Horse and trap on roads legality

Mr_Hat

There is a guy, going around the reads near my house in a horse and trap. Last night there were two of them and I got stuck behind them on some winding roads for 15 minutes. What is the legality of the Horses and Traps on the road. I'm not so much bothered about being stuck behind them. But the horses would suddenly stop. The trap also had no lights, or reflective strip. Not only that but when the two riders decide to exit on to another road. They made no attempt at any type of hand signal indicating it. Are they allowed on roads, and if so is are they required to signal and have strips, lights etc on the trap?

mb1725

Horses were on the roads before cars!! Drivers are supposed to watch out for and take care around horses.

Tefral

Under the road traffic act 1961 they are subject to the same drink and drug driving laws as we are in cars.

with regards to lighting: the road traffic lighting of vehicles act 1963 states

Animal-drawn vehicles.
30. (1) Every animal-drawn vehicle (or vehicle constructed or adapted for use as an animal-drawn vehicle) shall, while used in a public place during lighting-up hours, be equipped with and show duly lit—

(a) (i) one lamp, as near as possible to the right side of the vehicle, showing to the front a white or yellow light visible for a reasonable distance,

(ii) one lamp, to the right of the centre line of the vehicle and as near as possible to the side, showing a red light to the rear visible for a reasonable distance, and

(b) while carrying a load (other than loose agricultura1 produce not baled or crated) projecting more than 3 feet and 6 inches to the rear of the vehicle, one lamp, showing a red light to the rear visible for a reason able distance, and so fitted that no part of the load projects more than 3 feet and 6 inches to the rear of that lamp.

(2) Where an animal-drawn vehicle with another vehicle attached (hereinafter in this sub-article referred to as the second vehicle) is used in a public place during lighting-up hours, the provisions of sub-article (1) of this article shall apply severally to the vehicle and the second vehicle subject, in a case where the distance between the vehicles is less than 5 feet, to the following modifications:

(a) the requirement as to showing a white or yellow light to the front shall not apply to the second vehicle;

(b) the requirement as to showing a red light to the rear shall not apply to the vehicle drawing the second vehicle.

trad

And they can sh1t on the road

Berty

trad wrote: »

And they can sh1t on the road

Not in Killarney. They have nappies.

bonzos

Its legal in Sligo...the garda's found nothing illegal in this youtube clip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qaiIxo3qf8

Mr.Crinklewood

Should really be paying road tax then.

Idleater

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

Should really be paying road tax then.

O_o
can open worms crawling everywhere

Slushfund

Extracts From the rules of the Road

Animal traffic
Always slow down and be prepared to stop when approaching or overtaking animals. If a person in charge of animals gives a signal to slow down or stop, you must obey it. Avoid using your horn if animals are in front of you, as it might frighten them.

Horse-drawn vehicles
A horse-drawn vehicle must be equipped with two red rear reflectors and at night must also carry on the right-hand side of the vehicle a lamp showing a white light to the front and a red light to the back.

Drivers should take special care when:
-approaching riding schools or places where horses are likely to appear, and
-overtaking horses, especially loose horses or horse-drawn vehicles.
-approaching a horse and rider, and if appropriate a driver must stop a vehicle and allow them to pass.

Magic Beans

The elite traffic squad will catch them...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41gSgjj66Ss

Slushfund

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

Should really be paying road tax then.

It's motor tax. No motor, no tax.

Twin-go

Motor Tax.............

Can the horse be considered a motor? :rolleyes:
I've been stuck behind a Horse and Trap race on a single carrage-way. The road was blocked by about 6 or 7 hi-ace's and the horses raced in-front of them.

This can't be legal can it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qaiIxo3qf8

Mr.Crinklewood

Apologies, thought it was road tax.

corktina

might not be legal, but can you enforce any laws that may apply?
Flogging a dead horse with thsi thread methinks.

bladespin

What's the story with them and insurance, do they have to be insured to be using the public road? Just wondering

kippy

bladespin wrote: »

What's the story with them and insurance, do they have to be insured to be using the public road? Just wondering

Insurance??? You're having a laugh.

Mr_Hat

mb1725 wrote: »

Horses were on the roads before cars!! Drivers are supposed to watch out for and take care around horses.

Yes I realise that. Did you just read the thread title and not my post. The horse and trap were going around at night. WITH NO LIGHTS OR REFLECTIVE STIPS. I was watching out and being careful around the horses. My query was on the legality of this. Cyclists and walkers are are sure to be seen. Hpw can some idoit take a horse and trap out in THE DARK, and get away with it. I was question the legality because he is a danger to other road users and plan on reporting him if I see it done again.

kippy

Mr_Hat wrote: »

Yes I realise that. Did you just read the thread title and not my post. The horse and trap were going around at night. WITH NO LIGHTS OR REFLECTIVE STIPS. I was watching out and being careful around the horses. My query was on the legality of this. Cyclists and walkers are are sure to be seen. Hpw can some idoit take a horse and trap out in THE DARK, and get away with it. I was question the legality because he is a danger to other road users and plan on reporting him if I see it done again.

Living in the Galway area and we see a lot of the horse and traps around the place.
There's never lights of any description on them, nor would I expect there to be.
It's not P.C to say this but sadly it's the truth.
Different laws and obligations apply to these people and the Gardai are very slow to prosecute them for blatant abuse of the law.
I cant see how any insurance company would actually cover this type of behavior and this type of person probably disregards the law in many cases so I doubt insurance would be one of their concerns.

