ANOTHER NCHD ABOUT TO EXPLODE!

MrsDribbles

hi all,

new to this site, but really need to ask a question. A technical question! I am one of the lucky NCHDs working in a peripheral hospital, by no means compliant with EWTD (102 hrs/week, 7 calls in 4 weeks etc etc) and my HR department are so useless. They will tell you everything you are NOT allowed but wont heed my contract when I show them all the places it is breached.

My last straw with them, is being put on call on the Sunday 10th July until usually 1pm monday 11th July. I am starting a new job on Monday 11th and they want me there at 9 am. HOW THE HELL AM I TO MANAGE THIS!? i have been told by a junior member of HR that there is no way they will get a locum to cover. and as only 3 people are staying on in the hospital, 2 of them are on call over the weekend. The other one is busy. So I am going to my HR dept tomorrow to see what I can do. I want to play it simple and ask them realistically what they can do to help me be in 2 places at one time. But I know they wont want to hear. Even If I throw at them every part of the contract! But one thing I want to know is.....when does our contract technically end????? Is it 10th July? as in Midnight 10th July???? or is it 11th July? I got my new contract wfrom my next job with the contract starting 11th July. so can I be contracted for 2 jobs on 1 day????

Oh lord, im so confused!!!!! Please someone help me!!!!!!!

MrsDribbles

BTW- just to add. my consultant tells me not to "rock the boat". IMO tell me "they always have problems with this hospital" yet do nothing about it. So I really feel Im totally on my own!!!!

ThatDrGuy

Its quite simple. They can do whatever the hell they like to you, as long as you're willing to let them do it to you. Call in sick sunday or refuse to work the illegal hours. Say you have already done 48 hours. Get on the next boat to OZ and stop propping up their dying system. Get a real job and have a life.

Bella mamma

This happens in every hospital, it's very difficult for HR to find someone not working on changeover day; and very difficult if 'The Choosen One' IS working on changeover day.

Your consultant's comment is irrelevant. Say nothing more.

We've had a number of cases where people have been scheduled with less than 2 weeks notice (that appears to be your case), and those people have refused to do the call for that reason. The HR Department (one of the biggest) always accepts that reason, i.e. both HR and employees respect that 2 weeks notice must be given, and if not, the call can be declined with no further issue for the employee. The employee does not have to find call cover.

Re the best interest of patients, if there was any way you could start later on the Monday that would probably be the best solution. This is not a unique situation and I would think, where possible, your new employer/team could work it out? Failing that, see above!

Best of luck in your new job.

RobFowl

If you have to do it write a letter of complaint to the medical council. It is unethical to accept a post and not show up for it.
The actions of the hospital are forcing you into this position so bring to the attention of the medical council.
If you really want action (and for the future NCHD's who WILL also be asked to do the same) then cc it to HIQA !!!

Vorsprung

Yea CCing to HIQA may be a good idea, they seem to be doing a lot of good lately...

drzhivago

First thing when did they issue rota with you on until July 11th, in the last contract they gave assurances about adequate notice for on call

When does your medical council registration end - that used to be a good one for getting out of on call on June 30th when July 1st was changeover as most didnt have a new reg cert and their registration to work in that hospital for non eu expired at midnight legally = hospitals always argued this on practical basis but at time helped people get legal opinion and they were clear contract ended at midnight and so did registration

without giving away details what posts are you in, is this a training post, if so the training body should be able to help

Should also demand IMO come down and sort it out, one of the people staying should do that night and you do night before

Your ultimate ace card is the working time act you could make a complaint about that hospital toLRC and they would have to investigate, doing this would pull down the whole deck of cards

HIQUA useless for this but NEMA more appropriate route

opinion guy

Vorsprung wrote: »

Yea CCing to HIQA may be a good idea, they seem to be doing a lot of good lately...

How so ??


And whats NEMA ?

lonestargirl

opinion guy wrote: »

And whats NEMA ?

I think he meant NERA (national employment rights agency)

Vorsprung

opinion guy wrote: »

How so ??


And whats NEMA ?

