Advice needed on elbow dysplasia

piperh

Hi, my 6mnth old bitch who has been suffering intermitent lameness was today diagnosed with elbow dysplasia :( and while we're waiting for a second opinion from ucd i was wondering if anybody had experience of this and could offer their advice or experience in general. thanks

TonyFella

Sorry to hear about your dog but elbow dysplasia is down to breeding dogs that haven't been tested and just a back yard breeder that doesn't care about his dogs health if your pup has it most likely some of the other pups have it.
My friend had his 8 month pup diagnosed with hip dysplasia and they had it pts because it would of just got worse for dog and owner. If i was in your shoes id contact the breeder and let him know his dogs are not fit for breeding. Ucd are the only people who can hip score dogs in Ireland but id trust them with any of my dogs.

piperh

TonyFella wrote: »

Sorry to hear about your dog but elbow dysplasia is down to breeding dogs that haven't been tested and just a back yard breeder that doesn't care about his dogs health if your pup has it most likely some of the other pups have it.
My friend had his 8 month pup diagnosed with hip dysplasia and they had it pts because it would of just got worse for dog and owner. If i was in your shoes id contact the breeder and let him know his dogs are not fit for breeding. Ucd are the only people who can hip score dogs in Ireland but id trust them with any of my dogs.

Thanks but she was a rescue so i'd be amazed if the breeder cares :mad:

ISDW

Sorry, I've never had any experience of it. I hope UCD are helpful and you can get medication or treatment to ease her suffering.

carrie1973

Hi Just wondering how you got on at UCD? My puppy is due there on 23rd November with the same issue. She is 9 months old terrier cross rescue pup from Dogs trust. Very upset that she is suffering like this.

Would be interested to hear how you got on.

Carrie

TonyFella

The BVA System scores dogs numerically. The range is from 0 to 106. The lower the score the better. However the score is broken down from several sub categories and from both hips.

1 Norberg Angle
2 Subluxation
3 Cranial Acetabular Edge
4 Dorsal Acetabular Edge
5 Cranial Effective Acetabular Rim
6 Acetabular Fossa
7 Caudal Acetabular Edge
8 Femoral Head / Neck Exostosis
9 Femoral Head Recontouring

These are graded 0 to 6 for both hips, apart from the Caudal Acetabular Edge which is from 0 to 5.

The Norberg Angle and Subluxation relate to the tightness of the joint. The joint should be tightly fitting , the reason for this is simple, if it fits loosely it is unstable ( total subluxation is actually dislocation ) the 2 bones bang into each other and cause degenerative change ( wear and tear ) , this could be arthritis or Hip Dysplasia amongst others.

Sections 3 - 7 all relate to the socket of the joint, Cranial means towards the head, Dorsal towards the spine and Caudal towards the tail. The Acetabular fossa is the slight indentation seen on the ( acetabulum ) , fossa means hole. If you look at the Acetabulum face on it is almost circular ( dome shaped ) the Edges are all the borders or the circumference of the circle.

The femoral head is the hip bone, that fits into the socket. Exostosis is boney growth on the head. Recontouring is if the head is becoming misshapen. Exostosis are a problem because they stop the smooth movement of the joint and also can stop the full range of movement of a joint. If the femoral head is becoming misshapen it does not fit as well as it is designed to do and wear and tear will follow.

In my opinion the best way to look at a hip score is in the broken down format. A hip score of 18 which is the average for the breed at the moment could mean many things. It could mean a score of 1 in every section, which would be an excellent score and a structurally sound dog. It could also mean a 6 for Femoral Head Recontouring on both legs and a 6 for right leg subluxation. This would be a disaster waiting to happen,
this dog would almost certainly develop hip dysplasia as the joints got worse over time.

What To Do With Your Dog

The tightness of a joint can be helped by increasing muscle mass/density. It does not matter how you do this as long as the activity does not involve impacts or twisting. Swimming and Weight Pull would both do this. Swimming is safer.

All the scores relating to the bones cannot be improved. But keeping the dogs weight to a minimum and exercises such as swimming will help. Also supplements can help, the bones in the joint are surrounded by cartilage, which wears away before the bone starts to wear. The bone cannot be re grown, but the cartilage can. A good source of information can be found on Ripleys website. But the most important thing to do to maintain your dogs hips is to do sensible exercise to keep the muscles strong, and to keep the joint as tight as possible.

