No Fixed Abode

BlueBaron

Just out of curiosity, whats the craic with homeless people being.... eh.... homeless??
Do they not recieve social welfare and everything else that comes with it??

Savage Tyrant

Even a council property requires payment of rent. When people make bad choices, like spending rent, gas and electric money on things like gambling, alcohol or drugs, then eventually they'll be evicted from wherever they live.
Sad but true.

robman60

I'm also unsure on the whole dole and benefits for homeless people... Anyone able to clarify?

deisedave

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Even a council property requires payment of rent. When people make bad choices, like spending rent, gas and electric money on things like gambling, alcohol or drugs, then eventually they'll be evicted from wherever they live.
Sad but true.

If someone decides to spend there rent money on alcohol or drugs, then I would'nt spare much sympathy for them. People have to be responsible some what for there own actions.

BlueBaron

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Even a council property requires payment of rent. When people make bad choices, like spending rent, gas and electric money on things like gambling, alcohol or drugs, then eventually they'll be evicted from wherever they live.
Sad but true.

I've never seen a homeless man collect the dole in the post ofice tough, so i was just wondering do they get SW

Mr. Manager

Am I only the only one who thought "no fixed abode" was someones address upon hearing it on the radio for the first time??

strobe

Quite a few of the genuinely homeless would suffer from psychological issues, schizophrenia and the like, and as they are obviously not thinking rationally some would choose to live on the streets rather than take government assistance. Or be unable to appreciate the fact that government assistance would benefit them.

Logical Fallacy

robman60 wrote: »

I'm also unsure on the whole dole and benefits for homeless people... Anyone able to clarify?

They are not eligible for Social Welfare payments as they have no address.

Richard Hillman

You cant get social welfare without a home address. Its kind of strange that the poorest in society cant get help because they are too poor. Im no bleeding heart left winger but and i know a lot of these people only have themselves to blame but there are a lot of people out there who are homeless due to bad luck and cant get help because they cant afford to rent even the most basic roof over their heads.

havana

Richard Hillman wrote: »

You cant get social welfare without a home address. Its kind of strange that the poorest in society cant get help because they are too poor. Im no bleeding heart left winger but and i know a lot of these people only have themselves to blame but there are a lot of people out there who are homeless due to bad luck and cant get help because they cant afford to rent even the most basic roof over their heads.

If you are registered as homeless then yes you do receive a social welfare payment - it's a supplementary welfare payment.

Truley

strobe wrote: »

Quite a few of the genuinely homeless would suffer from psychological issues, schizophrenia and the like, and as they are obviously not thinking rationally some would choose to live on the streets rather than take government assistance. Or be unable to appreciate the fact that government assistance would benefit them.

From my experience working with homeless people this definitely rings true. But keep in mind, Government assistance is often unavailable or insufficient to help a person with serious addiction or mental health problems. A lot of people take for granted the importance of a support network of family or friends, no matter how fickle it may seem to you. Imagine what it's like to have zero family support from childhood. Nobody to help you along or fall back on when things get tough. Nobody to teach you how to get by in society.

I worked with a lot of people who would have grown up in institutions like industrial schools and laundries. When they came of age they were dumped into society with no support and a host of psychological issues. I would wager a very large proportion of homeless people in Ireland would have grown up in the state 'care' system.

robman60

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

They are not eligible for Social Welfare payments as they have no address.

That seems quite awful. Until recently, i was convinced that they were at least eligible for the dole. Surely the people with no address are the ones who require benefits more than anyone else??

orourkeda

Richard Hillman wrote: »

You cant get social welfare without a home address. Its kind of strange that the poorest in society cant get help because they are too poor. Im no bleeding heart left winger but and i know a lot of these people only have themselves to blame but there are a lot of people out there who are homeless due to bad luck and cant get help because they cant afford to rent even the most basic roof over their heads.

I am so using that line

orourkeda

Truley wrote: »

From my experience working with homeless people this definitely rings true. But keep in mind, Government assistance is often unavailable or insufficient to help a person with serious addiction or mental health problems. A lot of people take for granted the importance of a support network of family or friends, no matter how fickle it may seem to you. Imagine what it's like to have zero family support from childhood. Nobody to help you along or fall back on when things get tough. Nobody to teach you how to get by in society.

I worked with a lot of people who would have grown up in institutions like industrial schools and laundries. When they came of age they were dumped into society with no support and a host of psychological issues. I would wager a very large proportion of homeless people in Ireland would have grown up in the state 'care' system.

