Dublin Bus €1.65 Prepaid ticket please!

Sorted

Hi All,
I'm getting very frustrated with Dublin Bus's lack of customer service. I'm charged 1.65 each way for my bus trip in and out of work each day and I'm sick to death of looking for change every day.

I have sent numerous emails to Dublin Bus asking them to introduce a prepaid ticket for the 1.65 fare but get no reply - apart from an automated one saying they'll respond in 15 days which never happens.

The Dept of Transport keeps banging on about encouraging people to use the bus yet this most obvious convenience isn't available. In other cities, eg Paris, you can buy a "carnet" of 10 journey tickets for the cost of 9 for the metro.
Why not here? Rant over. Thank you

Random

why not get a prepaid smartcard?

KD345

Sorted wrote: »

Hi All,
I'm getting very frustrated with Dublin Bus's lack of customer service. I'm charged 1.65 each way for my bus trip in and out of work each day and I'm sick to death of looking for change every day.

How many bus journeys do you make each day?

Ste.phen

KD345 wrote: »

How many bus journeys do you make each day?

I suspect two, which means only the taxsaver cards are better value than paying cash, no?

markpb

If, as I suspect, the OP makes two journeys a day and pays €1.65 each, there is nothing else they can do - there are no prepaid options for them. At best, the purse feature of the integrated ticket might be useful later this year.

bk

I agree with the OP and find this very frustrating too (I'm also on a €1.65 route).

Fortunately a smart card with e-purse should at least partly solve this problem when hopefully introduced later this year.

I already use smart card with epurse in a similar way on the DART and it is fantastically convenient, don't even need to take the card out of my wallet

I can't wait until they introduce the integrated smart card epurse that will work on DB, Dart and Luas. It will be very convenient.

The only pain with it on the bus is that it will still require you talking to the driver

Drimnagh Road

Don't know why they got rid of the 2Eazy tickets.

Paulj

I also wondered about this and after trying to decipher their website it looks like there is no smart card option for someone who uses 1.65e routes... W T F !
If there was ever an obvious way to encourage public transport this would be it.
(Of course they probably don't want people to use public transport so in that case it's quite understandable. :rolleyes:)

Sorted

Thanks everyone for your input to this and you've reached the same conclusion as I have. Makes no sense...worse Dublin Bus won't respond to address the issue. I wonder how long the epurse/smartcard will take to appear as mentioned above?

L1011

bk wrote: »

I already use smart card with epurse in a similar way on the DART and it is fantastically convenient, don't even need to take the card out of my wallet

You will when you get the DB one as well! DB/IE/Luas ones screw each other up when beside each other, can't bump on

Stevek101

MYOB wrote: »

You will when you get the DB one as well! DB/IE/Luas ones screw each other up when beside each other, can't bump on

Considering they'll all be on one card at that stage it won't be an issue.

Aussie Sean

Drimnagh Road wrote: »

Don't know why they got rid of the 2Eazy tickets.

They got rid of them because of people traveling further than they should on the tickets. Why not have a flat fare on all routes of €2 no matter how far you travel like London.

coylemj

Drimnagh Road wrote: »

Don't know why they got rid of the 2Eazy tickets.

You used to be able to buy a 10 journey bus ticket for each of the various fares, then they dropped down to a 2 journey ticket, the only logical reason I can think of for this change is because people were producing illegal clones - not very difficult since all you had to do was replicate a magnetic strip.

Now the only option seems to be the Travel 90 card which I use because I often do multi-hop trips and it saves me a packet but if you are only doing one bus at a time and the fare is 1.65 then there really isn't a smartcard option for you.

coylemj

Aussie Sean wrote: »

They got rid of them because of people traveling further than they should on the tickets.

I don't think so, people can go further than the fare they've paid just as well after paying cash, especially during rush hour when the driver can't be expected to remember who paid what.

Aussie Sean wrote: »

Why not have a flat fare on all routes of €2 no matter how far you travel like London.

The Travel 90 card (10 trips for 19 euros) allows you unlimited travel using multiple buses for 1.90, the only restriction is that the last validation has to be within 90 minutes of the start of the journey.

