Carbon Road Bike - Do you get what you pay for?

RedB

I'm in the process of getting a half decent road bike and was going to push the boat out a bit on the std BTW scheme and try for a Carbon Frame one. I'd have to top up the difference over the €1k but I'm wondering how much to stretch and do you get more bang for your buck?

I'm not up to speed on the various makes and models but my friendly local bike shop has a special on a Trek 3.1 for €1,600 reduced from €1,800 as the 2012 model is due shortly. He says its a solid make and good components but I'm wondering if its worth the difference for a bike nearer the €1k range. I'm inclined to go with the local guy for servicing and in case of problems but is it worth it compared to cheaper carbon bikes from other sources? I see references here to Focus, Planet X, Cube, etc and I'm dizzy trying to balance the various options.

At the end of the day do you get what you pay for anyway and should you be governed by budget?

cycletheroad

I would say In my opinion, For a good carbon bike you would want to be talking over two grand for good components through out. Anything in the lower regions around 1500 will suffer with some cheaper components. You would do better all round getting an aluminum frame with good components/groupset for same money

Lumen

That Trek 3.1 is decent for €1600. Treks are generally pricey, you're paying for the brand, but it's not crazy money.

You'd get a Planet-X carbon for that money, but....it's a Planet-X. On the other hand, it's not a Trek. :pac:

mfdc

I think that in a blind test, you'd be very hard pressed to tell the difference. It's all in the head; if you spend €1k on a bike and every time you ride it all you think of is "yeah it's nice but what if I'd got the €1500 one, that would have been way nicer..." then it doesn't matter if they're both as fast as each other. It's the reason that people (including me!) go and drop tons of cash on really fancy kit - it might make you faster but that's not why you buy it, you get it because it looks nice and makes you feel good about riding.

Contador used a bike with an Apex groupset (SRAM's cheapest) in the mountain TT at the Giro for the lower gearing. Cancellara used to use FSA Gossamer cranks (FSA's cheapest) before the team switched to SRM crank power meters, because he thought they were stiffer. Graeme Obree set the hour record on a bike he built himself out of a washing machine! The expensive kit doesn't necessarily make you faster, but it might make you feel better about riding.

Plenty of people will tell you they love their Planet X (I have 2 and love them) or their Focus, but if you feel good about the Trek and you can afford it, then why not splash out?

petethedrummer

I presume you have another bike for commuting and general about town bicycle duties.

macnab

i bought last years Boardman Team Carbon for E1064, it has Sram Rival gear which is similar to Shimano Ultegra. It weighs 7.5kg with Zipp 404's. But most importantly it is beautiful and a joy to ride. Buy the best you can afford, you will enjoy it longer.

yop

Good idea for a thread. I wonder if anyone is bored **cough cough** it would be great for the newbies/blondes/apes on bikes if we had a quick stickie thread about "good parts/bad parts" with regards gearing etc.

I just see thread with Ultegra, Sram etc

Even a basic thread just to start off.

From my own view I thought Carbon was Carbon Going by this thread I am wrong!

dancecatz2000

Hmm the trek 3.1 is a great bike for €1600, they come with a life time guarantee too, Stiffer frame than the Planet x too, and very comfortable to ride.

Lemag

dancecatz2000 wrote: »

Hmm the trek 3.1 is a great bike for €1600, they come with a life time guarantee too, Stiffer frame than the Planet x too, and very comfortable to ride.

Yeah? Where'd you source that information? You got numbers to back that up?

dazed+confused

cycletheroad wrote: »

I would say In my opinion, For a good carbon bike you would want to be talking over two grand for good components through out. Anything in the lower regions around 1500 will suffer with some cheaper components. You would do better all round getting an aluminum frame with good components/groupset for same money

I'm not disputing this, it used to be the case, but carbon framed bikes have come down in price big time in the last 3yrs. I've been looking at second hand ones and some guys are expecting to get back half what they paid, which is not far of today's equivalent new price in the shop.

petethedrummer

Lemag you should know at this stage that the Planet-X SL is made from wet cardboard. The Nanolight is made from half cooked pasta in an effort increase stiffness.

FISMA

RedB,
You have to ride the frame and see if you like it. Carbon frames are engineered in ways that steel and aluminum are not.

Some carbon frames are complete junk. They are not rigid and lose an incredible amount of energy in flexing.

Have you ever ridden a high end steel frame? I am riding been riding Trek 5200 Carbon frames for 20 years and love them. However, I think I am going to go to a high end custom steel frame next time.

Slan

cloinsigh

Its all nicely explained here
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/frame-materials.html

RedB

Thanks for all the feedback folks. It has been helpful (as always )

cycletheroad wrote: »

I would say In my opinion, For a good carbon bike you would want to be talking over two grand for good components through out. Anything in the lower regions around 1500 will suffer with some cheaper components. You would do better all round getting an aluminum frame with good components/groupset for same money

I was advised the opposite - to get the best frame I could afford and to upgrade the components over time if needs be / funds available.

yop wrote: »

Good idea for a thread. I wonder if anyone is bored **cough cough** it would be great for the newbies/blondes/apes on bikes if we had a quick stickie thread about "good parts/bad parts" with regards gearing etc.

