Gender Roles and Orientation

LegacyUser

Bear with me; this might be a bit long-winded. Decided to go unreg for this.

Inspired by the latest controversy of a Canadian couple raising a genderless child, I have been reflecting on roles of gender and their correlation with sexual orientation... particularly in regards to my own experience.

I self-identify as a homosexual male; mid-20s, relatively happy, not at any odds with my biological sex. Quite content to have a penis, but not particularly bothered either way. For as long as I can remember - as in, from when I first became self aware - I have always identified better with the the female gender. What I mean by this is that I have always felt that my brain is of a more feminine disposition. I know generalisations don't work, but I have never complied with the 'expected' characteristics of the male sex; I have always loathed sport, for example, never had any interest in playing any kind of aggressive games etc. As a child, I was quite effeminate; never to the extent of playing with dolls or anything, but I was very artistic and sensitive to my environment. My role models, in life and in the arts, were always female. In fact, for almost forever now, I've been drawn towards girls as friends, because I just feel we share more common ground. Now, whilst I do have a number of heterosexual male friends, I find it easier to get on with women. Long before puberty, before I considered other boys in any kind of sexual way, I have just understood girls better.

An exception to this is a few other gay men, who I find are often of a similar mind frame.

As an adult, I still feel feminine to a certain degree; simple things, like political or ethical ideologies, the kinds of music I enjoy, the films I watch, generally deviate from society's apprehension of 'masculinity'. It has just got me wondering, do other gay people feel the same? Do you feel that you share more common traits with the opposite sex, despite not having any particular desire to change your sex?

I mean, as aforementioned, I don't have any problem being a guy; I don't feel like I'm in the 'wrong' body, but in some ways I think it would just make more sense for me to have been born female. If I had been given the choice, I think maybe I would have chosen to be a girl. Not because I'm unhappy being male, but just because I don't quite know how to define myself as such? Is it just what's between my legs?

It's all a bit confusing. I understand that a lot of gay men also identify easier with girls, so how do we draw the lines between homosexuality and say, transgenderism? Can another gay guy (or girl even) tell me what it means for them to be a man (woman)?

Too much philosophising for a Thursday morning methinks.

rainbow kirby

A good starting point for you here might be the Genderqueer article on Wikipedia - there are a few links given in the references that are well worth a read.

diddlybit

It's a really interesting question OP and really difficult to answer. It always goes back to what exactly constitutes as "masculine" and what consititutes as "feminine". So much of these appear to be innate, yet are socially constructed gender roles and can be quite arbitrary when analysed.

There's a whole spectrum of gender performences and variations both in the LGBT community and society as a whole. However, anyone who defies the rigid constraints of a binary system of gender is pulled back into it. Examples would be reading "tops" and "bottoms" as "male" and "female" roles. Sometimes, I find, the line between queerness and trans is difficult to delineate because it is individualistic to each person. I've encountered online lesbian women who are not trans identified, but wish to have top surgery. And as Rainbow Kirby pointed out there is a whole realm of possibilities in identifying as gender queer.

Jack Halberstam has written a great book called "Female Masculinity" that addresses this liminal space and I recommend Butler's "Gender Trouble". She does a great reading of stone butchness as a hyper feminine role.

From a personal perspective, I have no idea what being a woman is to me. I'm guessing that the greatest sign of gender privilege.

Meesared

Roots2 wrote: »

Not because I'm unhappy being male, but just because I don't quite know how to define myself as such? Is it just what's between my legs?

It's all a bit confusing. I understand that a lot of gay men also identify easier with girls, so how do we draw the lines between homosexuality and say, transgenderism? Can another gay guy (or girl even) tell me what it means for them to be a man (woman)?

Too much philosophising for a Thursday morning methinks.

Well Just a note on your first point gender is so much more that whats between your legs (despite what some people would tell you)

I would identify as trans myself and yes i get where your coming from where its hard to pin down. I know im trans myself as im just not comfortable in my own skin and body.

The article posted above does sound appropriate, and i do know a few genderqueer people myself and while i cant comment for them on how they feel, from what ive heard from them you do sound quite similar

Ms.Odgeynist

Hi OP,

I'm not gay or trans but I think your question is valid and more topical now than ever.
Unfortunately these ideas of gender and sexuality are relatively ubiquitous, but they are just that - ideas, social constructions.
I always view such concepts as spectrums.
I have gay friends that I find attractive, but not in a purely physical sense.
I also identify myself as male, and relatively masculine, but my concept of masculinity is completely subjective.
Masculinity has taken a battering in recent years/decades. But I think this is as a result of focusing on the more negative aspects of masculinity. Or to put it another way, by focusing on human characteristics that are negative which have been assigned to masculinity, namely homophobia, aggression, insensitivity etc....

LegacyUser

Hi Roots2,
Really interesting questionn. One that I have thought about a lot recently. I am a very masculine gay guy. play sports and all that. But like yourself I feel that sometimes I am quite feminine in some aspects. I value emotion over sex. I wouldn't focus on physical as much as other guys and I look for monogamy.
I know that these may not be seen as typically feminine but I do. I spent a lot of my childhood hanging around with girls (4 sisters) but I never felt any preference to either gender for friends or if I would be honest I probably prefer hanging around with lads.
My take on it is that we all have a mixture of what is viewed as Masculline and Feminine sides which are independent of our biological sex. Obviously these traits are more swayed to one or the other but again these are just labels that we have given ourselves.
Maybe you should think about exploring your masculine side more. ???

Azure_sky

Bisexual transsexual here. I don't know what it is to be of the male gender; it is alien to me. Gender is the manifestation of brain sex and the current social environment. It's primarily predicated by brain sex rather than social conditioning according to the scientific data and case studies. The vast majority of people identify as primarily male or female. A minority identify as bi-gendered or androgynous. Males and females have had different gender roles of aeons as it was beneficial for humanities survival; and thus their brains evolved differently.
Aeons from now they may evolve differently again due to evolution if the environment continues to alter for long enough but it doesn't happen in a few decades. These things take a long time.

Anyway, it doesn't seem to be an issue for you based on what you said. That being what it is don't worry about labeling yourself.