Job seekers allowance (NOT ENTITLED)!!!!

NinjaNikki

Bit about me i am 19 from england moved over to Ireland on July 9th 2009 i never worked in Ireland have been over here looking after my uncle who is ill but now he has moved back to England!

So i moved in to a place in July 2010 but did not get along with landlord as he kept putting the rent up with out any notice so i moved out in October 25th 2010 and lived in my new place.

I had a boyfriend who i had joint claim with until April of this year we split up and now he has work i think i don't know anyway i used Christmas money from family in UK to live off but it was not much at all.

So about 3 weeks ago i applied for JSA and was means tested with the Habitual Residence and supposedly i do not means test for this i have lived in Ireland applying for work from 2009 July 9th until this day now.

After being means tested i was told to come in Friday just been to come in at 10 for a chat i was talking to a different woman who asked me why did i come to Ireland and why would i look after my uncle who is sick???? And then she gave me a check that i used to buy food to last me for 2 weeks and paid the land lady some of the rent and bills i owed i only got 186 euro so it's gone anyway when in the health office in Dublin i said will i get a check every week in the post office thinking everything was okay and she laughed in my face said to me don't be silly said have to come back next week (this Friday) 1st off my health office is in Dublin i live in Blabriggan so it cost me 8 quid getting the train in town thought health office was meant to be local?

Anyway just got a phone call to say i could get one more check this Friday and that i am not means tested for the JSA but i don't understand why???
she said i will give you some money to get a flight to England i don't have family in the Uk ..... or anywhere not going in to it sorry. But like i ow my Land lady a bit of money thank god she is so nice not to kick me out.

Sorry if spelling and grammer is bad i just upset i don't know what happened i though with getting a check i would be entitled to some money?

NinjaNikki

Help please???

TT09

You should go back down to your welfare office and ask them to explain the situation to you again you'll get better answers from them as each case is unique.

mrsbyrne

you have failed the habitual residence condition i think, ninjanikki. im sorry your so upset. you didnt make any social insurance contributions (national insurance) so you werent automatically entitled to a payment. you probably would have passed the means test, but thats irrelevant because you were never going to pass the habitual residence condition. this means that you have not been here long enough. you have not made ireland your "centre of interest". you have to prove all these things if you want to get an allowance. in another thread i think we discussed this with you. did she give you the refusal in writing? if she didnt then go back and get it in writing. you can appeal the desicion but this will take a very long time. in the meantime i dont know wether you will get any more money from the CWO. if you were appealing you would need to gather up as much evidence as possible to support your appeal. my gut reaction is that it is a pretty much lost cause though.

Supraman

Why should you get money ? You've never contributed towards this countries finances. What is j.s.a in the uk ?

NinjaNikki

Supraman wrote: »

Why should you get money ? You've never contributed towards this countries finances. What is j.s.a in the uk ?

i worked in uk from 15-18 so would have contributed towards tax stuff which could be taken for ireland but meh

NinjaNikki

mrsbyrne wrote: »

you have failed the habitual residence condition i think, ninjanikki. im sorry your so upset. you didnt make any social insurance contributions (national insurance) so you werent automatically entitled to a payment. you probably would have passed the means test, but thats irrelevant because you were never going to pass the habitual residence condition. this means that you have not been here long enough. you have not made ireland your "centre of interest". you have to prove all these things if you want to get an allowance. in another thread i think we discussed this with you. did she give you the refusal in writing? if she didnt then go back and get it in writing. you can appeal the desicion but this will take a very long time. in the meantime i dont know wether you will get any more money from the CWO. if you were appealing you would need to gather up as much evidence as possible to support your appeal. my gut reaction is that it is a pretty much lost cause though.

