name and shame - who is not passing on the VAT reduction

John Mason

Bon Espresso on Mount Street

Cookie_Monster

proof?

John Mason

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

proof?

errr.......do you want to see my receipt

TheVoodoo

I'm guessing the proof is that the prices have not been reduced / changed??

John Mason

coffee 3.20 on Friday

Coffee 3.20 today

daddydick

The shops will argue that the decrease in VAT helps them to meet rising rent/rates costs in the face of decreasing business.

However, this measure was not introduced to do this. It was introduced to generate an increase in trade for these kind of shops by way of lowering costs while still making the same margin on the sale of products.

If shops do not lower costs (which they have zero legal obligation to) then the measure will not work. The state will receive less VAT and the shop will receive the same (or lower) levels of business.

In the above example, the cost should have come down from €3.20 to €3.07 (say €3.10 for arguments sake). With this reduction the margin is the same or even higher than before if priced at €3.10.

Any SMART coffee shop owner would advertise in his/her windows that they have implemented the VAT reduction and also, if I owned a coffee shop/chain, reduce the prices of coffee across the board. I would reduce €3.20 coffee's to €3.00 - while only cutting my margin by 7c per cup. Business owners are so stupid sometimes - they could easily quote competitors who havn't passed on the reduction in their advertisement - a la Ryanair, Tesco marketing strategies. They don't even see that the "loss" of the 7c margin can be easily made up by a tiny increase in sales of coffee.

I for one will be boycotting any shop I hear of that is not passing on the decrease in VAT. They are taking advantage of a Government scheme to get money flowing in this economy with the hope it will not affect their business. How shortsighted of them.

Bon Espresso - you can keep your €3.20 coffee, my business is going elsewhere.

_blank_

cups of coffee are three quid?

what the?

angel01

Des wrote: »

cups of coffee are three quid?

what the?

You can get a coffee in McDonalds for 2 Euro

Jimmy Two Times

The reduction of the V.A.T. rate on the provision of certain goods and services is part of the Government's " Jobs Initiative Scheme ".

To me, this means that the measure was introduced to protect vulnerable jobs in the industries affected. We are all aware that there are loads of businesses on the brink of either laying off more staff or of closing down altogether.

If,by increasing gross margin by a few precentage points a business can now find the means to hold onto its staff, create a new job or two or just stay in business, then for me the scheme will have worked.

Not interested in saving 10c on a cup of coffee or on a bag of chips.

We need to look at the big picture here.

Jimmy Two Times

irishbird wrote: »

coffee 3.20 on Friday

Coffee 3.20 today

Ah yeah, but maybe it was 3.30 on Thursday.

Reduction came into effect on 1st July.

sdanseo

Rates should be passed on, end of. There's simply no excuse for not doing it - even putting the prices down and maybe rising them in a month's time would be better than arrogantly flouting the decrease just because they can.

Seriously though, €3.30 for a coffee? I would NEVER pay that if I drank the stuff - to me €1.49 for a bottle of Coke is extortionate. At those rates, Coffee is about 800% the price per litre of petrol. Greedy rip-off merchants is all they are.

FreudianSlippers

sdeire wrote: »

Rates should be passed on, end of. There's simply no excuse for not doing it - even putting the prices down and maybe rising them in a month's time would be better than arrogantly flouting the decrease just because they can.

Seriously though, €3.30 for a coffee? I would NEVER pay that if I drank the stuff - to me €1.49 for a bottle of Coke is extortionate. At those rates, Coffee is about 800% the price per litre of petrol. Greedy rip-off merchants is all they are.

Shouldn't they be allowed to charge the old VAT rate on goods purchased before the decrease?

daddydick

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

Shouldn't they be allowed to charge the old VAT rate on goods purchased before the decrease?

They are allowed to do as they please, its a free country

However they will lose customers. The cost of the cofee element of a cup of coffee (taking out all overheads which they dont pay VAT on) is no greater than 20c a cup. VAT on that 2c before and after the drop in VAT rates!

daddydick

Jimmy Two Times wrote: »

The reduction of the V.A.T. rate on the provision of certain goods and services is part of the Government's " Jobs Initiative Scheme ".

