double drop?

aubreym

just wondering, after watching McDowell deep in a bush during the scottish open yesterday, can you take a penalty drop of 2 club lengths & then take another one if you are deep in the bush still, so you would have taken 2 penalty drops to get a 4 club length relief?

Jul3s

aubreym wrote: »

just wondering, after watching McDowell deep in a bush during the scottish open yesterday, can you take a penalty drop of 2 club lengths & then take another one if you are deep in the bush still, so you would have taken 2 penalty drops to get a 4 club length relief?

I can't see why not, although it would be pointless and a waste of a shot imo.

david

You can drop as many times as you want as long as you penalize yourself and the ball doesn't get closer to the hole.

You can't just take 4 club lengths though. You must mark the ball, mark two clubs, drop, rinse, repeat etc.

nocal

david wrote: »

You can drop as many times as you want as long as you penalize yourself and the ball doesn't get closer to the hole.

You can't just take 4 club lengths though. You must mark the ball, mark two clubs, drop, rinse, repeat etc.

That part is very important.

As an example - if your ball ends up so that you are entitled to relief without penalty from a rutted cart path then you must determine the nearest point of full relief from the cart path and drop in accordance with the rules. If your ball now lies in casual water which you are entitled to relief from you must now determine the nearest point of relief and drop again.

In theory this could go on for a while but you are required to take each individual step.

aubreym

thanks for clarifying it.

was just wondering in case you had a horrendous driving hole in stroke play with a gale force wind across, where if you hit again off the tee, you had a good chance of it going back in, so hitting 4 from halfway up the hole was a better option than 3 off the tee.

yep, was indicating penalty drop. mark position & then drop again :-)

Osgoodisgood

aubreym wrote: »

thanks for clarifying it.

was just wondering in case you had a horrendous driving hole in stroke play with a gale force wind across, where if you hit again off the tee, you had a good chance of it going back in, so hitting 4 from halfway up the hole was a better option than 3 off the tee.

yep, was indicating penalty drop. mark position & then drop again :-)

You'd be hitting 5

Opics

Osgoodisgood wrote: »

You'd be hitting 5

No he wouldn't. Tee shot. Penalty drop. Penalty drop. Hitting 4

kermitpwee

Opics wrote: »

No he wouldn't. Tee shot. Penalty drop. Penalty drop. Hitting 4

I think it's 5 mate.

Tee shot then instead of playing your 2nd you take a penalty and your playing 3 then you take a penalty and you will then be playing 5!

Opics

kermitpwee wrote: »

I think it's 5 mate.

Tee shot then instead of playing your 2nd you take a penalty and your playing 3 then you take a penalty and you will then be playing 5!

But he didn't "play 3" as you said. He took another drop.

He would be playing 5 if he had taken the drop, then taken a shot, and then taken another drop. He is talking about taking 2 unplayable lies.

kermitpwee

Opics wrote: »

But he didn't "play 3" as you said. He took another drop.

He would be playing 5 if he had taken the drop, then taken a shot, and then taken another drop. He is talking about taking 2 unplayable lies.

No mate your confused, He is playing 5. The way your doing it there is no penalty!
You are saying tee shot, penalty drop, penalty drop, hitting 4.
Where is the penalty there? You are saying 1shot(tee shot), 2shot(penalty shot), 3shot(penalty shot) then playing 4 sure you are getting off scot free here! Under your sytem you are hitting the tee shot then taking a penalty which moves the balls location twice but you are still only playing 4? The teeshot is 1 you then move the ball with your penalty drop twice and your playing 4 well where is the penalty there?

kermitpwee

Opics wrote: »

But he didn't "play 3" as you said. He took another drop.

This is where you are going wrong. You don't have to play the 3rd shot if you taking a penalty you are forefitting you right to take the 3rd shot and therefore are dropping 4 under penalty and playing 5.

dnjoyce

kermitpwee wrote: »

This is where you are going wrong. You don't have to play the 3rd shot if you taking a penalty you are forefitting you right to take the 3rd shot and therefore are dropping 4 under penalty and playing 5.

I don't think you're right here. Play the drive, take first drop, the ball is now in play, lying 3(playing your 3rd shot). Deem it unplayable again, so instead of taking your 3rd shot, you are now playing your 4th shot once it has been dropped a second time. I don't think you forefit the right to play a shot at any time. If that were the case the first drop would result in playing your 4th shot instead of 3rd (if I don't play my second shot, I forefit it, drop under penalty and then play 4) which isn't the case

Opics

kermitpwee wrote: »

No mate your confused, He is playing 5. The way your doing it there is no penalty!
You are saying tee shot, penalty drop, penalty drop, hitting 4.
Where is the penalty there? You are saying 1shot(tee shot), 2shot(penalty shot), 3shot(penalty shot) then playing 4 sure you are getting off scot free here! Under your sytem you are hitting the tee shot then taking a penalty which moves the balls location twice but you are still only playing 4? The teeshot is 1 you then move the ball with your penalty drop twice and your playing 4 well where is the penalty there?

