James Cameron: Greatest action director?

PunkFreud

I recently watched True Lies for the first time. It has what many action movies don't have nowadays: a plot and character motivation. While it is by no means a masterpiece, with Arnie's acting questionable at best, it is nonetheless a great action movie.

It got me thinking: James Cameron is a brilliant action movie director. Aliens, The Terminator, and T2 are among the greatest action movies ever made, all of which were helmed by Cameron. They have explosive sequences and intensity keeping you wanting more. I'm not sure anyone will disagree with me there.

However, his most recent movie wasn't the best ever made. Avatar had great visuals, but it was basically Cameron pleasuring himself onscreen for 2 and a half hours. I want to see this man go back to what he's brilliant at, but instead we're going back for Avatar 2 and 3. If only he made another true action movie, then we could see more classics from him.


PS. Didn't mention Titanic because I wasn't a massive fan. Good movie, just not my cup of tea.

Sad Professor

Technically, in terms of how he shoots action, he is pretty much peerless. He's got a keen sense of geography, something which is practically nonexistent in action movies now days, having been replaced some years ago by kinetic action. Avatar, despite all its flaws, is still a masterclass in how to shoot action the old fashioned way, i.e. so that the audience knows what is going on.

krudler

He's up there, he's one of the few directors that gets the concept that if you have big expensive setpieces then hold the camera steady for the audience to see them (looking at you Bay!) like this:

watch the scene at 1.35 where the camera just follows the T-1000's helicopter all the way down to road level, its one of my favourite shots in an action movie, no blurry shakycam, just a smooth fluid shot and it looks phenomenal because it was done for real.
same with the clip at 2.42 in the same scene, the chopper barely makes it over the bridge after maneuvering around the swat van and tanker truck, thats unreal action directing and not to mention batsh1t insane a sequence to imagine and shoot.

Cameron puts great heart into his movies, I watched the Abyss the other night and while its certainly flawed (it would have worked just as well without any aliens in it as a tense underwater thriller) and its got some great scenes like Harris's dive into the titular abyss and the drowning/recussitation scene

krudler

Sad Professor wrote: »

Technically, in terms of how he shoots action, he is pretty much peerless. He's got a keen sense of geography, something which is practically nonexistent in action movies now days, having been replaced some years ago by kinetic action. Avatar, despite all its flaws, is still a masterclass in how to shoot action the old fashioned way, i.e. so that the audience knows what is going on.

I completely agree, he's a director that thinks outside the frame of the shot and the space around the action. Aliens is a great example of this, it'd be so easy to make a mess of the intitial attack sequence in the cooling tower when the marines are looking for the colonists, theres a sense of urgency and confusion but you never lose track of where they are and who's left standing.

mike65

Cameron is clearly talented, you can follow his action sequences and they are well paced but even he is in the ha'penny place compared to George Millers work on Mad Max 1 and 2 esp when you consider the conditions under which they were made. Its a real pity he threw the towel in but I guess the compromises made for 3 meant he knew he'd already made the best action movies he'd ever make.

Some of the old guys are pretty good as well, John Frankenheimer, William Freidkin, plus Andrew Marton and Yakima Canutt who did the legendary Chariot sequence in Ben Hur. Canutt also did the action in Where Eagles Dare.

krudler

Transformers 2 is an utter mess of directing geography wise if you want a bad examples, it makes insane jumps from locations because they look cool, like the Prime v Decpticons fight, it goes from the college campus to some gigantic disused warehouse to a forest? wtf where the hell is this college located?!
same as the scene where they find the old Blackbird transformer in the air and space museum, then he kicks open a door and they're in an airplane graveyard out in the middle of a desert? the hell they were in the middle of Washington 5 seconds ago!

stupid Michael Bay, learn some basic geography

Lirange

krudler wrote: »

same as the scene where they find the old Blackbird transformer in the air and space museum, then he kicks open a door and they're in an airplane graveyard out in the middle of a desert? the hell they were in the middle of Washington 5 seconds ago!

stupid Michael Bay, learn some basic geography

Well even in some respected films it has been a problem. At the end of Se7en in the scene with Spacey in the backseat they're driving in the damn Mojave desert after just departing from Philadelphia.

krudler

Lirange wrote: »

Well even in some respected films it has been a problem. At the end of Se7en in the scene with Spacey in the backseat they're driving in the damn Mojave desert after just departing from Philadelphia.

