Am I unemployable bacause I have a baby?

Avy1

I have been job hunting since March after having my baby. I spend roughly 4 hours every day searching for jobs in newspapers and the internet, doing up cover letters, applying for jobs and sending out CV’s on spec to various companies. Its totally wrecking my head! - After 3 months of searching I have not even been called for one interview. I’m feeling totally fed up and depressed at the moment and at this stage really beginning to worry about my future. Honestly I must have sent out about 80 CV’s and nobody is interested.:(

I am a qualified accountant with over 10 years experience. I have applied for many jobs where I meet the criteria exactly but I don’t get called for interview. It’s so frustrating when I see some of the jobs still being advertised but they have dismissed me even though I meet the requirements!! Most of the jobs I apply for are to companies themselves and not through agencies – so it is not agencies advertising fake jobs trying to get names on their books. I have paid to have my CV reviewed so I am confident that my CV is not the problem. The only problem I can see is employers are not interested in me because I have a child. I am even more convinced of this when I heard that a friend ( a guy ) who is less experienced than me was given a job I was really interested in and would have been more suited to than him yet I didn’t get called for interview.

Just because a woman has a child it does not make her incapable of doing a job.

Any other ladies out there have this problem?

Any employers out there who can give their views?

ntlbell

i've never seen "have you kids" on an application.

Why is it causing you an issue?

CiaranC

Why would a prospective employer know you have a baby? Did you list it on your CV or something?

dadah

maybe don't mention to them that you have a child.

mikemac

How do they know you have a child?

You are sending a CV and cover letter, how would they know about your family?

Look for your money back off this professional CV checker if they advised you on this

Avy1

I was made redundant from my last job last August. I have to put down what I have been doing between then and now.

chicken fingers

You are unemployable for some other reason.
Its not your child, that would be a convenient "its not my fault"-er but no, thats not it.

LifesgoodwithLG

Hi there OP,

There are many ways that you can answer this question - such as upskilling yourself, I wouldn't mention that you have a new baby as it is not relevant, It is illegal for an interviewer to ask about your family status and I would not bring it up.

Inishowen lady

I would take that info off your CV. In the current environment lots of people have been unemployed for many months, so having that gap on your CV won't look as strange as it would have a number of years ago. It's an employers market and they can be selective on the criteria they recruit people with. I imagine you will have a better chance of getting an interview ommiting the maternity part- and once you get an interview who knows.
I wouldn't waste any more money on "professionals" but maybe get someone to take a look at your CV.

Avy1

Thank you for all your replys. As I mentioned in my original posting I am confident that my CV is perfect. As well as getting it reviewed I have got friends and old colleagues to check over it. When they gave me criticism I made corrections. As part of my last role as Finance and operations Manager for 5 years I also was resposible for HR so I am well used to the pitfalls of CV's. As I am used to looking over CV's I know that any unexplained gaps are unacceptable and 10 months off does require explanation. I am an intellegent person with good experience and excellent references and I am at a loss as to the reason I have not been called for any interviews.

I live down the country and have been applying to small and medium sized companies. I am fully aware that it is illegal to discriminate against anyone on family grounds but you are naive to think this does not happen. I know from previous employers that maternity leaves and women with children are viewed as a big pain in the ass. Some of your responses have upset me as you seem to think I am a fool who does not take time to make proper applications and have a proper CV. I take particular exception to the comment made by chicken fingers that I am conventiently looking for an excuse. I can assure you I am not.

I would like to hear comments from other ladies and employers ( off the record on what they think of women with children )

Stheno

Avy1 wrote: »

As I am used to looking over CV's I know that any unexplained gaps are unacceptable and 10 months off does require explanation.

If you have that you took the time between August and now on your c.v. to have a baby, take it off.

Simply put on your current c.v. that you were made redundant in August, nothing more. If you are asked in interview what you have been doing since then, say you took the opportunity to have a short career break.

If you don't have it on your c.v. (which gives the employer the opportunity without breaking any laws to bring it up) or you bring it up in interview, then you are possibly exposing yourself to prejudiced views in terms of your having a small child.

RATM

Sadly, in the real world, employers do sometimes screen out females if there is a male candidate who they feel will do the job just as well. In my experience females in their thirties with or without children can be put at a disadvantage over a male because the employer is wary of the possibility of having to pay both them and somebody else for six months.

The only way I can see of solving this discrimination is to bring in the Scandanavian approach whereby the mother and father can decide to split X months of maternity leave between them. That way if there is paternity and maternity leave the discrimination should end.

OP you are applying to work in SME's. These are the most likely types of businesses to discriminate in this instance as money is a lot tighter these days. Maybe try applying to multi-nationals perhaps ?

Newaglish

I don't understand how you phrase this on your CV. August 2011 to present - minding my child? That doesn't even make any sense. You couldn't have been made redundant while on maternity leave so it's not a new baby, or is it?