To me, this means that the measure was introduced to protect vulnerable jobs in the industries affected. We are all aware that there are loads of businesses on the brink of either laying off more staff or of closing down altogether.

If,by increasing gross margin by a few precentage points a business can now find the means to hold onto its staff, create a new job or two or just stay in business, then for me the scheme will have worked.

Not interested in saving 10c on a cup of coffee or on a bag of chips.

We need to look at the big picture here.

No this is just wrong. If you think that by making a margin of 13c extra per cup of coffee that they are going to create jobs then you are seriously eluded.

The aim of this was to bring prices down, then people can afford these goods and following this business will build up and eventually jobs will be retained/created.

Bobby Kerr is hardly going to retain/employ more staff if the prices do not come down, as business will suffer and long term profits will be down.

It is part of the jobs initiative as by making the country more competitive people will begin spending again, thus increasing profits and job creation. By not passing on the drop, they are losing customers. Lost customers = lost staff in the long term.

Jimmy Two Times

daddydick wrote: »

No this is just wrong. If you think that by making a margin of 13c extra per cup of coffee that they are going to create jobs then you are seriously eluded.

The aim of this was to bring prices down, then people can afford these goods and following this business will build up and eventually jobs will be retained/created.

Bobby Kerr is hardly going to retain/employ more staff if the prices do not come down, as business will suffer and long term profits will be down.

It is part of the jobs initiative as by making the country more competitive people will begin spending again, thus increasing profits and job creation. By not passing on the drop, they are losing customers. Lost customers = lost staff in the long term.

Sorry can't agree.

Take a small Restaurant / Cafe turning over € 8,000 per week. Assume € 500 in minerals where the V.A.T stays at 21% and the balance at the old 13.5%.

Net T/O pw was € 7,021 and is now € 7,294.

That's 30 hours per week at Min Wage in anyone's language.

If I was happy with the service etc in my eaterie of choice, failure to pass on a reduction of 20 or 30 cent isn't going to make me go elsewhere.

Most cafe's and restaurants are now charging Rock Bottom prices anyway.

Got a savage Sirloin Steak with all the bits for 15 notes at Lunch Time today.

Plenty of places charging € 22 for two decent courses. Can be making SFA charging those kind of prices.

temply

angel01 wrote: »

You can get a coffee in McDonalds for 2 Euro

I have a starbucks card & top it up each week. With it, you get a all drip coffee for €1:50

stovelid

A lot of places near me (in town) give you a scone/croissant/pain au chocolat with your coffee for that price.

Vote with your feet.

admiralofthefleet

Des wrote: »

cups of coffee are three quid?

what the?

you need to have a word des

Coriolanus

daddydick wrote: »

The aim of this was to bring prices down, then people can afford these goods and following this business will build up and eventually jobs will be retained/created.

I think you're the one being deluded. If you think that there were people gazing in the window of bon espresso thinking to themselves "damn, I want a coffee but I'm 13cent short" before the Vat change at least.

John_Rambo

You are making really good points daddydick, but the whole idea was for the VAT rate to be dropped so that customers could get better value, not for the shop owner to choose what he/she wants to do with it. This name and shame thread has turned in to a discussion.

I am going to ask the mods to have a name and shame thread with no discussions. Irishbirds idea is a really good one. People can name the companies and you can make up your own mind.

Miguel_Sanchez

Coffee in my local is 1.70 for a large Americano. I'm off now to see if they've reduced their prices since the VAT reduction.

John Mason

Newstalk have a list of who is not passing it on and why

http://www.newstalk.ie/2011/programmes/all-programmes/breakfast/vat-reduction-whos-passing-it-on/


Oh, IBTL

tbh

There';s a new food hall opening up across the road from BE on mount street - word is that there'll be a spar there too. When that happens, bye bye BE, and not before time.

_blank_

I need to lock this thread I'm afraid.

naming those who have "not passed on the VAT reduction" without strict proof (i.e. clearly showing a receipt) is not a good idea.

In essence though, the thread is ok once the poster has proof attached, otherwise it's not safe to name and shame.