Fiscal Responsibility: American Dream or Myth?

Black Swan

Was the Clinton Administration the only one that was fiscally responsible since 1970; i.e., revenues exceeded outlays?

Further, does it appear that the Reagan Administration was the 2nd worst in being fiscally irresponsible, only surpassed by the current Obama Administration?

With the exception of Clinton, generally speaking, for both the Republican and Democrat Administrations, it appears that fiscal responsibility has been more of a myth than a reality.

Presidential Administrations
37 1969-1974 Richard Nixon
38 1974-1977 Gerald Ford
39 1977-1981 Jimmy Carter
40 1981-1989 Ronald Reagan
41 1989-1993 George Bush
42 1993-2001 Bill Clinton
43 2001-2009 George W. Bush
44 2009- Barack Obama

Congressional Budget Office Chart

Amerika

Something else I find interesting about that graph... is that other than the early 70‘s, the closest zone of somewhat fiscal responsibility (with a big hicup in 2003 possibly due to the start of the Iraq war) seems to be between 1995 and 2006. Ironically that is also the only time in that whole graph that republicans held a slight majority in the House of Representatives, where I believe spending decisions are determined.

Black Swan

Amerika wrote: »

Ironically that is also the only time in that whole graph that republicans held a slight majority in the House of Representatives, where I believe spending decisions are determined.

This last underlined statement is incorrect per the specific procedures laid out in the Congressional Budget Act of 1974.

The federal budget process goes through three major steps:

1. The President's Budget Request
2. The Congressional Budget Resolution **
3. Enforcing the Terms of the Budget Resolution

**Step 2 is the Congressional Budget Resolution, that includes both houses of Congress, not just the House of Representatives:

After receiving the President's budget request, Congress generally holds hearings to question Administration officials about their requests and then develops its own budget resolution. This work is done by the House and Senate Budget Committees, whose primary function is to draft and enforce the budget resolution. Once the committees are done, their budget resolutions go to the House and Senate floors, where they can be amended (by a majority vote). A House-Senate conference then resolves any differences, and a conference report is passed by both houses.

Source: http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=155

Amerika

Yes the President "proposes" a budget, which initiates the process, but legislation concerning fiscal matters, such as budget resolutions, appropriations, taxes, etc, must originate in the House of Representatives.

Black Swan

Amerika wrote: »

Yes the President "proposes" a budget, which initiates the process, but legislation concerning fiscal matters, such as budget resolutions, appropriations, taxes, etc, must originate in the House of Representatives.

Your underlined statement is incorrect and misleading per the Congressional Budget Act of 1974. The federal budget process is "Congressional," which includes both houses of Congress, not one. Both houses of Congress, the Senate and the House of Representatives, must convene their respective budget committees to review and recommend their budget resolutions to their respective floors, the Senate budget committee to the Senate floor, and the House of Representatives budget committee to the House floor. After that, a joint Senate-House resolution is negotiated, which in turn is once again presented to their respective floors, the Senate floor and the House of Representatives floor.

Source: http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=155

The Congressional Budget and Impoundment Control Act of 1974 (P.L. 93-344, 88 Stat. 297) established the statutory basis for a congressional budget process, and provided for the annual adoption of a concurrent resolution on the budget as a mechanism for facilitating congressional budgetary decision making. It also established the House and Senate Budget Committees and created the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to provide budgetary information to Congress independent of the executive branch.

The Budget Cycle...

Within six weeks of the President's budget submission, congressional subcommittees are required to submit their "views and estimates" of spending and revenues within their respective jurisdictions to the House and Senate Budget Committees. These views and estimates, along with information from other sources, is then used by each Budget Committee in drafting and reporting a concurrent resolution on the budget to its respective house.

Source: http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:mUO8sav5J-8J:fpc.state.gov/documents/organization/34649.pdf+congressional+budget+act+of+1974+summary&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESg13wC0_Es8uLfY1RcCTnx_lvlzVs7ESkHGdNLNsZfvatOqefWgLyuQbIYlfJ3_me5nv9V99Vq8yuHC4FAvC9Kjy6Jwj_j-_bghUpenB1GsuWCyBk71L_PHYr2RfghrJovxulka&sig=AHIEtbSnwMRYYOo2Ycheronx_g32PoAJqg

I challenge you to come up with a credible and authoritative citation that states otherwise, that specifically pertains to the Congressional budget resolution process as codified by law.