I once visited a guy in the Mater hospital from my place of work in Baggot St., got over and back on the one validation!

A Dub in Glasgo

coylemj wrote: »

The Travel 90 card (10 trips for 19 euros) allows you unlimited travel using multiple buses for 1.90, the only restriction is that the last validation has to be within 90 minutes of the start of the journey.

I once visited a guy in the Mater hospital from my place of work in Baggot St., got over and back on the one validation!

I use the Travel 90 card all the time I am in Dublin, I can travel from my folks house in Tallaght to my wifes folks in Phibsboro or my brother in Ballymun with one validation. It usually has a good expiry date as well.

As for the OP, if it is convienence you are after, I would buy the Travel 90 for 10 journeys at €19 per week iinstead of carrying all the cash and trying to find the right fare for each journey for €16.50 per week. Surely the convienence factor alone is worth €2.50 per week? Not to mention you do not have to queue for paying and you can travel extra if the need requires it.

AlekSmart

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

I use the Travel 90 card all the time I am in Dublin, I can travel from my folks house in Tallaght to my wifes folks in Phibsboro or my brother in Ballymun with one validation. It usually has a good expiry date as well.

ADiG,I suspect the major issue with the Travel 90 concept is in getting people to appreciate the flexible nature of the T90 product.

Dubliner's just ain't familiar with the notion of Bus Hopping,as is possible in many UK and EU cities.

Our biggest failing in this respect is in a lack of high-frequency routes which makes consulting Timetables unnecessary.

Added to this is our city's lack of a central location where Bus Routes can converge and exchange pasengers in one fell swoop.

That was a central plank of CIE's 1970 vision of Dublins Public Transport operation which,regrettably the late lamented Mr CJ Haughey saw fit to dispense with in order to facilitate The Temple Bar Cultural Quarter concept instead.

IF we can get frequencies up to speed on a wide spread interconnected Trunk Route network then we have a fighting chance of real improvements...But...BUT....We MUST prioritize,encourage and reward those who take an interest in their own commute and who at least attempt to optimize it.

If we want to continue facilitating Pocket Rooters,Wallet Scratchers and Purse Rattlers then it's a totally different,far slower and hugely inefficient concept we will be running with....

Decisions decisions.....:eek:

A Dub in Glasgo

AlekSmart wrote: »

ADiG,I suspect the major issue with the Travel 90 concept is in getting people to appreciate the flexible nature of the T90 product.

Dubliner's just ain't familiar with the notion of Bus Hopping,as is possible in many UK and EU cities.

Our biggest failing in this respect is in a lack of high-frequency routes which makes consulting Timetables unnecessary.

Added to this is our city's lack of a central location where Bus Routes can converge and exchange pasengers in one fell swoop.

That was a central plank of CIE's 1970 vision of Dublins Public Transport operation which,regrettably the late lamented Mr CJ Haughey saw fit to dispense with in order to facilitate The Temple Bar Cultural Quarter concept instead.

IF we can get frequencies up to speed on a wide spread interconnected Trunk Route network then we have a fighting chance of real improvements...But...BUT....We MUST prioritize,encourage and reward those who take an interest in their own commute and who at least attempt to optimize it.

If we want to continue facilitating Pocket Rooters,Wallet Scratchers and Purse Rattlers then it's a totally different,far slower and hugely inefficient concept we will be running with....

Decisions decisions.....:eek:

So true, the biggest driver for me was I could never remember the exact fares every time I came over and I have lost touch with calculating the fare on the the stage concept. I bought my first T90 card about 3 years ago and it was a real eyeopener just hopping on and off buses all around Dublin with the card.

When I finish my trip to Dublin, I write on the card how many journeys are left and use it next time I was over.

It is bad form that DB does not even offer more widespread type of prepaid cards (10 x individual fares). If I was in the OP shoes however, I would go for the T90 card and remove an element of stress about his commute.

lainey316

bk wrote: »

I agree with the OP and find this very frustrating too (I'm also on a €1.65 route).

Fortunately a smart card with e-purse should at least partly solve this problem when hopefully introduced later this year.