Aha but thats an unnamed city, if you watch Se7en the name of the city is never mentioned nor shown once (it was shot in LA) so it can stand that it does have a desert nearby (which LA does) in Transformers they make a point about going to Washington.

ArtSmart

Yes, in fairness he's the master of the fantastic(al)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Exodus_Decoded


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lost_Tomb_of_Jesus

serious note - yup he's hugely talented. (just hard to like personally )

don ramo

great director, its hard to tell if hes got bored of making a certain type of film or what, TBF he has made some of the best action films of all time, with probably the 2 greastest sequels ever,

he still makes action films but he has probably gone to action, with next generation engineering and creating an entire world for us to explore,

hes kinda forgetting about a great story, now i dont believe all this talk about avater having no story, it does have a story, a kinda familiar story but a story none the less, the biggest problem avatar suffered was the next generation effects cameron created to make the film possible also took a lot away from the story, or hindered the range of the story, which realistically was always gonna happen,

i hope cameron doesnt do a geroge lucas and hide away for 3 decades developing newer technologys to tell more epic storys, and just develope the tech as he goes along, hes been well able to so far from aliens to T2, true lies and titanic (yes the effects were class, to bad the love story was in there) and now avatar, there were 12 years between avatar and titanic thats to big a gap for such a talented director,

i do hope that avatar 2 and 3 will be better than 1, now that we have been introduced to the world of pandora i think cameron is gonna take us on journey we never thought possible,

TheFullDuck

ahem, you are forgetting the genius that is Michael Bay, excuse the crap quality!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeSUuj98Rx0

don ramo

don ramo wrote: »

great director, its hard to tell if hes got bored of making a certain type of film or what, TBF he has made some of the best action films of all time, with probably the 2 greastest sequels ever,

he still makes action films but he has probably gone to action, with next generation engineering and creating an entire world for us to explore,

hes kinda forgetting about a great story, now i dont believe all this talk about avater having no story, it does have a story, a kinda familiar story but a story none the less, the biggest problem avatar suffered was the next generation effects cameron created to make the film possible also took a lot away from the story, or hindered the range of the story, which realistically was always gonna happen,

i hope cameron doesnt do a geroge lucas and hide away for 3 decades developing newer technologys to tell more epic storys, and just develope the tech as he goes along, hes been well able to so far from aliens to T2, true lies and titanic (yes the effects were class, to bad the love story was in there) and now avatar, there were 12 years between avatar and titanic thats to big a gap for such a talented director,

i do hope that avatar 2 and 3 will be better than 1, now that we have been introduced to the world of pandora i think cameron is gonna take us on journey we never thought possible,

Otis Driftwood

Pre Hollywood John Woo is better.

Tipsy McSwagger

I'm not going to argue about Cameron but John McTiernan has made some great action flicks like Predator, Die Hard, Die Hard With a Vengeance, The Hunt for Red October. Heck I even enjoyed The Last Action Hero.

Theboinkmaster

Think they're 2 competely different directors - Cameron is a genius but IMHO Die Hard is simply the best action film ever made.

krudler

don ramo wrote: »

great director, its hard to tell if hes got bored of making a certain type of film or what, TBF he has made some of the best action films of all time, with probably the 2 greastest sequels ever,

he still makes action films but he has probably gone to action, with next generation engineering and creating an entire world for us to explore,

hes kinda forgetting about a great story, now i dont believe all this talk about avater having no story, it does have a story, a kinda familiar story but a story none the less, the biggest problem avatar suffered was the next generation effects cameron created to make the film possible also took a lot away from the story, or hindered the range of the story, which realistically was always gonna happen,

i hope cameron doesnt do a geroge lucas and hide away for 3 decades developing newer technologys to tell more epic storys, and just develope the tech as he goes along, hes been well able to so far from aliens to T2, true lies and titanic (yes the effects were class, to bad the love story was in there) and now avatar, there were 12 years between avatar and titanic thats to big a gap for such a talented director,

i do hope that avatar 2 and 3 will be better than 1, now that we have been introduced to the world of pandora i think cameron is gonna take us on journey we never thought possible,

All Cameron's movies are love stories though.