I don't really have a problem with the horse and trap in an individual basis, they aren't too common and you just drive with care and hope nothing happens. However what has been posted in the video is a different thing altogether. It's dangerous, frustrating in an no doubt breaks some rules of the road in some way - will anything be done - not a notion.
I kind of feel sorry for the lawmakers/enforcers as any action against this type of thing will be straight away called as an effort to end the traditions of the travelling people in certain parts of the media.

Stinicker

Beer Baron wrote: »

Not in Killarney. They have nappies.

Which the scummy individuals who ply that trade there refuse to use, the whole thing should be banned and shut down until they agree to fit the nappies to the horses.

dr.fuzzenstein

bonzos wrote: »

Its legal in Sligo...the garda's found nothing illegal in this youtube clip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qaiIxo3qf8

Sweet Jebus!
Found nothing wrong?
Driving three abreast, driving on the hard shoulder, driving on the hard shoulder THE WRONG DIRECTION, blocking traffic, passenger and driver hanging out the window, possible cruelty to horses (i.e. running a horse that hard on frigging asphalt!), at some stage there where three vehicles abreast, another driving the wrong way, with oncoming traffic, these are only the things we can see, apart from how much tax, insurance and alcohol there was involved in this.
Of course the Gardai are much better at enforcing the law when it comes to law-abiding citizens, rather than confronting a bunch of hardened scumbags who don't mind adding assault to their lengthy rap sheet.
Sorry to say, but only in Ireland...

Solnskaya

I have some friends who keep horses and traps. One fine day, and I'm gonna couch this in fairly vague terms because a fair few people know about this incident and I value my ability to walk and stuff, they had a trotter hitched to a "trap", and the horse bolted, sans person onboard and flew off down the lane they were on, out across a main road, where a car was passing. The trap hit the car(horse and driver were fine), but the car was shagged altogether. The lads apologised, and two days later bought your man an identical car. Everyone was happy, but it just shows that somtimes people you expect to just deny all can surprise you. I doubt if this experience is universal, but it does happen.

savagecabbages

Probably the same crowd here, gets REALLY crazy/dangerous around the 3:30 mark. Amazes me how different groups of people can live in the same country and have such contrasting attitudes to its laws...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3wt3YKnGI0

dr.fuzzenstein

savagecabbages wrote: »

Probably the same crowd here, gets REALLY crazy/dangerous around the 3:30 mark. Amazes me how different groups of people can live in the same country and have such contrasting attitudes to its laws...

I am just dumbfounded.
But when you see other "sports" such as hare coursing and dogfighting, all I can say is that this sickens me to my stomach.
I won't call these gentlemen animals, as it would be insulting to animals.
Missing links more like it. Behaviour more suited to several hundred thousand years ago, maybe some dormant cavemen genes.
I cannot find another explanation, it is said that we all carry good and evil, enlightened and caveman around in us, but no matter how deep within myself I look, I cannot find any desire to engage in any of these activities.
Don't mind bare knuckle fighting, still Neanderthal, but at least only the right people get hurt.
And before anyone jumps on me, I do not restrict my remarks to the travelling community. Plenty of settled scumbags equally forgotten by evolution.
There does seem to be a subset of the human species that is simply hasn't quite arrived in the same millennium as others.
We are not all equal and if we are, sorry, not me, if this is the human race, I want out.

corktina

Solnskaya wrote: »

I have some friends who keep horses and traps. One fine day, and I'm gonna couch this in fairly vague terms because a fair few people know about this incident and I value my ability to walk and stuff, they had a trotter hitched to a "trap", and the horse bolted, sans person onboard and flew off down the lane they were on, out across a main road, where a car was passing. The trap hit the car(horse and driver were fine), but the car was shagged altogether. The lads apologised, and two days later bought your man an identical car. Everyone was happy, but it just shows that somtimes people you expect to just deny all can surprise you. I doubt if this experience is universal, but it does happen.

for balance then, in The Uk about a fortnight ago a crowd of "persons" drove a sulky and pony into a lake and held the pony down until it drowned...they also tried to drown a second pony which evaded them.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3686926/Pony-drowned-in-lake-by-yobs.html

Run_to_da_hills

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

Should really be paying road tax then.

Dirt tax for crapping on the ground.

bonzos

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Sweet Jebus!
Found nothing wrong?
Driving three abreast, driving on the hard shoulder, driving on the hard shoulder THE WRONG DIRECTION, blocking traffic, passenger and driver hanging out the window, possible cruelty to horses (i.e. running a horse that hard on frigging asphalt!), at some stage there where three vehicles abreast, another driving the wrong way, with oncoming traffic, these are only the things we can see, apart from how much tax, insurance and alcohol there was involved in this.
Of course the Gardai are much better at enforcing the law when it comes to law-abiding citizens, rather than confronting a bunch of hardened scumbags who don't mind adding assault to their lengthy rap sheet.
Sorry to say, but only in Ireland...

There are more interested in handy fines catching people doing 65kph in a 50kph zone......

-Chris-

Thread closed. There's little legality (signage, lighting etc) being discussed, and only a matter of time before we start getting some unacceptable anti-traveller remarks.