...
The only pain with it on the bus is that it will still require you talking to the driver

We're not going to tap out? Not that I ever thought that would work, but I thought it was the plan. Tap in/tap out - charge on exit. If you don't tap out charge the maximum fare (2.20 or whatever, not the penalty fare)

LXFlyer

We don't know what the DB fare structure post-smartcard is going to be yet....it's difficult to tell how this will work until they announce whether it will be flat fare, zones or the existing staged system.

AlekSmart

lxflyer wrote: »

We don't know what the DB fare structure post-smartcard is going to be yet....it's difficult to tell how this will work until they announce whether it will be flat fare, zones or the existing staged system.

Well we Do have a reasonable certainty that it will be at least 10% dearer than at present......

Oh I know,I know......incentivising is a foreign concept round these parts....but BOY!, can we do financial wizardry !!! :eek:

bk

lainey316 wrote: »

We're not going to tap out? Not that I ever thought that would work, but I thought it was the plan. Tap in/tap out - charge on exit. If you don't tap out charge the maximum fare (2.20 or whatever, not the penalty fare)

It is very unlikely to be tap out. Tapping out can cause slower dwelling times. There really isn't much advantage of tapping in/out over talking to the driver and tapping in.

Really a flat fare is the only way to go to minimise dwell times.

lainey316

bk wrote: »

It is very unlikely to be tap out. Tapping out can cause slower dwelling times. There really isn't much advantage of tapping in/out over talking to the driver and tapping in.

Really a flat fare is the only way to go to minimise dwell times.

You really do need 2 doors for tap out to work alright, which is why I wondered originally when it was suggested as the approach, that's so long ago who knows what happened since. Will be interesting to see how they are able to implement it on the card, especially since Dart and Luas and IR will all be entry/exit tap in/out implementations.

bk

lainey316 wrote: »

Will be interesting to see how they are able to implement it on the card, especially since Dart and Luas and IR will all be entry/exit tap in/out implementations.

I fear the worst option possible, just talk to the driver and tag on.

markpb

bk wrote: »

I fear the worst option possible, just talk to the driver and tag on.

Rumour has it that tagging on will automatically charge a fixed fare but if you want to pay more or less, you'll need to go to the driver and use the card reader attached to the ticket machine. How true this is or what that fare will be, I don't know.

Aard

bk wrote: »

It is very unlikely to be tap out. Tapping out can cause slower dwelling times. There really isn't much advantage of tapping in/out over talking to the driver and tapping in.

Really a flat fare is the only way to go to minimise dwell times.

A report somebody linked to earlier showed that in London, boarding times were deacreased from 5-8 seconds to 1 second per passenger, which was achieved by allowing three-door boarding.

markpb wrote: »

Rumour has it that tagging on will automatically charge a fixed fare but if you want to pay more or less, you'll need to go to the driver and use the card reader attached to the ticket machine. How true this is or what that fare will be, I don't know.

That is a recipe for more confusion than ever. They should choose one: either talk to the driver, or don't. Otherwise you'll have people butting in all the time saying that they didn't want the automatic fare or something...

AlekSmart

Aard wrote: »

A report somebody linked to earlier showed that in London, boarding times were deacreased from 5-8 seconds to 1 second per passenger, which was achieved by allowing three-door boarding.

That is a recipe for more confusion than ever. They should choose one: either talk to the driver, or don't. Otherwise you'll have people butting in all the time saying that they didn't want the automatic fare or something...

From my perspective as a Driver I really should'nt have to talk to anybody for the purposes of making a simple Public Transport trip.

All things being equal,a person making a Bus Trip should have no need to approach or converse with the Driver at all.....assuming,of course,that the passenger has been able to glean all the relative information from the Streetside infrastructure..... things such as Stage Point Numbers....oh wait..oops a faller at the first fence here so...:mad:

Oddly enough,as it stands,those passengers whom I wish to engage in conversation,such as those whose Free Travel Pass I wish to inspect or a person flashing quickly past me are most unwilling to converse with me....unlike the ones who wish to talk about the weather,the match or the horse racing.......and who ALWAYS want me to "Throw us out here bud..." at some suitably inappropriate location.