Terminator: two people from different times meet and fall in love, with added killer robot.

Aliens: now childless heroine finds orphaned little girl and develops surrogate mother love story, with added aliens.

The Abyss: estranged husband and wife fall for each other again underwater, with added oxygenated liquid breathing helmets.

T2: maternal love again with estanged mother and son, with added killer robot who is now good.

True Lies: bored housewife and decieving secret agent husband rekindle failing marrige, with added harrier jump jets.

Titanic: pennyless artist and bored well to do fiancee defy class distinction and fall in love, with added big boat sinking.

Avatar: human and alien fall in love, human goes tribal, with added mech suits and 12 foot tall blue people.

They're all love stories at heart just with spectacular action attached, Cameron is one of the few action directors who adds heart and character instead of mindless explosions, the action is a result of the plot, not the other way around.

irishh_bob

krudler wrote: »

All Cameron's movies are love stories though.

Terminator: two people from different times meet and fall in love, with added killer robot.

Aliens: now childless heroine finds orphaned little girl and develops surrogate mother love story, with added aliens.

The Abyss: estranged husband and wife fall for each other again underwater, with added oxygenated liquid breathing helmets.

T2: maternal love again with estanged mother and son, with added killer robot who is now good.

True Lies: bored housewife and decieving secret agent husband rekindle failing marrige, with added harrier jump jets.

Titanic: pennyless artist and bored well to do fiancee defy class distinction and fall in love, with added big boat sinking.

Avatar: human and alien fall in love, human goes tribal, with added mech suits and 12 foot tall blue people.

They're all love stories at heart just with spectacular action attached, Cameron is one of the few action directors who adds heart and character instead of mindless explosions, the action is a result of the plot, not the other way around.

when you put it like that , cameron sounds like a bit of a ham

mikhail

irishh_bob wrote: »

when you put it like that , cameron sounds like a bit of a ham

Yeah. Count the number of those films with an anti-military message. He's more than a little paint by numbers when it comes to plot.

That said, count the number of Christopher Nolan protagonists who've been traumatised by the loss of their wife. Even Hitchcock tended to repeat himself.

Sad Professor

I agree about McTiernan, but he isn't really active at the moment, is he?

Theboinkmaster

Sad Professor wrote: »

I agree about McTiernan, but he isn't really active at the moment, is he?

No and with his hits wasn't he just a studio-hired director so only a portion of the success of his films can be directly attributed to him, albeit a significant amount.

Whereas James Cameron writes & produces alot of his stuff so i think he's a much more talented filmmaker overall.

surripere

Yea ditto, McTiernan made some of the best. Cameron made one good flick Aliens, apart from that his films suck bigtime.

surripere

oops forgot about Terminator All his other films r awful, so no not the best.

Marty McFly

surripere wrote: »

oops forgot about Terminator All his other films r awful, so no not the best.

Jesus your lucky you got in there with that, I was about to jump all over your other post:D. T1 and T2 are up there with my favourite films of all time. The rest of his films are up for debate though, I could appreciate Titanic even though I wasnt a big fan the ending scenes of the Titanic sinking were pretty epic, I also thought Avatar was good, I just think Avatar suffered from over hype syndrome were people expeceted so much from it before it was even released it was never going to live up to expectations.

Goldstein

Aliens: Not up for debate.

don ramo

luvbulmers01 wrote: »

I just think Avatar suffered from over hype syndrome were people expeceted so much from it before it was even released it was never going to live up to expectations.

haha, i take you are kidding, it grossed $2.7 billion at the box office,

Marty McFly

don ramo wrote: »

haha, i take you are kidding, it grossed $2.7 billion at the box office,

No im not kidding im not talking about its gross, I know it done fantastic and I myself did enjoy the film but you do hear a lot of people saying its was crap, over rated, a dissappointment etc, im saying this is due to it being so overhyped before its release it,d be hard for any film to live up to it and I think thats why so many people felt let down by it.

p.s forgot about Aliens love that film scared the bee jaysus out of me as a kid:D

Sad Professor

Sad Professor wrote: »

I agree about McTiernan, but he isn't really active at the moment, is he?