Just change it to say "career break" then look from a refund from whoever reviewed your CV.

Avy1

Thank you for your reply RATM. The scandanavian approach seems sensible and hopefully one day it will be introduced to Ireland.

Newaglish I state in my cover letter that I have been on maternity leave. I know from having being involved in the screening of candidates in my previous role that a 10 month break in employment is viewed as unfavourable. I want to show that there is a genuine reason for me not being in employment since August. It is true that I could say career break but this is being dishonest. I think honesty is a good trait in a potential employee!

I will in future applications put career break and hopefully this will work for me.

ppink

I have been advised to definately not put anything about kids/family on a cv now. say you went travelling or did a course but dont mention the baby.
I have also been advised to say I do not own a home and I am not married. (When applying for jobs out of my local area).I have been asked all of these by the way!
Illegal makes no odds in todays world.


Edit: i just see you talking about honesty and I absolutely agree with you. I have been told also by several firends working in agencies that if I want a job in todays environment I have to be prepared to lie/omit the truth about the things I said above.

sambuka41

Avy1 wrote: »

Newaglish I state in my cover letter that I have been on maternity leave. I know from having being involved in the screening of candidates in my previous role that a 10 month break in employment is viewed as unfavourable. I want to show that there is a genuine reason for me not being in employment since August.

You were involved in screening candidates in a very different climate than we are in now. Maybe in the boom years that would have been suspicious but not now, its par for the course.

The fact that Ireland is in a huge recession is a genuine reason for having a gap in your employment.

As you say try putting carer break, or even that you have been job seeking, either is valid. Keep it professional in the interview, only discuss the job and your ability to do it, unless your child will prevent you from doing the job then theres no place for discussing him/her. (btw Im not saying you are not professional, just to keep it relevant) That way you wont leave yourself open to any prejudice.

CnaG

OP - have you thought about posting this in the Ladies Lounge? I think you'd get some interesting responses on it there too.

Good luck in the job hunt!

Stheno

Avy1 wrote: »

Thank you for your reply RATM. The scandanavian approach seems sensible and hopefully one day it will be introduced to Ireland.

Newaglish I state in my cover letter that I have been on maternity leave. I know from having being involved in the screening of candidates in my previous role that a 10 month break in employment is viewed as unfavourable. I want to show that there is a genuine reason for me not being in employment since August. It is true that I could say career break but this is being dishonest. I think honesty is a good trait in a potential employee!

I will in future applications put career break and hopefully this will work for me.

You could just say you were made redundant, took the opportunity to take a career break, and are now seeking a new role to challenge you, then fit your previous experience to the role you are applying for.

Given that you were made redundant, you are actually lying on your cover letter by saying that you have been on maternity leave, any new employer asking for a P45 (and yes I know you don't have to submit one, but even the wages department will know based on your tax credits) will realise that's not the case based on your available credits ytd.

Also some employers, particular SMEs may take a negative view of someone who is on "maternity leave" seeking alternative employment having taking what they could percieve to be very costly leave in terms of their business.

Avy1

Stheno wrote: »

You could just say you were made redundant, took the opportunity to take a career break, and are now seeking a new role to challenge you, then fit your previous experience to the role you are applying for.

Given that you were made redundant, you are actually lying on your cover letter by saying that you have been on maternity leave, any new employer asking for a P45 (and yes I know you don't have to submit one, but even the wages department will know based on your tax credits) will realise that's not the case based on your available credits ytd.

Also some employers, particular SMEs may take a negative view of someone who is on "maternity leave" seeking alternative employment having taking what they could percieve to be very costly leave in terms of their business.

Stheno why do you think I am lying to employers. I was 5 months pregnant when I was made redundant from my previous role. I did try at this stage to look for another job but understandably no employer wants to employ a pregnant woman. I claimed maternity benefit from the state from December to present ( as I was fully entitled to do ). I could not be regarded as unemployed as I had a small baby and I was in receipt of maternity benefit. As I was in receipt of maternity benefit I was regarded as being on maternity leave. Maternity benefit is a non taxable benefit and therefore does not affect my tax credits.

You seem to assume that all business's pay their staff a salary during maternity leave. Most SME's do not pay anything and their female employees have to claim state maternity benefits. Even if I was still employed in my former role I would still have to claim maternity benefit.

Your reply was very uniformed and I would expect more from a moderator.

Bandana boy

How did your employer make you redundant when you were about to start maternity leave ?
I would probably just change the date of redundancy on your CV to whatever date your maternity leave finished
It’s a small white lie but would hide the need to explain so long out of work.

In my experience bigger company’s do not discriminate or are very clear in trying to avoid discrimination
Smaller companies can really suffer from a couple of concurrent maternity leaves and as such often try avoid the issue either subconsciously by judging women harder or by consciously ignoring Women candidates.