How can the state just wash their hands of it when its as much their fault these people are on the streets?

greenybaby

If they can register as homeless and get the dole then surely they are entitled to rent allowance to get them off the streets

Tonyandthewhale

A lot of homeless people have psychological problems and/or addiction problems so they're unlikely to have the wherewithall to organise social welfare for themselves (I don't think it's true that you can't get dole without an address as this would be pretty stupid while being incredibly easy to fix, also someone already mentioned being able to register as homeless to get social welfare). The other side of the coin is immigrants who arrive in Ireland illegally or otherwise and who have no social welfare rights as they never payed tax here.
These people have no way of getting back on their feet here and no way of raising the funds to move on or go home.

AckwelFoley

This is my forth time to post this but it reflects how i feel on the whole junkie / homeless / begger issue

I left the pub one night about 7 years ago, i had just had a fight with my then girlfriend i wasnt in the best of form, this homeless guy sitting on the ground as i walked by asked "spare some change?" i snapped back at him "get a fcuking job!".... he just replied "ok , sorry" by the time i had taken about 10 more steps the feeling of guilt hit me like a stone wall.. who the fcuk was i to say that to him? I knew nothing about him or his past or what he has being through.. my gf wasnt impressed either but i went up to the nearest chipper bought a burger chips and a coffee and walked back to him... i was aware that he was well within his rights to tell me to go fcuk myself as he threw the food back at me, however, i went back to him and apologised to him prefusely.. i think the most humbeling thing of all was his reaction, he was so nice about it and said it happens all the tim, the bit of food i gave him, he received like i gave him a thousand euro he was thrilled, we stayed and chatted and he told me of the circumstances that lead to his current position, i was humbled and learnt a vey valueable life lesson.. never look down on other people, since that time ive had my ups and downs that could quite possibly have placed me in a position where i could have ended up on hard times if i didnt have support, of my family and friends - ones own head is a very powerful asset, but can be your greatest enemy too.

My point is, we are not to judge those in certain situations like this, because you dont know the circumstance, mental illness etc. You simply dont know, and i wouldnt be so wuick to judge them unless you know the problems the faced, the problems that caused them to be there. Its easy judge from the outside looking in - but you just dont know, obviously nobody wants to be homeless, but as the T Shirt says **** happens

stovelid

robman60 wrote: »

I'm also unsure on the whole dole and benefits for homeless people... Anyone able to clarify?

No mortgage, lots of fresh air and no hoovering to do, I guess.

the groutch

snyper wrote: »

This is my forth time to post this but it reflects how i feel on the whole junkie / homeless / begger issue

I left the pub one night about 7 years ago, i had just had a fight with my then girlfriend i wasnt in the best of form, this homeless guy sitting on the ground as i walked by asked "spare some change?" i snapped back at him "get a fcuking job!".... he just replied "ok , sorry" by the time i had taken about 10 more steps the feeling of guilt hit me like a stone wall.. who the fcuk was i to say that to him? I knew nothing about him or his past or what he has being through.. my gf wasnt impressed either but i went up to the nearest chipper bought a burger chips and a coffee and walked back to him... i was aware that he was well within his rights to tell me to go fcuk myself as he threw the food back at me, however, i went back to him and apologised to him prefusely.. i think the most humbeling thing of all was his reaction, he was so nice about it and said it happens all the tim, the bit of food i gave him, he received like i gave him a thousand euro he was thrilled, we stayed and chatted and he told me of the circumstances that lead to his current position, i was humbled and learnt a vey valueable life lesson.. never look down on other people, since that time ive had my ups and downs that could quite possibly have placed me in a position where i could have ended up on hard times if i didnt have support, of my family and friends - ones own head is a very powerful asset, but can be your greatest enemy too.

My point is, we are not to judge those in certain situations like this, because you dont know the circumstance, mental illness etc. You simply dont know, and i wouldnt be so wuick to judge them unless you know the problems the faced, the problems that caused them to be there. Its easy judge from the outside looking in - but you just dont know, obviously nobody wants to be homeless, but as the T Shirt says **** happens

fair play to you mate

the real problem lies with the fact that with so many alcoholics, druggies, etc and so much "organised begging", it's hard to know who's genuine or not.
yours was just about the best way to go about it, offer them food rather than money, if they refuse it you can still eat it yourself.

Del2005

How does a certain group in our society get so much when they traditionally have no fixed abode?