Cost of Playing a Song

SlanGoFoil2011

Does anyone know,

How much a radio station needs to pay the artist (IRMA) to play their song on the radio.

Do they need to plan out all songs in advance to work out costs.

Do different artists music cost different prices.

Is the cost the reasons why we need to listen to the like of Baz and Lucy instead of music.

bastados

IF its a U2 song the money goes straight to a Dutch bank.

SlanGoFoil2011

a tough question it seems

maudgonner

I'm not sure that it would be the same for all radio stations - a national broadcaster would probably pay a higher rate than a regional/local/community station.

This site may help: http://www.imro.ie

I'm don't know whether different artists cost more or less. It may be different for radio stations, but afaik tv stations negotiate a flat fee at the start of the year that covers licensing for all of the music that features in their shows. They submit logs for each programme of what tracks were used, and how much of them was used (30 secs etc), and those logs are presumably used to divvy up the fee that they pay among the artists & labels.

SlanGoFoil2011

any radio presenters use this board

Liam Byrne

SlanGoFoil2011 wrote: »

any radio presenters use this board

What makes you think radio presenters would know ? It's the accountants within radio stations that would know stuff like this, not the presenters.

mike65

The cost is is clearly far too much judging by the amount of chit-chat BS that's used to avoid playing music.

lifted from the web http://www.sentricmusic.com/faqs.aspx

Based on your average 3m30s song:
BBC Radio 1 - up to £65.
BBC 6 Music - up to £11.70.
BBC 1Xtra - up to £9.80.
BBC Regional Stations - up to £4.60.
BBC Asian Network - up to £13.

Obviously one would have to scale back for the Irish market, euroise, add vat and sundry rip-offs.

SlanGoFoil2011

lets say we scale back to €7 per song.

Still couldnt justify the amount of rubbish chit chat and fools reading newspaper articles that goes on on irish radio.

I can understand Johnathon Ross not playing music, he is talented and they pay alot for his services so he is not allowed to just play muisic.

But nobody listening to irish radio actually likes the pressenters so why do they not allow them to play more music

or maybe people do like the presenters??????????????????????????

wnolan1992

SlanGoFoil2011 wrote: »

lets say we scale back to €7 per song.

Still couldnt justify the amount of rubbish chit chat and fools reading newspaper articles that goes on on irish radio.

I can understand Johnathon Ross not playing music, he is talented and they pay alot for his services so he is not allowed to just play muisic.

But nobody listening to irish radio actually likes the pressenters so why do they not allow them to play more music

or maybe people do like the presenters??????????????????????????

Obviously people do like the presenters, how many people call into Joe Duffy everyday? And Newstalk rarely plays music apart for Tom Dunne and Sile Seoige.
What stations are you listening to if you think all the DJ's are terrible? And why keep listening? Ray Foley, KC, Ray D'Arcy, Tom Dunne, Sean Moncrieffe, Lunchtime on Newstalk, there're plenty of good people if you look.


OP asked whether they plan out songs in advance.
I highly doubt it, considering the number of shows that take requests, and Ray Foley plays the most random music at times. And he once showed that the playlists are dynamic, as he was watching on his screen what KC was putting in his playlist 2mins before airtime, and was reading it out on air so KC started changing it.

Wow though, £65 to have a song played on BBCR1?? That's insane. I'd love to see the breakdown of where that money goes.....

SlanGoFoil2011

is £65 alot.

Your song is being played to millions of people, doesnt seem like alot.

The station get 4 minutes of full produced programming.

Hopw much does Johnathon Ross get for 4 minutes,

wnolan1992

mmmmm..... i suppose....now that i do some maths:

Avg Songs Per hour - 8
Cost Per Hour - 8 X 65 = £520
Subtract the hundreds they get for each ad during (for arguments sake) 4 ad breaks per hour, i suppose it's not that much after.

Infoanon

Depends on the type of station eg a temp licence pays a flat fee approx €750, while a commercial operator pays a fee AND a % of revenue.

Internet stations pay .0001 per song per listener which is approx € 2,500 per listener per year.

Its a very expensive business ! there has been mention of investigations into certain practises but to date (like everything else in Ireland !) nothing has happened

Liam Byrne

wnolan1992 wrote: »

mmmmm..... i suppose....now that i do some maths:

Avg Songs Per hour - 8
Cost Per Hour - 8 X 65 = £520
Subtract the hundreds they get for each ad during (for arguments sake) 4 ad breaks per hour, i suppose it's not that much after.

I don't know where to start with that.....unless you're talking nationals then the rates for individual ads can be tiny, and there isn't a single reference within that as to any of the many, many costs involved (building leasing, equipment, electricity, BCI licencing, payment to RTENL for transmission, etc)

Not to mention whatever wages are involved in the above, given the sales and production teams' involvement as well as whoever's on-air.

Average songs per hour should be about 12, btw.

wnolan1992

Liam Byrne wrote: »

I don't know where to start with that.....unless you're talking nationals then the rates for individual ads can be tiny, and there isn't a single reference within that as to any of the many, many costs involved (building leasing, equipment, electricity, BCI licencing, payment to RTENL for transmission, etc)

Not to mention whatever wages are involved in the above, given the sales and production teams' involvement as well as whoever's on-air.

Average songs per hour should be about 12, btw.

Yeah, I know they were stripped back maths and there're loads of other costs.

And I don't think you're right about an average of 12.... Spin play 10 an hour, 2FM play 10+ an hour, Today FM, depending on the DJ play 7-8+ per hour...but that's just from listening, I've never counted.

But I digress.

I think the moral of this thread is, running a radio station? EXPENSIVE!

The Muppet

wnolan1992 wrote: »

mmmmm..... i suppose....now that i do some maths:

Avg Songs Per hour - 8
Cost Per Hour - 8 X 65 = £520
Subtract the hundreds they get for each ad during (for arguments sake) 4 ad breaks per hour, i suppose it's not that much after.

You'll have to keep an eye on your music to speech ratio with your eight songs per hour. Thats approx 32 minutes music and another 12 for ads which leaves you with 16 minutes speech will leave you in trouble for yapping too much plus you'll have no listeners.

_feedback_

Quite an interesting question this. Anyone know who to go to for the definitive answer?

wnolan1992

The Muppet wrote: »

You'll have to keep an eye on your music to speech ratio with your eight songs per hour. Thats approx 32 minutes music and another 12 for ads which leaves you with 16 minutes speech will leave you in trouble for yapping too much plus you'll have no listeners.

You're forgetting the few minutes of news per hour + jingles. But I see where you're coming from. It's just I listen to TodayFM and that's a talk heavy station really during the day.

The Muppet

wnolan1992 wrote: »

You're forgetting the few minutes of news per hour + jingles. But I see where you're coming from. It's just I listen to TodayFM and that's a talk heavy station really during the day.

News and jingles are counted as speech by the powers that be.

BrianD

Most stations are on 100% reporting so they report all music played including that in ad spots. Some smaller stations are exempt from this as there's a lot of admin work involved.

If the station has a computerised play out system (as most do), they just press a button to run the report. If the station or programme doesn't use a play out system then you manually record the tracks on paper and add it into the report.

Reports go to IMRO who have a predefined formula of dividing up the money to their members.

As I recall, most stations pay based on a percentage of revenue. This percentage is derived from the amount of "needle time" during certain hours of the day.

IMRO used to have some sample airplay rates on their web site but don't seem to any more.

Some useful info here.