I have read studies which suggest that fear of this logic has led to women being less likely to leave secure jobs than men. Which was the studies explanation for the gap in pay between women and men in non-discriminatory firms

mw3guc

Avy1 wrote: »

Stheno why do you think I am lying to employers. I was 5 months pregnant when I was made redundant from my previous role. I did try at this stage to look for another job but understandably no employer wants to employ a pregnant woman. I claimed maternity benefit from the state from December to present ( as I was fully entitled to do ). I could not be regarded as unemployed as I had a small baby and I was in receipt of maternity benefit. As I was in receipt of maternity benefit I was regarded as being on maternity leave. Maternity benefit is a non taxable benefit and therefore does not affect my tax credits.

You seem to assume that all business's pay their staff a salary during maternity leave. Most SME's do not pay anything and their female employees have to claim state maternity benefits. Even if I was still employed in my former role I would still have to claim maternity benefit.

Your reply was very uniformed and I would expect more from a moderator.

You left your last employment because you were made redundant - that is the only circumstance that was relevant at that time and is (IMO) the only relevant detail required for your CV or any new work application. At that time, you were not on maternity leave and you did not leave as a result of being pregnant. You would still be employed if you had not been made redundant - regardless of your pregnancy or your new baby.

As others have already said, you do not need to offer any information regarding your family circumstances and, in fact, it is clear that in doing so you are leaving yourself at a disadvantage. If you truly believe that you must be scrupulously honest and upfront with unnecessary information, it is likely that you will have an even bigger and ever-growing gap in employment to explain.

Tough, hard to take and even unfair - but a fact nonetheless

narddog

Having a baby should not affect your chances of getting a job. Having a baby,and using that as an excuse to get off overtime, working weekends and night shifts is also not acceptable.

Not speaking of the OP, as I don't know her, but the amount of times I've had to cover for women playing the child card, would amaze you. Then at review time they wonder why they didn't get the pay raise they expected.

This not a rant about working moms. This is a rant about moms who expect others to carry the load for them.

gline

In this job market you do need to be careful on what information you offer up before being asked, its just the way it is now. Its terrible that it has come to this. You need to think of it form the employers eyes, when they see you have a young baby they are thinking of how this could possibly affect your flexibility working there, and having worked in many jobs with mothers and fathers, they do see people without children as more flexible, and in this day and age any advantage is good. Of course just because you have a baby does not mean you are in-flexable, but we are talking about "in the employers eyes" and it is the employers market now. One thing that seems to be certain is, there is something on your cv that isnt getting you an interview and it seems it may be the fact you hve a "child status" on it. So if you dont want to lie just omit the information and it can be disscussed when the potential employer contacts you, or you will need to lie and put something else down.

Irish_Elect_Eng

Perhaps you are being discriminated against, perhaps not...it is difficult to say with the information that you have provided, but given the number of applications that you have made it would seem unusual that you would not have come across some companies that do not discriminate. Are you sure that discrimination is the key factor....has one of the employers said as much?

Your previous role was as a Finance and Operations Manager.

May I ask what types of jobs you are applying for at the moment.
Could it be that your search is not being directed correctly.

For More Junior Roles: In filling more junior roles I tend to avoid hiring people with management experience as they find it very difficult to effectively work in a junior position and often have attitude problems when dealing with people that would have reported to them in their last role.

For More Senior Roles: Also, in my experience operations managers tend to be promoted for inside an organisation rather than hired externally as the knowledge of the business is key to the role. Finance managers on the other hand are hired externally more often.

Times are hard: Over the last year more and more very experienced excellent candidates are applying for the positions for which I conduct interviews, having been made redundant from other industries, the market is just much harder than in the boom times.

If you want I could take a look at your CV?

Just my 2c, Good Luck with the search.

amdublin

Stop telling prospective employers about your baby. I don't know if that is the issue or not, but you seem to have pinpointed yourself that it is. So just don't tell them and see how you get on.

Mrs OBumble

Avy1 wrote: »

Stheno ...

I was 5 months pregnant when I was made redundant from my previous role. ...
Your reply was very uniformed and I would expect more from a moderator.

Stheno is not a moderator in W&J - we expect no more (or less) from her than any other poster in this forum.

I agree with (her? someone else? - you were not on maternity leave, because that phrase implies that you had something to go back to. You were unemployed. Then you were on maternity benefit.

And let's get something straight: you are unemployed. You're NOT unemployable. You simply haven't found a job yet - and compared with some people you haven't been looking for that long either.

I would suspect that problem is actually that you are too experienced. The number of jobs that come up at the level you were at is small, and many would be filled on the basis of recomendations, connections etc.

Alternatively, if you are looking for a lower-level job, then you may need to tone down the CV a bit for those (I have three different versions, the most-basic doesn't even list job-titles, just company names.)

Are you using your professional networks to get job leads? Are you open to short-term contracts? Are you learning any new skills (apart from the obvious child-related ones)?