I just see thread with Ultegra, Sram etc

Even a basic thread just to start off.

From my own view I thought Carbon was Carbon Going by this thread I am wrong!

Ehhh, thanks (I think) Without immersing myself in bike literature for a decent period I'd be hard pressed to know where the various brands,frames, components rated against each other as there's a lot of info and conflicting stuff out there. If someone put it in pecking order like from a Lada to a Porsche then maybe "newbies/blondes/apes" could get their heads around it quicker / easier.
But that was kind of the premise behind my original query - do you get what you pay for and is the ultimate pecking order governed by the market and hence is reflected in the price?

Lumen wrote: »

That Trek 3.1 is decent for €1600. Treks are generally pricey, you're paying for the brand, but it's not crazy money.

You'd get a Planet-X carbon for that money, but....it's a Planet-X. On the other hand, it's not a Trek. :pac:

I'm probably missing the point but are you talking about the aesthetics (performance?) versus the big brand reliability side of things here? Top end Ford Focus v std Toyota corolla?

mfdc wrote: »

I think that in a blind test, you'd be very hard pressed to tell the difference. It's all in the head; if you spend €1k on a bike and every time you ride it all you think of is "yeah it's nice but what if I'd got the €1500 one, that would have been way nicer..." then it doesn't matter if they're both as fast as each other. It's the reason that people (including me!) go and drop tons of cash on really fancy kit - it might make you faster but that's not why you buy it, you get it because it looks nice and makes you feel good about riding.

Contador used a bike with an Apex groupset (SRAM's cheapest) in the mountain TT at the Giro for the lower gearing. Cancellara used to use FSA Gossamer cranks (FSA's cheapest) before the team switched to SRM crank power meters, because he thought they were stiffer. Graeme Obree set the hour record on a bike he built himself out of a washing machine! The expensive kit doesn't necessarily make you faster, but it might make you feel better about riding.

Plenty of people will tell you they love their Planet X (I have 2 and love them) or their Focus, but if you feel good about the Trek and you can afford it, then why not splash out?

Good point and I agree 99% with you but it can't all be in the head. Surely there are 'good' reasons why one product is €1k and another is €2k. The reasons may be marginal but may be worth a premium. I was just wondering if usually the premium is justified at the €1-2k range.

petethedrummer wrote: »

I presume you have another bike for commuting and general about town bicycle duties.

I have a MTB that I could use for the above but I'm only a weekend warrior

macnab wrote: »

i bought last years Boardman Team Carbon for E1064, it has Sram Rival gear which is similar to Shimano Ultegra. It weighs 7.5kg with Zipp 404's. But most importantly it is beautiful and a joy to ride. Buy the best you can afford, you will enjoy it longer.

That's what I was thinking but is there purely a brand premium with the Trek or do I get more bang for my buck? Will it last longer / be more reliable / be better in some way than the Boardman? I'm wondering if I'd be as well off with my €500 in my pocket and something like a Boardman Carbon or stretching to get the Trek 3.1.
Did you get the Boardman from a local shop or online? My dilemma is I don't know enough to make an informed decision besides looking at the price tag and figuring that it must be an accurate reflection of the value of whats offered. I'm trusting my local shop not to be ripping me off (too much :P). However I still have a nagging doubt that there is a better option out there. I guess that's also factored into the price somehow :rolleyes:

dancecatz2000 wrote: »

Hmm the trek 3.1 is a great bike for €1600, they come with a life time guarantee too, Stiffer frame than the Planet x too, and very comfortable to ride.

OK, so I would be getting the right bang for my buck

FISMA wrote: »

RedB,
You have to ride the frame and see if you like it. Carbon frames are engineered in ways that steel and aluminum are not.

Some carbon frames are complete junk. They are not rigid and lose an incredible amount of energy in flexing.

Have you ever ridden a high end steel frame? I am riding been riding Trek 5200 Carbon frames for 20 years and love them. However, I think I am going to go to a high end custom steel frame next time.

Slan

I've been riding a borrowed aluminium frame LaPierre for 2 years and its time to get my own road bike now that I know I'll use it. I'm interested in an entry level Carbon frame as I'm intending on using it for longer cycles (160-200k) over the coming year but I'd intend hanging onto it after that. The Trek Carbon frame is recommended as a decent frame but I wouldn't be at the high end scale of things.

Lumen

FISMA wrote: »

Have you ever ridden a high end steel frame? I am riding been riding Trek 5200 Carbon frames for 20 years and love them. However, I think I am going to go to a high end custom steel frame next time.

Maybe read the comments below this article.

The article itself is pretty crappy IMO but there are some interesting anecdotes from steel owners.