Sadly,the likelyhood is the ITIG will insist that Dublin Bus dilute the Contactless Card's capabilities by requiring a Driver Input for the lower fares...a real curates egg situation....:rolleyes:

StrawberryJazz

Just throw a fistful of coppers mixed with one or two of the shiny curly ones into the box and maintain eye contact.:eek:

They never ever count it and they make a tidy profit from people not exchanging their little paper receipts for currency.

LXFlyer

StrawberryJazz wrote: »

Just throw a fistful of coppers mixed with one or two of the shiny curly ones into the box and maintain eye contact.:eek:

They never ever count it and they make a tidy profit from people not exchanging their little paper receipts for currency.

That money is ring fenced and is used to fund community projects. It does not form part of DB revenue.

Are you advocating what is effectively theft?

EricPraline

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

As for the OP, if it is convienence you are after, I would buy the Travel 90 for 10 journeys at €19 per week iinstead of carrying all the cash and trying to find the right fare for each journey for €16.50 per week. Surely the convienence factor alone is worth €2.50 per week? Not to mention you do not have to queue for paying and you can travel extra if the need requires it.

Paying an extra €10 a month for the minor extra convenience of not having to carry change will be difficult to justify for some people.

In most countries with usable public transport systems, pre-paid tickets are usually pitched at a price point below cash fares to incentivise "purse rattlers" to stop using change. Shame DB can't stop taking the short-term view and adopt a similar strategy.

coylemj

There's no way you could have a 'tag off' system on DB, it would cause massive confusion and congestion at busy bus stops.

Currently when you arrive at a busy bus stop like UCD, the city centre or any of the shopping centres, people getting off know that they have to rush the doors to get off before some ignoramus (little old dears are the worst) tries to barge in and get the best free seat before everyone getting off has done so.

If they introduced 'tag off', all it would require is one person with a dodgy card blocking the exit and there would be mass chaos with people backed up trying to get off and the mob getting on wouldn't be prepared to wait so they would board and you'd have an instant jam.

StrawberryJazz

lxflyer wrote: »

That money is ring fenced and is used to fund community projects. It does not form part of DB revenue.

Are you advocating what is effectively theft?

No I was completely joking :P

However, they never do check and a card system is far more reliable to be fair.

bk

Tag off only works if you have rear exit doors.

Ironically DB have caused this problems themselves.

They can't do tag off because they decided not to have rear exit doors.

They can't have a simple tag on system as in the past the DoT wouldn't allow them to move to a fixed fare.

As for the suggestion that the card would take a default fare and you have to talk to the driver for something different is madness. The default fare would have to be the highest fare possible, otherwise people would just take the lower fare and say they didn't know better if challenged by an inspector.

Perhaps they will make the travel 90 the default fare. But even then, as a €1.65 person, I'm not going to pay that, I'll be talking to the driver to get the correct fare.

They really should be heading for single flat fare.

A Dub in Glasgo

EricPraline wrote: »

Paying an extra €10 a month for the minor extra convenience of not having to carry change will be difficult to justify for some people.

In most countries with usable public transport systems, pre-paid tickets are usually pitched at a price point below cash fares to incentivise "purse rattlers" to stop using change. Shame DB can't stop taking the short-term view and adopt a similar strategy.

There is nothing the OP can do about that other than contact DB to suggest certain things. It is crazy that DB do not offer what everyone wants. However, this is not helping the OP in his stress when looking to pay the exact fare. The suggestion to pay 50c per day or €2.50 per week extra to remove that stress needs to be considered if that stress is affecting quality of life.

BostonB

I find looking for change a major pain. I generally end up going into a shop to break a note and often buy something else that I don't really need. Or I overpay 30cent or more. I didn't know about the travel 90. My journey is 2.20 and I only do it every now and them. Sounds perfect for me. Pity I can't pay via paypal.

dazmetron

BostonB wrote: »

I find looking for change a major pain. I generally end up going into a shop to break a note and often buy something else that I don't really need. Or I overpay 30cent or more. I didn't know about the travel 90. My journey is 2.20 and I only do it every now and them. Sounds perfect for me. Pity I can't pay via paypal.

