??

or finding out what bank owns WHAT properties??

shawnee

I am writing about a particular property and I have been informed that it is owned by a bank. I am just wondering , how do I find out which bank ??