Amerika

I’ll provide a credible and authoritative source which supports the part you underlined in my last comment -- and indicated was incorrect. (But come to think of it… it is from a Democrat Congressman, so I many have to rescind the “credible and authoritative” part. )

The funding levels for all federal departments, bureaus, offices, programs, independent agencies, discretionary grants, etc. is determined by the annual budget resolution. All legislation concerning fiscal matters (e.g. budget resolution, appropriations, taxes, etc.) must originate in the House of Representatives.

http://johnlewis.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=746

Black Swan

Amerika wrote: »

I’ll provide a credible and authoritative source which supports the part you underlined in my last comment -- and indicated was incorrect. (But come to think of it… it is from a Democrat Congressman, so I many have to rescind the “credible and authoritative” part. )

No, you are misreading your own source, when he is only making reference to the House, which he is a member of, and not the Senate. You are apparently ignoring context.

Although your source is still speaking from his own position in the House, your source states in very general terms the relationship between both houses of "Congress" in the budget resolution process:

Once Congress receives the fiscal year budget proposal from the President...

The House Budget Committee in turn reviews, modifies, and compiles the entire federal budget for each fiscal year. After being marked up and passed by the Committee, the budget resolution is then considered on the House Floor and goes through a similar process in the Senate. After the budget differences are reconciled between the House and Senate, the compromise resolution is then passed by the House and Senate.

Your source: http://johnlewis.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=746

So even your own source disagrees with you, if you bothered to read all that he says in context.

Do you really believe that the US Senate, which is one house of the "Congress," would not consider and vote upon the federal budget (as required and codified by law in the 1974 Budget Act regarding the budget resolution process) for the United States, which they represent? Do you?

Amerika

Of course the Senate is involved, I never said it wasn't.

The debt ceiling negotiations:
After the House debt ceiling deal is done, it will go the the Senate. But it is being determined and initiated in the House. After the Senate and House reconcile it (if they do), it goes to the President. (Have you seen a debt ceiling proposal from the Senate? Or are they waiting for the House version?) And yes, the House version could be stopped by the senate... and a reconcilled house/senate version could be vetoed by the president. Then I believe congress would need a 2/3 majority to overide the president's veto. Of course the Supreme Court could then nix everything with a court challenge.

Black Swan

Amerika wrote: »

The debt ceiling negotiations

We were discussing the federal budget process in accordance with the law, not the specific "debt ceiling" noise that the (sometimes unreliable and sensationalist) news media are playing up, with various politicians from both parties doing sound bites and posturing for the cams. Do you know the difference?

To reiterate, according to the Congressional Budget Act of 1974, step one of the budget process begins with the president's proposed budget, NOT the House of Representatives budget.

Once the president submits his budget to Congress (which includes both the Senate and House) BOTH houses, the Senate and the House, are to work "concurrently" on the budget per the 1974 Act.

Do you understand the meaning of the word "concurrently?"

There is nothing in the 1974 Act that states the House will be first to work on the budget; rather, they are to work “concurrently” (at the same time as the Senate) on the budget after the president proposes it, so you are mistaken.

"Report for Congress" on the budget process source: http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:mUO8sav5J-8J:fpc.state.gov/documents/organization/34649.pdf+congressional+budget+act+of+1974+summary&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESg13wC0_Es8uLfY1RcCTnx_lvlzVs7ESkHGdNLNsZfvatOqefWgLyuQbIYlfJ3_me5nv9V99Vq8yuHC4FAvC9Kjy6Jwj_j-_bghUpenB1GsuWCyBk71L_PHYr2RfghrJovxulka&sig=AHIEtbSnwMRYYOo2Ycheronx_g32PoAJqg

southsiderosie

This is getting a bit pedantic. As a practical matter, the House drives the budget process. The president can propose whatever they want, but as the current wrangling makes quite clear, both the Speaker and the rank-and-file members of the majority party of the House have to be satisfied with the process for things to move ahead.

Yes Clinton was pretty fiscally responsible. He also benefited from Bush I's combination of tax increases and spending cuts - something that the current House Republicans do not seem to understand. If they are serious about being fiscally responsible, there have to be some increases in revenue streams along with budget cuts.