Long working hours and poor conditions impact on a doctor's (and anyone else working in the service) health and wellbeing, and consequently on their ability to deliver care to the patient. This falls within HIQA's remit.

opinion guy

Vorsprung wrote: »

Long working hours and poor conditions impact on a doctor's (and anyone else working in the service) health and wellbeing, and consequently on their ability to deliver care to the patient. This falls within HIQA's remit.

Oh yes I don't doubt it falls under HIQA's remit - as it has done since HIQA's establishment. What I mean is - what is this good work the HIQA have been putting out recently as claimed above ?

dissed doc

MrsDribbles wrote: »

hi all,

new to this site, but really need to ask a question. A technical question! I am one of the lucky NCHDs working in a peripheral hospital, by no means compliant with EWTD (102 hrs/week, 7 calls in 4 weeks etc etc) and my HR department are so useless. They will tell you everything you are NOT allowed but wont heed my contract when I show them all the places it is breached.

My last straw with them, is being put on call on the Sunday 10th July until usually 1pm monday 11th July. I am starting a new job on Monday 11th and they want me there at 9 am. HOW THE HELL AM I TO MANAGE THIS!? i have been told by a junior member of HR that there is no way they will get a locum to cover. and as only 3 people are staying on in the hospital, 2 of them are on call over the weekend. The other one is busy. So I am going to my HR dept tomorrow to see what I can do. I want to play it simple and ask them realistically what they can do to help me be in 2 places at one time. But I know they wont want to hear. Even If I throw at them every part of the contract! But one thing I want to know is.....when does our contract technically end????? Is it 10th July? as in Midnight 10th July???? or is it 11th July? I got my new contract wfrom my next job with the contract starting 11th July. so can I be contracted for 2 jobs on 1 day????

Oh lord, im so confused!!!!! Please someone help me!!!!!!!

Don't be angry, maintain your own control over the situation. Tell them you are unable to do the rostered on-call. Give them the week's notice of this, and you can if you are nice advise them that people remaining int he hospital may be able to do it

a) it's not your job to staff or run the rota or to find replacements
b) you are not irreplaceable (well, currently you are) but basically, if you call in sick, other's will cover (and not complain - idiots), there will be some toes stepped on but overall, no-one will give a damn if you do it or Cheryl COle does it.

If you are unable to do it, just say that. Don't get into stuff about registration, contracts, and all that garbage. It's clearly unreasonable what you are being asked to do, so THAT is the only reaosn you give. Be honest, firm, and tell them they will need to make an aletrnative arrangement.

drzhivago

lonestargirl wrote: »

I think he meant NERA (national employment rights agency)

Yes apologies

they have a monitoring role for stuff like this also

opinion guy

drzhivago wrote: »

Yes apologies

they have a monitoring role for stuff like this also

Where have they been for the last 50 years then ?

Vorsprung

opinion guy wrote: »

Oh yes I don't doubt it falls under HIQA's remit - as it has done since HIQA's establishment. What I mean is - what is this good work the HIQA have been putting out recently as claimed above ?

Shutting down dodgy nursing homes where there has been substandard resident care, recent announcement of an inquiry into patient care at Tallaght come to mind quick enough.

opinion guy

Vorsprung wrote: »

Shutting down dodgy nursing homes where there has been substandard resident care, recent announcement of an inquiry into patient care at Tallaght come to mind quick enough.

Kinda seems like small fry to me when we have a massively inequal public/private split and generally degenerate health system does it not ? I mean I'm forced to wonder why HIQA have not done much much more. Yes shutting down dodgy nursing homes is a good thing. Tarnishing the name of a chronically under-staffed, under resourced hospital - hmm I'm less convinced thats a good thing - I mean the real problems are beyond the ability of Tallaght hospital to control and most likely any hospital you analyse will have similar problems.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending the goings on at Tallaght - I just don't think they are unique. And frankly I expect more from HIQA than they've put out. I recently enough skimmed some of their publications and I'm not really impressed - lots of businessy, managment talk - not alot of numbers and hard data

Vorsprung

That the public system is degenerate is well known, do we need an investigation into that? But fair enough, perhaps some of the cases have been small fry, I can't say that I've been following their work particularly closely, more that I keep up with the news at home and HIQA has featured prominently for the last while.

Anyway I don't want to drag this off topic too much, perhaps these posts could be moved into a new thread?