Family life, rural and urban, is there a difference?

mikemac

Paddy O'Gorman, roving reporter for Pat Kenny show was interviewing people in Dublin applying for council houses.

And a lot of the applicants would refuse their allocation as it was too far away.
For example a young single parent would not go to Finglas as she was from Ballyfermot and all their family was there and it was all she knew.

Paddy then made a point about rural and urban families.

Outside the cities young people never expected to spend their entire lives in the same area. Go to college or go working where the work is, usually one of the cities. If you are from rural Clare for example once you finish your junior or leaving cert, unless you're a farmer you are not going to spend all your life there. Before you hit 20 you are moved away

But in Dublin for example Paddy made the point this is very common. For example this girl in Ballyfermot, people tend to have families younger and the support system of grandparents and community was hugely important to them. There are often grandmothers who become the focal point of young families and hold them together.

People being interviewed in council offices made a trip from their childhood area in Dublin 8 to a new home in Dublin 24 sound like it's 200km away. Realy it's not far at all but it's seems like the end of the world

Is my post full of generalizations? I'm not here welfare bashing but it's a debate and it's not even about council houses but maybe inertia.

Or is there something that people outside cities travel and move to where work is.

But in the cities, people realy want to stay in their own area and struggle sometimes moving away from their families, even it's just 10 or 15 kilometers?

Edit, I can't give a direct link to Pat Kenny Podcast but it's there on July 5th, just search for Paddy
www.rte.ie/radio1/podcast/podcast_patkenny.xml

irishh_bob

young people in ireland often end up building a house close to where thier parents live

I grew up on a small farm which was on the edge of a large urban area so although it was a rural it wasn't your typical rural area for example It was less that an hour from the centre of Dublin.

My sister married someone from a small village in rural Ireland where they now live and she wouldn't swap it for the anything she thinks its much better upbringing for children, more safe more secure, more family and community orientated, your a bit feked if you are not in to the GAA or the pub but in her opinion the positives outweigh the negatives by a million to one.

prinz

mikemac wrote: »

Is my post full of generalizations? I'm not here welfare bashing but it's a debate and it's not even about council houses but maybe inertia.

It's not about council houses, that's just one example, but it definitely is more prevalent with Dubs in my opinion. I know one girl from north Dublin who loved to complain that she had to get two whole buses to college in DCU. She lived at home with the parents, everything paid for, dinner on the table when she got back etc. It was hilarious. Anything outside Dublin was where culchies lived/the bog. There was nothing to be gained from leaving Dublin.

I think in more rural areas you grow up in the knowledge that for work, education, even to meet new people you will have to move. I also think it's a good thing that most people do move. Going back to the OP I think anyone refusing a house on the basis that it's too far away from x area or whatever should be kicked from the housing list unless it's a for a damn good reason (if they are a primary carer for a parent etc).

That said I was looking up some lads I went to school with (in a small more rural town - which it isn't anymore) recently on FB and some of them were sitting at the same bar counter they were sitting at when they were 18 never having left. The same social circle and the same routine. Hell.

Sleepy

If my taxes are paying for someone's accommodation they should live wherever it's cheapest for the government to house them imho. Refusing free accommodation should result in the withdrawal of your entitlement to it.

slowburner

Sleepy wrote: »

If my taxes are paying for someone's accommodation they should live wherever it's cheapest for the government to house them imho. Refusing free accommodation should result in the withdrawal of your entitlement to it.

The social ramifications of such thinking = :eek:

Doctor DooM

mikemac wrote: »

P
Is my post full of generalizations?

Basically? Yes.

I am from Dublin. I now live in Kildare. I moved there for work.

I have friends from Dublin who are all over the world, some by choice, some because they had to.

I still refer to where I currently live as bogland and refuse to learn geography as it winds up my housemates.

drunkmonkey

I heard that story on the radio, I was dumbfounded she could refuse propertys in Dublin as they were too far away from relatives. They girl wasn't working and had a few kids by different guys. This house was being provided by the state.
She should have been shipped off to another country and not give a choice of house. It's bad for gene pool to have people like her breeding constantly in the same area. Inbreeding is a problem that needs to be addressed and giving families free houses in the same areas for generations isn't helping. After she refused the second house she should have been left to her own devices and not offered another house, her and her family are nothing but a drain on society and contribute nothing, she so needs to be ripped outside her comfort zone. It might be too late for her but at least it gives her kids a sporting chance at a better life.
As for the guys at the rural pub bar, the thing op is missing is that they probably travelled around the world to get there while the dubliner got scared passing Naas and wouldn't go any further.

John_Rambo

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I heard that story on the radio, I was dumbfounded she could refuse propertys in Dublin as they were too far away from relatives. They girl wasn't working and had a few kids by different guys. This house was being provided by the state.
She should have been shipped off to another country and not give a choice of house. It's bad for gene pool to have people like her breeding constantly in the same area. Inbreeding is a problem that needs to be addressed and giving families free houses in the same areas for generations isn't helping. After she refused the second house she should have been left to her own devices and not offered another house, her and her family are nothing but a drain on society and contribute nothing, she so needs to be ripped outside her comfort zone. It might be too late for her but at least it gives her kids a sporting chance at a better life.
As for the guys at the rural pub bar, the thing op is missing is that they probably travelled around the world to get there while the dubliner got scared passing Naas and wouldn't go any further.

I think part of the whole rural/urban divide is displayed here by drunkmonkeys ignorance. He seems to genuinely that all Dubliners never travel, live in social housing, are inbred, are drains on society and don't ever leave Dublin.