His involvement in certain illegal activities and a subsequent prison sentence cut his career short of late but he's got two film in production atm.

MagicMarker

surripere wrote: »

oops forgot about Terminator All his other films r awful, so no not the best.

Did you forget about Terminator 2 as well? Or The Abyss? So that's 4 of the greatest sci-fi movies ever made right there.

Duggy747

JC WAS a great action director. I say so not because he doesn't cut mustard anymore but because he's decided to focus his energy into producing different projects and developing new camera technologies.

His movies were always a step above the mindless explosion movies. They always had heart, a real depth to them where you felt the danger was there.

Aliens, one of my favourite movies and, to me, one of those films you know everything about the film inside out.

Terminator 2, even when CGI was a new concept in movies Cameron didn't let it be the main focus of this film. The practical effects and stunt work is still held to such a high regard after nearly 20 years. Almost criminal when you think of the amount of money pumped into CGI-heavy films these days.

When you can get your GF, who loves Twilight and has seen fùck all of any movies beyond 20 years ago, to end up loving Terminator 1 & 2 you know Cameron hit the right mark.

Avatar was a shìte film but I did walk away from it impressed at what he achieved with the technology.

Cameron and Arnie need one last hurrah!

krudler

Duggy747 wrote: »

JC WAS a great action director. I say so not because he doesn't cut mustard anymore but because he's decided to focus his energy into producing different projects and developing new camera technologies.

His movies were always a step above the mindless explosion movies. They always had heart, a real depth to them where you felt the danger was there.

Aliens, one of my favourite movies and, to me, one of those films you know everything about the film inside out.

Terminator 2, even when CGI was a new concept in movies Cameron didn't let it be the main focus of this film. The practical effects and stunt work is still held to such a high regard after nearly 20 years. Almost criminal when you think of the amount of money pumped into CGI-heavy films these days.

and the cgi in T2, Jurassic Park etc still looks better than a lot of the stuff being used these days.

Evac105

Really appreciate McTiernan's films - my favourite space 'horror' of all time was his and some great action movies to boot.

surripere

MagicMarker wrote: »

Did you forget about Terminator 2 as well? Or The Abyss? So that's 4 of the greatest sci-fi movies ever made right there.

Ohh fook yea...true T2 was good, jeez I'm really messing up here. Must be the reflex dislike of Cameron, cuz of Titantic, Avatar and much other dross. The Abyss is one of the greatest sci-fi movies ever, now thats just funny.

TommyTippee

Otis Driftwood wrote: »

Pre Hollywood John Woo is better.

Yes indeed.....John Woo is a master of the genre

Hard Boiled is a majestic film

I think Hollywood's "Face/Off" ain't bad either!

stateofflux

surripere wrote: »

oops forgot about Terminator All his other films r awful, so no not the best.

aliens is a masterpiece of horror/sci fi

PunkFreud

stateofflux wrote: »

aliens is a masterpiece of horror/sci fi

Don't think Aliens is horror to be honest. That's what I loved about the film. Cameron changed the whole tone and atmosphere. While Alien is a dark sombre affair, where we are the whole movie wondering where the Alien is and what he looks like; Aliens is an all out action film. I've always found that the two films are incomparable due to these differences.

In other words, I don't think Aliens is a true horror movie.

stateofflux

PunkFreud wrote: »

Don't think Aliens is horror to be honest. That's what I loved about the film. Cameron changed the whole tone and atmosphere. While Alien is a dark sombre affair, where we are the whole movie wondering where the Alien is and what he looks like; Aliens is an all out action film. I've always found that the two films are incomparable due to these differences.

In other words, I don't think Aliens is a true horror movie.

i agree its not...but it has a few genres mixed in, action mainly, but sci-fi and horror are there no question. my reply was more about comments about his other movies being awful

Sad Professor

I'm actually quite interested to see what Cameron is going to do with the two Avatar sequels he is planning. Hopefully he is going to go in a much darker direction. I didn't care much for the first one, but I do think there's potential in this series. Although it seems to me that it was a mistake to end the first film the way he did. The avatar thing was interesting and could have been explored further.