Well its not Paypal but is another large disliked company!
ticketmaster

enda1

If there needs to be tag off it should be outside at the bus stop they are getting off at, therefore it will be always the correct fare, no? Of course the default fare should be the highest fare on the route in case of someone forgetting or whatever.

BostonB

They ask for the code card for the CC which I never carry. Its buried in some folder at home. I avoid it by using PP. Can you buy them in shops?

Alun

BostonB wrote: »

Can you buy them in shops?

Yes, anywhere with the DB sign / sticker outside or at the DB offices on O'Connell St.

markpb

enda1 wrote: »

If there needs to be tag off it should be outside at the bus stop they are getting off at, therefore it will be always the correct fare, no?

They are never, ever going to install card readers at every bus stop in Dublin. If I recall correctly there are 11,000 of them.

enda1

The card readers are rather simple though. The ones in London at train station exits are just a circle on the wall. Not sure the functionality or "back-end" of them but maybe they are even just passive?

If DB want to modernise the network though, they need to get their act together with GPS tracking, live displays (for infrequent routes) and frequency based timetables for frequent routes.

Really of course they should have a flat fare system, but if they want a staged system you need clock-in, clock-out, and the only way to efficiently do this is with a method like this I think.

P.S. Really 11k stops!! :eek:

KD345

enda1 wrote: »

If DB want to modernise the network though, they need to get their act together with GPS tracking, live displays (for infrequent routes) and frequency based timetables for frequent routes.

This is already happening. There are hundreds of stops live across the city with more following weekly.

markpb

enda1 wrote: »

The card readers are rather simple though. The ones in London at train station exits are just a circle on the wall. Not sure the functionality or "back-end" of them but maybe they are even just passive?

They're not just circles on the wall - they're powered, network-connected, sim-loaded card readers. They're not overly expensive but to install 11,000 of them, hook them up to the mains and find a way to network them to the backoffice would be far from cheap.

If DB want to modernise the network though, they need to get their act together with GPS tracking, live displays (for infrequent routes) and frequency based timetables for frequent routes.

GPS tracking has been around for months, live displays are being installed all over the city (several have been live for months) and some of the new post-Network Direct timetables are frequency rather than fixed-time based. This is all happening right now.

LXFlyer

enda1 wrote: »

The card readers are rather simple though. The ones in London at train station exits are just a circle on the wall. Not sure the functionality or "back-end" of them but maybe they are even just passive?

If DB want to modernise the network though, they need to get their act together with GPS tracking, live displays (for infrequent routes) and frequency based timetables for frequent routes.

Really of course they should have a flat fare system, but if they want a staged system you need clock-in, clock-out, and the only way to efficiently do this is with a method like this I think.

P.S. Really 11k stops!! :eek:

All of those are in progress through the RTPI scheme and Network Direct project to be completed later this year.

There are not ticket machines at every stop in London - only in the city centre. Outside of the city centre you can still pay the driver.

Charisteas

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

As for the OP, if it is convienence you are after, I would buy the Travel 90 for 10 journeys at €19 per week iinstead of carrying all the cash and trying to find the right fare for each journey for €16.50 per week. Surely the convienence factor alone is worth €2.50 per week? Not to mention you do not have to queue for paying and you can travel extra if the need requires it.

That's still 130 a year down the drain just for the sake of convenience.

---

OP, your paying 1.65 a journey, 3.30 a day right? You could look into the possibilities of a monthly Dublin Bus Taxsaver ticket which cost 69.00 a month (assuming your tax rate is 20%). Lets say there are average 22 working days a month, that comes to 3.13 a day. So you save a little bit and the bonus of having a card and don't need to look for change.

Another option which admittedly isn't ideal for the OP would be to drop a two Euro coin in each journey (as opposed to the minimum 4 coins needed for the exact fare), accumulate the 0.35cent refund receipts, and every 6 months or once a year, head down to O'Connell street and claim back the cash. Like I said not very ideal, and could mean asking the driver for the receipt.