You are the confused one. By your logic you are giving him 3 penalty shots for the 2 penalty drops. Shot, Penalty, Penalty. It's not that hard.

Perhaps some people should read their rule book :rolleyes:

Opics

kermitpwee wrote: »

This is where you are going wrong. You don't have to play the 3rd shot if you taking a penalty you are forefitting you right to take the 3rd shot and therefore are dropping 4 under penalty and playing 5.

By your logic he would be playing his 6th shot since he also was forefitting his right to play the 2nd shot. There's no such thing as getting a penalty for deciding not to hit a shot. The penalty comes when you drop it. You don't hit it into a lake with a tee shot and say someone is playing their 4th now because they forefitted their right to play the 2nd shot.

kermitpwee

Opics wrote: »

You are the confused one. By your logic you are giving him 3 penalty shots for the 2 penalty drops. Shot, Penalty, Penalty. It's not that hard.

Perhaps some people should read their rule book :rolleyes:

Hands up I was the confused one here! I think where I was going wrong was I was thinking that the second drop was similar to the first one but I wasn't taking into account that I had hit one off the tee. So when I had dropped out I was automatically thinking that the third had been played if yee get my drift. Thanks to Opics who helped me on the road to enlightment. Note to one's self never take two drops or if you do then learn the rules:D

whizbang

going on a trip to nowhere there lads..
you take a 2 club length drop from the nearest point of relief. you don't take the drop 2 lengths from where your ball ended up.
If it rolls back in, then its a free re-drop. if it goes closer to the hole its a free re-drop. if its unplayable you shouldnt have dropped it there in the first place.
So basically you drop it where you can hit it, for one penalty.

Opics

whizbang wrote: »

going on a trip to nowhere there lads..
you take a 2 club length drop from the nearest point of relief. you don't take the drop 2 lengths from where your ball ended up.
If it rolls back in, then its a free re-drop. if it goes closer to the hole its a free re-drop. if its unplayable you shouldnt have dropped it there in the first place.
So basically you drop it where you can hit it, for one penalty.

This is also wrong. Drop for unplayable lie is:
> Within 2 club lengths from where the ball is, no nearer the hole
> As far back as you want in the line between the hole and the ball
>back to where you hit the previous shot


I'm shocked at the amount of people that don't know the rules here. I hope you haven't dropped at the nearest point of relief for an unplayable in any important competitions.

whizbang

so you are saying: if my ball goes half a mile into the forest, and i retrieve it, then i have to count all the club lengths back to where i can get a shot?

dnjoyce

you still have the option to go back to the tee to hit it, but if you hit it once and it goes pear shaped, then that's when the big numbers become a possibility - see Kevin Na's recent 16 on the PGA tour.

Opics

whizbang wrote: »

so you are saying: if my ball goes half a mile into the forest, and i retrieve it, then i have to count all the club lengths back to where i can get a shot?

You're only option there really is to go back to where you hit from. If your drive went into the forest then you would be hitting your 3rd off the tee. Using the nearest point of relief is not in the rules and is therefore cheating.

whizbang

OK sorry, i should have put in the bit that says "back on a line from the pin" but i thought it was just too much hard work to type it properly.

dropping it back doesnt mean you have a shot at the pin, so thats where the numbers start adding up.

Webbs

whizbang wrote: »

OK sorry, i should have put in the bit that says "back on a line from the pin" but i thought it was just too much hard work to type it properly.

dropping it back doesnt mean you have a shot at the pin, so thats where the numbers start adding up.

But Opics point is still valid and I hope you have taken it on board that if you do decide to drop from an unplayable lie it is most definitely not from nearest point of relief.
So for example if ball is under a big conifer and it takes 1 and a half club lengths to clear the tree from where you have marked the ball then you will only have half a club to drop it in and hopefully find a playable lie.
You dont go to the edge of the tree as point of relief and then take 2 club lengths.

whizbang

For the sake of correctness, (and quietly admitting i was wrong) this is the official rule for ball unplayable: dont mix it up with free drop rules:D


a. Play a ball as nearly as possible at the spot from which the original
ball was last played (see Rule 20-5); or
b. Drop a ball behind the point where the ball lay, keeping that point
directly between the hole and the spot on which the ball is
dropped, with no limit to how far behind that point the ball may
be dropped; or
c. Drop a ball within two club-lengths of the spot where the ball lay,
but not nearer the hole.