Young dogs should absolutely avoid activities such as jumping, sliding and twisting. Opinions on amounts of exercise to give vary, but just keep a close eye on the young dog, if it is coping and happy then its probably ok.

Do I Need To Score My Dog ?

ONLY IF YOU WANT TO BREED FROM IT

If your vet suspects HD he will x-ray it, but does not need to do the full set and get them scored. The score is irrelevant, if your dog has the worlds most shocking hips but is coping and leading a happy life and is not in pain and miserable then it is fine. Similarly a dog with much better hips may not cope as well and be in pain. The x-rays are only information, you need to look at the animal holistically and see how it is. No decisions should be made based on the x-rays alone. They may explain why your dog is acting a certain way, but your decision on what to do with your dog should be based on how it is acting, not the x-ray.

People talk about all the warning signs of HD, and what you should do if you see them in your dog. The safest thing to do with your dog is to assume he is at risk of HD and act accordingly. Keep him a healthy light weight, exercise him and keep him fit, avoid high impact activities. If your dog jumps around the entire time, let it ( once it is 2 years old ) , it will know if it hurts and stop doing it. Don't force an activity upon your dog, if it refuses to do something it could be because it hurts. All the things you should do with a dog that has HD you should do any way as a responsible dog owner.

HD should not be seen as a sign to wrap your dog in cotton wool.

Breeding

If you want to breed , then the dog or bitch MUST be scored and if you want to buy a puppy, make sure both parents are scored or buy a dog else where. It may cost more to buy from scored parents, but in the long run it may save you a lot more financially and emotionally. There is no reasonable excuse for a breeder not to score their dogs, don't accept it. Any excuse is poor.

When deciding whether a dogs score is good enough to breed from in my opinion you must look at the breakdown. I don't think it is safe to breed from any dog with a 6 . Ideally you should avoid any scores that contain a 6. The reasons for this are simple, a 6 is the worst it can get, it could be nearly a 5 or absolutely off the scale bad, the score is still 6. A 6 score should be a red light in my opinion. To breed sensibly and safely you should be looking at average and better than average in every section. That is the sensible approach.

When comparing the scores of the potential sire and dam, make sure that their weak points are not in the same area. Look at both sides combined, don't differentiate between left and right sides when comparing.

Then step back away from the hip score certificate and look at the animals. Look at the back, how they stand, their elbows, look at the whole package. Are they higher in the back than the front etc. Any problem in any of these areas can and will affect the other joints. If any joint fails, it is like a domino being toppled , others will most likely follow. A nice level top line should be a must in my opinion. If the back is sloping the pressure will be unevenly distributed and that means one joint is taking more strain than another,
which will lead to wear and tear. To feel what i mean do 10 press ups with your hands at shoulder width apart and then 10 with your hands wide apart and one 6 inches further forward than the other. That is an exagerated example, but HD develops over time.

The genes of your dog will determine its best possible hip score, how you treat it regarding exercise, diet etc will determine how close it gets to that best possible score. So with regards HD genetics loads the gun and the environment pulls the trigger. The better the genes of course the more the dog can deal with. If the genes deal the worst hand , there is nothing you can do.

Score all breeding animals, only buy from scored parents. Avoid 6 scores at all costs. Avoid 4 and 5 scores look for 0 ,1 and 2 scores.

The hip score should be the last check you do when deciding to breed your dog or bitch, the score should determine whether or not you can breed your dog, not whether or not you should breed your dog.







Hip dysplasia, Joint and Ligament Problems

I truly believe that these problems can be prevented in the first place by breeders feeding a natural diet and supplementing with large doses of Ester-C but many breeders don’t know this and even if they do most don’t bother.

It is heart breaking to find out that your dog has HD (hip dysplasia) and to see them in any pain. Unfortunately it can never be reversed (unless you let your dog go through a total hip replacement) but it can be eased and if you catch it early enough then you can prevent any arthritis setting in, therefore giving the dog a more normal pain free life.

Remedies for HD:

Firstly limit the exercise, some people recommend weight pulling but in my personal opinion this would be very bad for a dog with ligament and HD problems, it puts too much strain on them.
Swimming is excellent for dogs that have just had surgery on the legs or for dogs that have HD.

Make sure they have a good place to sleep/lie to cushion the bones and in the winter don’t leave them outside for long periods. If they are kennelled then try to get heated kennels. Basically keep them warm.

Magnetic collars seem to have rave reviews so I purchased one for Bubba but I personally didn’t see any difference in him.