I'm not personally convinced. I fancy getting a nice Colnago Master X-Light one day, mostly for the aesthetics, but I'm not kidding myself it would be feel any better than an appropriate chosen Ti or carbon frame. Maybe I'll just buy the stool instead. :pac:

not sane

If you have the money buy what you like, I have a Planet X and love it, did a fair bit of research through forums etc. Look at it this way another rider said to me I only buy what I can afford to replace if I crash. In the end its the legs and the riders weight that is the most important.

cloinsigh

cycletheroad wrote: »

I would say In my opinion, For a good carbon bike you would want to be talking over two grand for good components through out. Anything in the lower regions around 1500 will suffer with some cheaper components. You would do better all round getting an aluminum frame with good components/groupset for same money

I'd put components second to the frame, some of the low to mid range components can get you along very nicely. If you think you've got to the point where you think the groupset is holding you back then this can then be upgraded.

kennyb3

The trek sounds like a good deal TBH. do you like the look of it though? If i was spending that money i'd have to like my bike.

But more importantly why not immerse yourself in the literature and find out the ins and outs of groupsets, wheels, frames etc? A €1.5k or so purchase, while not huge, isnt exactly just an impulse buy.

Once you make the first effort it gets easier and is fun imho. If it was me i'd want to know what i was buying.

What do you own presently?

RedB

kennyb3 wrote: »

The trek sounds like a good deal TBH. do you like the look of it though? If i was spending that money i'd have to like my bike.

But more importantly why not immerse yourself in the literature and find out the ins and outs of groupsets, wheels, frames etc? A €1.5k or so purchase, while not huge, isnt exactly just an impulse buy.

Once you make the first effort it gets easier and is fun imho. If it was me i'd want to know what i was buying.

What do you own presently?

A buddy got a LaPierre Alum frame road bike (Model??) as part of a €1k Tri Starter Kit (incl bike gear, wetsuit, etc) several years ago and I borrowed it 2 years ago while I figured out if I was interested enough to invest . Its now time to get my own stuff and I was starting with a basic Carbon frame but then I thought I might get decent stuff if I put a few extra quid into it. Its my first time looking at a bike as up to now (dare I say it here :eek:) its just been a basic means of getting from T1 to T2 as quickly as possible (with as little thought as possible ). I've been thinking about a carbon frame for several months but only committed to the idea this week. Up to that I was just thinking about the €1k BTW Scheme range.

RedB

cloinsigh wrote: »

I'd put components second to the frame, some of the low to mid range components can get you along very nicely. If you think you've got to the point where you think the groupset is holding you back then this can then be upgraded.

I think there's a long list of things ahead of the groupset which are currently holding me back that I can currently work on :rolleyes: Endurance, Speed, Weight, Fitness, Hills, Technique, proper Training........:D

Lemag

cycletheroad wrote: »

I would say In my opinion, For a good carbon bike you would want to be talking over two grand for good components through out. Anything in the lower regions around 1500 will suffer with some cheaper components. You would do better all round getting an aluminum frame with good components/groupset for same money

RedB wrote: »

I was advised the opposite - to get the best frame I could afford and to upgrade the components over time if needs be / funds available.

Advances in framesets have thus far been less frequent than advances in components. Also, if you were to get good use out of your bike you will need to replace the components along the way. If you get a carbon frame you'll need to replace it if you break it from a crash or by some other accident but you won't otherwise wear it down with usage. Therefore I'd advise to consider the frame before the components. Btw, visit Shimano, Compagnolo, and SRAM sites to get some understanding of the hierarchy of their components.

I recollect reading here on a couple of threads about someone somewhere selling new 4.5 '10 Madones for something similar to what you've been offered the 3.1. I don't know if this offer is still available but you might be able to find out by locating those threads via the 'search' and firing our some PM..

Lemag

I've just seen from this post that the Planet X Pro Carbon is going for £999 at the moment with SRAM Rival. Rival seems to be a lovely groupset. I doubt that you'll get better bang for your buck at the moment. Regarding the Planet X naysayers - I've yet to come across one who actually has/has had a Planet X. If you look through this thread you'll see that a few boardsies have them. Apparently, some of them are so happy with them that they have two.

RedB

Lemag wrote: »

I've just seen from this post that the Planet X Pro Carbon is going for £999 at the moment with SRAM Rival. Rival seems to be a lovely groupset. I doubt that you'll get better bang for your buck at the moment. Regarding the Planet X naysayers - I've yet to come across one who actually has/has had a Planet X. If you look through this thread you'll see that a few boardsies have them. Apparently, some of them are so happy with them that they have two.

Hmmmmmmmmmmm. €1300 v €1600, PX v Trek 3.1, Athlone v local, 3wk wait v 2 day delivery.
Will have to think this over a bit more and check out the components also.

Chips Lovell

cloinsigh wrote: »

I'd put components second to the frame.

I'd put components third to frame, then wheels.

Lemag

el tonto wrote: »

I'd put components third to frame, then wheels.

For the OP's pricepoint one is not going to get very good wheels with the bike.

Plastik

Avoid the PX shop in Athlone and buy online would be my advice. And yes, I have a Planet X