This sort of pub education about the your own country and the world is worrying. The fact of the matter is that the majority of Dubliners save up and rent or buy their own houses, the don't get to build on their parents land, we travel the country more than our rural counterparts. We live in tight nit communities and we keep an eye out for each other. (something that is too often in the past in certain rural areas).

Like any part of the country, you are going to get leechers. That's a fact. however, simple economics prove that Dublin has less of these in comparison to the bread makers, the proof is that more tax money comes from Dublin than any other part of the country.

Making assumptions like all rural people are grant grabbing, cute hoer, tax cheating, bog trotters that will commit suicide at the drop of a hat if things don't go their way is exactly the trap that Drunk Monkey is falling in to.

Unfortunately it's down to ignorance and a lack of knowledge about his own country and it's displayed a lot on boards.ie, I don't know if the celtic tiger stopped people traveling in Ireland that is the cause of this lack of own country knowledge, whatever the reason, its a shame.

Sleepy

slowburner wrote: »

The social ramifications of such thinking = :eek:

Are the social ramifications any worse than those we can expect if we bankrupt the state while trying to bribe our underclass into not being criminals by throwing money at them/indulging the whims of those that have never contributed to the country?

slowburner

Sleepy wrote: »

Are the social ramifications any worse than those we can expect if we bankrupt the state...

An effort to keep people close to their community is not going to bankrupt the state.

...while trying to bribe our underclass into not being criminals by throwing money at them/indulging the whims of those that have never contributed to the country?

With all due respect, I am afraid I do not understand the second part of your post.

Sleepy

The sort of person who wouldn't be too embarrassed to refuse free accommodation based on it being too far away from their mammy / sister / cousins is the same type of person who's never worked a day in their lives and feels entitled to live off of those of us who are prepared to work for a living.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

John_Rambo wrote: »

I think part of the whole rural/urban divide is displayed here by drunkmonkeys ignorance. He seems to genuinely that all Dubliners never travel, live in social housing, are inbred, are drains on society and don't ever leave Dublin.

He never said anything of the sort.

John_Rambo

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

He never said anything of the sort.

He did.

Here's the inbreeding part.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Inbreeding is a problem that needs to be addressed

Here's the drain on society part

drunkmonkey wrote: »

her and her family are nothing but a drain on society

Here's the Dubliners don't travel part.

drunkmonkey wrote: »

dubliner got scared passing Naas and wouldn't go any further.

Cheers, !

Emme

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Basically? Yes.

I am from Dublin. I now live in Kildare. I moved there for work.

I have friends from Dublin who are all over the world, some by choice, some because they had to.

I still refer to where I currently live as bogland and refuse to learn geography as it winds up my housemates.

For your attitude I hope your housemates get you drunk some night and lock you outside the house wrapped in nothing but a Kildare flag!

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

John_Rambo wrote: »

He did.

Here's the inbreeding part.


Here's the drain on society part


Here's the Dubliners don't travel part.


Cheers, !

Sorry I misread things and thought you were referring to the OP.

slowburner

mikemac wrote: »

Paddy O'Gorman, roving reporter for Pat Kenny show was interviewing people in Dublin applying for council houses.

And a lot of the applicants would refuse their allocation as it was too far away.
For example a young single parent would not go to Finglas as she was from Ballyfermot and all their family was there and it was all she knew.

Paddy then made a point about rural and urban families.

Outside the cities young people never expected to spend their entire lives in the same area. Go to college or go working where the work is, usually one of the cities. If you are from rural Clare for example once you finish your junior or leaving cert, unless you're a farmer you are not going to spend all your life there. Before you hit 20 you are moved away

But in Dublin for example Paddy made the point this is very common. For example this girl in Ballyfermot, people tend to have families younger and the support system of grandparents and community was hugely important to them. There are often grandmothers who become the focal point of young families and hold them together.

People being interviewed in council offices made a trip from their childhood area in Dublin 8 to a new home in Dublin 24 sound like it's 200km away. Realy it's not far at all but it's seems like the end of the world

Is my post full of generalizations? I'm not here welfare bashing but it's a debate and it's not even about council houses but maybe inertia.

Or is there something that people outside cities travel and move to where work is.

But in the cities, people realy want to stay in their own area and struggle sometimes moving away from their families, even it's just 10 or 15 kilometers?

Edit, I can't give a direct link to Pat Kenny Podcast but it's there on July 5th, just search for Paddy
www.rte.ie/radio1/podcast/podcast_patkenny.xml

Going back to the OP. I don't think these are sweeping generalisations, they are perfectly reasonable observations.
Mobility is a key difference between urban and rural life. It is a simple matter of fact that it is easier to travel ten miles in the country than it is in the city. The former journey could take only ten minutes, the latter could take hours on a wet Monday. So the person who perceived Dublin 24 as 200km away might be perfectly correct. It could easily be that far away time wise. It is not as if she could drop the babby into the granny for ten minutes if she was in D24 and the granny was in D8.
So in all fairness, to move someone from their extended family roots in D8 (and all the support that entails) to D24, is no different to moving someone from Leitrim to Waterford.
And then you have to consider the social consequences of breaking up such support systems. Take as an example a young couple with a child, one of whom is working for the minimum wage. They have free childcare of the best kind, with a relation. Now take that family and rehouse it where there is no access to the support system they grew up with. Pretty soon the breadwinner is going to find that he or she is going to have to find childcare and that costs money. And then they will do the sums and realise that they would be better off not working.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out which would cost the state most in the long run.