Diet - Dogs with HD seem to improve when their diet is switched to raw food. There is a complete diet sheet on my website and in the ‘Diet’ section of this forum if you are interested.

Ester-C – This is a buffered form of vitamin C which dogs produce themselves anyway but some dogs do not produce enough. Ester-C has a very low acid content and the dogs can never overdose on it, they ‘pee’ out what the body doesn’t absorb. It builds collagen around the ligaments and joints and must be given in high doses (contact me with the weight of your dog and I will work out the dose for you.) The cheapest place I have found so far for the Ester-C is www.zipvit.co.uk we just crush them with a pestle and mortar and add it to their food. The recommended maintenance dose for Ester-C is 2000mg (2 - 500mg tablets twice a day.)

Vitamin E – To help the body absorb the Ester-C better. Dose: One a day 200ui – 400ui.

Glucosamine – I have been doing a little bit of research recently as regards to the pill form of Glucosamine. It seems that the liquid form is much better. Therefore I now recommend either Flexicose (www.first4pets.co.uk) or Synflex (www.synflexforpets.co.uk) not only do both of these products contain Glucosamine but many other ingredients that help with joints like: Boswellin, Yucca, Manganese, Bromelain, White Willow Bark, Omega 3 & 6, Vitamins A, C & E etc, etc.

If you decide to give the Flexicose or Synflex instead of the tablet form of Glucosamine then cut out the vitamin E capsule but carry on with the Ester-C.

Hyaluronic Acid – I have only been looking into this for a short time but feel that it is totally worth a mention. Bubba has only been having it now for a week and I have already noticed a difference in him, he can go for longer walks (and has more of a ‘spring’ in his step) and there is no sign of stiffness when he wakes up. Only yesterday he went out for a one hour walk, lay on the floor for about ½ an hour to sleep then someone knocked at the door and he jumped up instantly and ran to the door, he even leapt onto the settee to look out of the window. A dog with grade 3 HD shouldn’t be able to do that!
This is another substance that the body makes itself but once again sometimes the body doesn’t produce enough. They have already been using it the hospitals for years, mainly for people with osteoarthritis in their knees and in vets for pets with HD but what they do is inject it straight into the affected area which is expensive and painful. Hyaluronic Acid could never be taken orally as the stomach acid destroyed most of it but now scientists have found a way to administer it orally (which is great!).
You can read all about it and buy the human form from: www.easysource.com it takes about a week to arrive as it’s from the states.
The Hyaluronic Acid for pets is cheaper and is called Hyaflex, you can read about it and but it from: www.hyaflex.com .
One bottle lasts a month and you are meant to see visible results within a maximum of four weeks.
Here is a little info about it, copied from the Hyaflex website:

Benefits of Hyaluronic Acid
Hyaluronic acid, (HA) exists naturally in all living organisms in the body, it is found in greatest concentrations in the synovial fluid of joints for lubrication, the vitreous humor (fluid) of the eye, and most abundantly in the skin.


HA plays an important role in tissue hydration, lubrication and cellular function, and is able to hold more water than any other natural substance. Its unmatched hydrating properties result in increased smoothness, softening and decreased wrinkles.
HA is a special mucopolysacharide that is the normal lubricant in small animals' joints. When present in a joint, even a joint with minimal or no cartilage, it can provide a cushion effect. As your pet’s body ages, it produces less and less HA. The joints may become stiff; the skin dry and wrinkled.
Hyaluronic acid replacement, referred to as viscosupplementation, is done by injecting HA directly into the affected joints. Although successful, it is very expensive, and yet only effective in the areas injected. Now, the high molecular weight HA found in HyaFlex™, a convenient oral solution, presents an easier and far more affordable way to replace the HA that your pet has lost. It also provides benefits to their entire body! Read our testimonials to see for yourself. Pets are experiencing results noticeable in a short period of time, plus a variety of beneficial effects --- from softer coat, to clearer and healthy eyes, even anti-aging properties.
Hyaluronic acid (HA) was first used commercially in 1942 when Endre Balazs applied for a patent to use it as a substitute for egg white in bakery products. He went on to become the leading expert on HA, and made the majority of discoveries concerning HA during the next 50 years.

So basically if your dog has any joint/movement problems then I would give them:
1. A natural diet.
2. High doses of Ester-C (contact me for the dose)
3. Flexicose or Synflex
4. Hyaflex