CIE Group 2010 Annual Reports published

LXFlyer

http://www.cie.ie/about_us/annual_reports.asp

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Interesting reading

What was the enormous investment and subsequent disposal of fixed assets in 07-09 about?

Also what do 258 staff in CIE do? Genuine question, I thought it was just a holding company

LXFlyer

As per page 21:

CIE Tours International Inc.
Commuter Advertising Network (CAN)
CIÉ Group Property
Insurance/Liability Management
Information Technology
Legal Services

As well as group finance, secretarial etc.

dowlingm

The pro-railfreight folks will be pointing to another surplus (800k) for the railfreight division. Rosslare Hbr made over a million but it's not a reason to keep it under IE division since IE refuse to make the most of its ownership.

@cookie - I don't see the disposal you mention. I think acquisition spiked because that would have been around the time of Mk4 and 22K deliveries?

Art(h)ur

Interestingly enough, the most important numbers for a public transport company, that is passenger figures and ticket revenue, are not included! Yet, they sure will be (already are in fact - see today's quote from minister Leo) used as one of the main reasons for service cuts, fare increases and the like. Without any proof whatsoever!

In any case, I still think that even if the passenger numbers are indeed falling, then:
a) if the drop is by 5% or less, it is a normal fluctuation (numbers are unlikely to be stable year on year so they inevitably will be up or down by a few %) and does not require any drastic action
b) regardless of the size of the drop - look at the potential actions a company can take to attract more passengers in the first place rather than ignore this step all together and go straight to looking at where cuts can be made.

LXFlyer

That information is there:

Dublin Bus - 119m passenger journeys (down 7.2%)
Bus Eireann - 79.6m passenger journeys (down 5.9%)
Iarnrod Eireann - 38.2m passenger journeys (down 1.5%)

Cookie_Monster

dowlingm wrote: »

@cookie - I don't see the disposal you mention. I think acquisition spiked because that would have been around the time of Mk4 and 22K deliveries?

The balance sheet shows they actual have 1.2bn of fixed assets, so that graph is showing money spent on assets is all, just read it wrong it seems

dowlingm

Broadmeadow caused the 2009 IE figures to be unusually bad so the 2008 vs 2010 numbers are better comparators if one is looking for trends.

foggy_lad

Art(h)ur wrote: »

Interestingly enough, the most important numbers for a public transport company, that is passenger figures and ticket revenue, are not included! Yet, they sure will be (already are in fact - see today's quote from minister Leo) used as one of the main reasons for service cuts, fare increases and the like. Without any proof whatsoever!

In any case, I still think that even if the passenger numbers are indeed falling, then:
a) if the drop is by 5% or less, it is a normal fluctuation (numbers are unlikely to be stable year on year so they inevitably will be up or down by a few %) and does not require any drastic action
b) regardless of the size of the drop - look at the potential actions a company can take to attract more passengers in the first place rather than ignore this step all together and go straight to looking at where cuts can be made.

the reductions made especially by Bus Eireann are more about the reduction of their subvention than falling passenger numbers, they have less money coming in and less passengers so they want to keep their figures up by reducing services? you cant get from Carlow or Waterford to Naas now without going into Busaras, situations like this are truely ridiculous but that is the way the sham of a company is going.

LXFlyer

foggy_lad wrote: »

the reductions made especially by Bus Eireann are more about the reduction of their subvention than falling passenger numbers, they have less money coming in and less passengers so they want to keep their figures up by reducing services? you cant get from Carlow or Waterford to Naas now without going into Busaras, situations like this are truely ridiculous but that is the way the sham of a company is going.

But you can use JJ Kavanagh for that exact journey - 12 times a day from Waterford and Carlow.

Bus Eireann obviously feel that the stronger passenger demand is for services between Dublin and points from Carlow south.

Why should they continue to provide a service through Naas when JJ Kavanagh provide one that I would suggest looks more than adequate, and at the same time BE can offer an improved service to customers south of Carlow travelling to/from Dublin?

I'd call that sensible planning of services.

LXFlyer

dowlingm wrote: »

Broadmeadow caused the 2009 IE figures to be unusually bad so the 2008 vs 2010 numbers are better comparators if one is looking for trends.

That would mean a 14.5% drop in two years.

foggy_lad

lxflyer wrote: »

But you can use JJ Kavanagh for that exact journey - 12 times a day from Waterford and Carlow.

Bus Eireann obviously feel that the stronger passenger demand is for services between Dublin and points from Carlow south.

Why should they continue to provide a service through Naas when JJ Kavanagh provide one that I would suggest looks more than adequate, and at the same time BE can offer an improved service to customers south of Carlow travelling to/from Dublin?

I'd call that sensible planning of services.

The JJ Kavanagh's service is more expensive and slower than the Bus Eireann service it is supposed to replace now.

Pasengwers from Waterford will not be able to get to Naas or Kilcullen without an expensive change at Busaras or at Carlow onto a Kavanagh's bus

The services are not as busy since the changes! the 8pm bus used to be at least two thirds full but now it leaves at 7.45 les than half full! the new Waterford service also does not serve the Luas stop at red cow from what i have seen.

LXFlyer

What are you talking about?

JJ Kavanagh operates from Waterford to Dublin via Carlow, Kilcullen and Naas.

Why should people have to switch buses anywhere?

foggy_lad

lxflyer wrote: »

What are you talking about?

JJ Kavanagh operates from Waterford to Dublin via Carlow, Kilcullen and Naas.

Why should people have to switch buses anywhere?

Bus Eireann operate at different times so people will be getting on the Bus Eireann services at the Quays expecting to be delivered as usual to Kilcullen or Naas and then being told they can only buy a ticket to Carlow(or even being sold a ticket to Dublin and told they will have to get a bus from Dublin to Naas or Kilcullen) where they will have to Change to another bus company for the remainder of their journey.

the old stops at Naas and Kilcullen worked well when drivers bothered to stick to the timetable and not pick up passengers when the stop was drop off only! or picking up passengers in Busaras and heuston and Newlands Cross for Naas and Kilcullen when ther were pick up only on the outward journey!

Bus Eireann are losing passengers by the dozen on this route now and when the colleges start back they will be lost completly as students do not want busses at 4am and 6am or at 2.15pm and 4.15pm giving them only 15minutes to get out of the colleag at 2 or 4 and get their stuff together and get the bus. maybe Bus Eireann want to be rid of this route?

dowlingm

@lxflyer thanks for doing the sums above - sounds about right.

foggy_lad - your posts are disturbingly close to suggesting that BE can never change its timetable lest someone "get(s) on the ... services ... expecting to be delivered as usual". Presumably not enough people were using the service to justify the stop. Expressway is not (directly) subsidised and will now be expected to be more profitable since the unprofitable services will have their subsidy cut. There are alternatives with Kavanagh's or if one has a magic pass IE to Sallins.

foggy_lad

dowlingm wrote: »

@lxflyer thanks for doing the sums above - sounds about right.

foggy_lad - your posts are disturbingly close to suggesting that BE can never change its timetable lest someone "get(s) on the ... services ... expecting to be delivered as usual". Presumably not enough people were using the service to justify the stop. Expressway is not (directly) subsidised and will now be expected to be more profitable since the unprofitable services will have their subsidy cut. There are alternatives with Kavanagh's or if one has a magic pass IE to Sallins.

I also noticed the new service does not appear to stop at all at the luas park and ride at red cow although this is marked as a pick-up stop on the outbound journey. How will drivers know if there are people waiting for a bus to Carlow or Waterford unless they actually drive in and past the stop?