Genetic Health Testing?

Cherry Blossom

Does any one have good links to sites or book recommendations where I can find extensive information in relation to health testing. I'm very interested in how the risks are weighed up ect. I'm interested in everything from Hip Dysplasia to Collie Eye to Von Willebrande's Disease. I'm hearing a lot of (eg) 'my bitch has been tested and is not clear but will throw clear pups if put with a clear sire'. Where does a person go to verify this information and where do you go to clarify what a 'good' score is for any particular breed. I have no problem at all with trawling though masses of scientific information and veterinary reports, I'm just not sure where to find them

ISDW

The main issue I think is that different scores are acceptable in different breeds regarding Hip Dysplasia.

The consensus among reputable siberian husky breeders/owners is that no dog should be bred from with a score over 10. However, a GSD with more than that score would be more than acceptable, and a malamute and a labrador. So if you are interested in a particular breed, you need to research that breed.

Different breeds also of course suffer from different genetic health problems, so you wouldn't necessary test for some things in one breed that you would in another.

I think the breed clubs for each breed are probably the best place to start. With the internet, it doesn't necessarily have to be the Irish breed club, you could check breed clubs around the world.

Cherry Blossom

ISDW wrote: »

I think the breed clubs for each breed are probably the best place to start. With the internet, it doesn't necessarily have to be the Irish breed club, you could check breed clubs around the world.

This was my starting point and I'm coming across some very different opinions so would like to educate myself with some scientific stuff to help me reach a conclusion. Eg. Hip dysplasia is not a big problem in the breed but are hip scores any help in determining other orthopaedic issues? Very few are hip scored, those that are have scores under 10 (but I believe they all would anyway) however how big a problem is it if there is a difference of more than 3 in the scores for left and right? Also some dogs that have tested positive for PRA are bred anyway, a certain number of pups from previous litters where confirmed to have collie eye at 8 weeks but the same pairing has been put together again. I guess I'm struggling to understand not so good test results and choosing to breed regardless, surely it's no different from not testing at all.

These aren't all the same breeder by the way :pac:

The Sweeper

Ummm...

The canine diversity project has a lot of interesting information on http://www.canine-genetics.com/ but I'm not certain how reliable their information is. There are a lot of PhD and Dr contributors, but after all it's the internet... Still, it's probably a very good place to start.

I find genetics fascinating but also massively intimidating - I'm okay with the XX and XY chromosome concepts, and dominant and recessive genes as they apply to colour, but once you get into XXY, heterzygous and homozygous stuff, I'm completely bloody lost.

In terms of a bitch with a genetic illness being put with a clear sire and throwing clear pups, that would probably be all about which chromosome the gene sits on, whether or not it's a dominant gene, and whether or not being put with a clear sire would ensure the pups were clear (but I wonder would it depend on the gender of the pups?!)

So yeah - good luck...

lrushe

There is some good info on this site,you can even trace some of the ancestors to your dog in this if they have been registered. My Rottie Brook has a few ancestors registered here.
http://www.offa.org/

I don't like the idea of breeding a bitch with a known illness to a stud that was free of the illness, to correct confirmation this is fine but not genetic illness. Breeding is like a lotto, you can do some fairly educated guessing but really you have no control over what a pairing will throw. So while you might get a litter who doesn't suffer from the illness of the bitch you could just as easily get a a couple of pups in the litter who do suffer the same or worse condition than their dam and knowingly gambling on creating an animal who will suffer for it's life with an illness is not the mark of a good breeder imo. Some will call such pups 'collateral damage' to improve bloodlines, I call it lazy breeding. With the internet and ease of travel nowadays finding a dog or bitch with the lines you want that is free of genetic illness isn't so hard, it might take awhile to do it properly but when it comes to the welfare of the animals you produce time shouldn't be an issue.

ISDW

I had a very interesting conversation with a vet at the Dog Expo, and there have been studies carried out on pups from breeds that can suffer from HD, using their diet to see if that has any effect. Some pups had a very strictly controlled diet, and weren't allowed to put on any excess weight at all, other pups were fed more, and had 'puppy fat'. The ones that had no excess weight stayed clear of HD, whereas some of the fatter ones got it. So, it does lend weight to the nurture theory, rather than the nature one.

With hip testing as well, it depends how the score is achieved. One of my boys has a score of 25, which is horrendous in a sibe, but it is 12/13, so it is very even, so actually probably isn't an indication of any problems. He's 5 now and has never shown any issues. I did used to let him go up and down stairs when he was a pup, and probably over-exercised him, not knowing then what I know now.

Pen University have a new method of testing, which is interesting, to be used alongside tradititional hip scoring methods.

Cherry Blossom

Just to add I didn't mention breeds in the hope that this thread could be a bit of an open ended thread on genetic testing with hopefully some resources other people will come across. We all know we should look for ethical breeders but how test results should be read and what they are indicators of is not so clear cut and isn't info that's really readily available. So I'd encourage anyone interested to post on this thread without worry of sounding 'ignorant' (for want of a better word) about the subject. What I'm finding is:

1. Very different interpretations of test results and opinions of how useful/useless various/specific tests are.

2. There is a shortage of info readily available out there and

3. It's all very complex and scientific while being somewhat theoretical at the same time, so it isn't something anyone can read up on in a weekend and come away with a basic understanding of.

Hopefully I can add some links to this thread myself as I go along.

Cherry Blossom

For a starting point I went here:

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/doghealth/

http://www.doggenetichealth.org/

http://www.bva.co.uk/canine_health_schemes/Canine_Health_Schemes.aspx

These sites give a basic overview, some information on tests relevant to specific breeds and the BVA site has some statistics on there for all dogs that have been tested. It's worth bearing in mind though that the mean or average(sort of!) score doesn't mean its a good score especially when you consider that a vast no. of dogs will have been tested purely because an issue has become apparent (the dog has become lame etc.) It isn't just dogs being considered for breeding that are tested . Or at least this is my humble understanding of it anyway :rolleyes:

The point of all this is just so I can make an educated judgement call on what people are telling me, not to become an expert in the subject or anything remotely close to it .