Unusual Planning Query

hellodolly

Hi all, don't know if anyone has ever come across this! But if I don't ask I will never know right

Basically a cottage is up for sale directly across the road from my family's farm. It's down in a hollow and down the road a bit from the farm lane. I can actually afford to buy this place and it's an excellent opportunity.

The problem is that the stretch of road between the two properties has a bad bend and the lane entrance is bascially hidden from general view. I have a brother with Downs and I am afraid if I go ahead and buy this place that he will sneak out down the lane on to the road to try and come visit me (he has serious form!! taking furniture from the house to throw over the high fence to get out into the farmyard!). He doesn't look to the road now but if I moved there he would want to come see me all the time. There is no possibility of gates on the lane as its shared with another farm.

One possible idea my bro-in-law thought of is that as the cottage is actually below the level of the road (the roof is level with it) could we get planning to go under the road to create a walk-way tunnel between the garden of the cottage and the field opposite. A river runs under the road already and there's a sort of tunnel there that you can crawl through (ew!).

I've seen it done on new road builds for farmers to access their land on either side but I've never heard of it being done to an existing road. I know it sounds flipping crazy but it would actually be a major solution to my problem....I simply couldn't buy this lovely little place if I thought I was putting my beloved brother in any danger.

Any ideas or info would be gratefully received. I have mortgage approval but haven't put in a bid because I just can't get away from this issue.

Poor Uncle Tom

hellodolly wrote: »

...but I've never heard of it being done to an existing road. I know it sounds flipping crazy but it would actually be a major solution to my problem.....

I've seen it done to existing roads, not in Wexford County but in Kilkenny and Waterford. It is usually for moving livestock from a traffic safety point of view. Yours is as valid a reason to install a bridge as any other. It is a traffic safety issue after all. You should make an appointment with a senior planner about this one.

hellodolly

Poor Uncle Tom, I LOVE you for giving me a glimmer of hope!!!

Poor Uncle Tom

...:p

Decoda

An underpass was installed on the Johnstown Castle road just before Johnstown castle. I think it was for the Teagasc Farm facility. Not sure if it was a machinery or cattle underpass that was constructed but it was constructed on an existing road. Have a look at the planning file on the www.wexford.ie Wexford County Council website under 'search planning applications' and use the planning number 20043736.

Good Luck:)

DC

Supertech

Major underpass on the New Ross road some years ago (across the N25!!!!) for cattle as well. Just after Begerin there on the way down into New Ross.

(No details on Council website, but shows that an underpass has been erected on a national primary route !!)

ECO_Mental

There is no problem building an underpass under an existing road. My brother built a cow underpass last year on a national road, BUT.. you are talking serious money. From my recollection it cost him around €200k. Now you can drive a jeep through his and he had a lot of excavation works. But by the time you do all the excavations get the precast sections made up and in place, get the road reinstated and all design fees you cold be talking around €100k.

Just picked that number out of my head but I spent years putting underpasses in the motorways around the country.

EM

Supertech

ECO_Mental wrote: »

There is no problem building an underpass under an existing road. My brother built a cow underpass last year on a national road, BUT.. you are talking serious money. From my recollection it cost him around €200k. Now you can drive a jeep through his and he had a lot of excavation works. But by the time you do all the excavations get the precast sections made up and in place, get the road reinstated and all design fees you cold be talking around €100k.

Just picked that number out of my head but I spent years putting underpasses in the motorways around the country.

EM

I'd agree that the cost is likely to be huge. I'd also be guessing that it's not a job which could be undertaken by just any contractor. I'd imagine insurances wil be an issue, as well as a raft of issues regarding traffic safety etc. both during the job and after it's completed.

Gulliver

Would it be possible to erect a pedestrian bridge like one of these? Your brother has proven he's OK with heights (scaling the fence) and if it were all meshed in, falling off wouldn't be a problem. It's bound to be cheaper than an underpass.

Would the council give permission for one of these? It would have to be high enough for tractors, machinery, trucks etc. to pass under. As the cottage is so low, the steps on that side would be huge, though.

Is it a fairly busy road? Our roads aren't too busy, but people drive like maniacs on them. They have slowed down since the potholes got so big though, so maybe a speed bump or two?

Poor Uncle Tom

A small underpass can be done relatively cheaply, the last one I know of was done on a Local road and was completed for €16,000, all in.

hellodolly

Wow, thanks for all the information lads, I really wasn't expecting so much ... and Poor Uncle Tom, you're only looking for me to propose to ya now by saying €16k

I don't think the locals would like me to put in an over-bridge cos of the look of it. The Clough-Oylegate bypass is going to run through our area as it is and most people are obviously dreading it (it will be 2-3 fields away of the end of the cottage's plot) so any additional visual structures would probably not be appreicated - though it would be bloody handier alright!

I can imagine it wouldn't be cheap and the cottage does need to be renovated and extended (traditional 2 up-2 down with just four rooms and 4 windows and it has running water but no bathroom) so this would be a big expense to add in.

I went down to the hollow in the field opposite the cottage and the level of the road is roughly ?10-12 feet above the field. The height on the garden side has been lessened by the old man who used to live there filling it in with soil to try bring up the level a bit; the true level is (I'm guessing by the corner of the plot) to be about the same as the field side. The road is a local road which is of average width - and the traffic can be extremely bloody fast on it!! I'm guessing the excavation work would just be the actual road section as it's already clear on either side.

I take it you have to actually dig up the road to drop in the concrete precast tunnel? Diverting traffic wouldn't really be too much of a problem, there's a little road that could effectively bypass this section of road up to the village; and it would only add approx 2.5 miles to drive back around to the cottage again so at least the neighbours wouldn't be put out too much.

I've been googling precast concrete structures but can only find ones for livestock or for urban pedestrian underpasses. I'm guessing the size I want (small as possible!) would have to be specially made?

Decoda

Hi Dolly,

Try the following link http://www.bancrete.com/u-ducts.htm

They seem to be what you are looking for and are available at various cross sections and in lengths from 10m. Have no idea of cost though. Remember that you will have to apply for planning permission and also a temporary road closure etc. Your best bet in regards to both of these might be to try and contact your local County Council Roads Area Engineer. He / She might be able to let you know the situation regarding road drainage / road make up etc and give you a few pointers before you make your applications.

Good Luck:)

DC

hellodolly

Thanks Decoda The whole thing seems actually do-able now! Thanks for the links, I'm gonna look it it now