Yeah just rang citizen information told the same appeal takes 8 months and even then =/

i have to pick now homeless in ireland or england lol have to look on the bright side of things some way =/

Lugh Ildanach

NinjaNikki wrote: »

Yeah just rang citizen information told the same appeal takes 8 months and even then =/

i have to pick now homeless in ireland or england lol have to look on the bright side of things some way =/

Appeals do take a long time, but you can get SWA pending your appeal. But your messages are not the clearest (understandably enough). If i were you I would call the Irish National Organisation of the Unemployed who can talk you through the appeal process, and the prospect of getting an appeal while that's ongoing. Their free information line is 01 856 0088 and they can call you back if you don't have the credit to be on the line for long.

NinjaNikki

Lugh Ildanach wrote: »

Appeals do take a long time, but you can get SWA pending your appeal. But your messages are not the clearest (understandably enough). If i were you I would call the Irish National Organisation of the Unemployed who can talk you through the appeal process, and the prospect of getting an appeal while that's ongoing. Their free information line is 01 856 0088 and they can call you back if you don't have the credit to be on the line for long.

do i have to appel first though before i ring them?? what happens if i say i want to do education here?

Lugh Ildanach

NinjaNikki wrote: »

i worked in uk from 15-18 so would have contributed towards tax stuff which could be taken for ireland but meh

To be able to rely on your UK contributions, you need to have worked at least one week since you arrived in Ireland. Even if you only earned 38 Euro that week, it would be enough to bring you into the social insurance system and enable you to combine your record with your English one.

Lugh Ildanach

NinjaNikki wrote: »

do i have to appel first though before i ring them?? what happens if i say i want to do education here?

Forget about education for now. To be eligible for Jobseekers payment you need to be looking for full-time work. Once you secure a jobseekers payment, then you can start to think about what Back to Education supports are out there.

All you need to do is to submit the appeal. You don't need to do this before you speak to the INOU, but you will have to do it before you go back to your CWO. It is possible that the CWO will refuse you on habitual residence as well, but its not automatic, and they will give you some benefit of the doubt given that you have an appeal in the system. They can't predetermine the appeal. If they refuse you SWA, then you can appeal that decision and apply again to the CWO pending that appeal. Its messy, but there is a system there, but for it to work you need to engage with it fully.

NinjaNikki

Lugh Ildanach wrote: »

Forget about education for now. To be eligible for Jobseekers payment you need to be looking for full-time work. Once you secure a jobseekers payment, then you can start to think about what Back to Education supports are out there.

All you need to do is to submit the appeal. You don't need to do this before you speak to the INOU, but you will have to do it before you go back to your CWO. It is possible that the CWO will refuse you on habitual residence as well, but its not automatic, and they will give you some benefit of the doubt given that you have an appeal in the system. They can't predetermine the appeal. If they refuse you SWA, then you can appeal that decision and apply again to the CWO pending that appeal. Its messy, but there is a system there, but for it to work you need to engage with it fully.

it's with the health center that i got the 1st check because i needed the money A.S.A.P and it's them who told me i can not claim anything

Plazaman

NinjaNikki wrote: »

Bit about me i am 19 from england moved over to Ireland on July 9th 2009 i never worked in Ireland have been over here looking after my uncle who is ill but now he has moved back to England!

So i moved in to a place in July 2010 but did not get along with landlord as he kept putting the rent up with out any notice so i moved out in October 25th 2010 and lived in my new place.

I had a boyfriend who i had joint claim with until April of this year we split up and now he has work i think i don't know anyway i used Christmas money from family in UK to live off but it was not much at all.

So about 3 weeks ago i applied for JSA and was means tested with the Habitual Residence and supposedly i do not means test for this i have lived in Ireland applying for work from 2009 July 9th until this day now.

After being means tested i was told to come in Friday just been to come in at 10 for a chat i was talking to a different woman who asked me why did i come to Ireland and why would i look after my uncle who is sick???? And then she gave me a check that i used to buy food to last me for 2 weeks and paid the land lady some of the rent and bills i owed i only got 186 euro so it's gone anyway when in the health office in Dublin i said will i get a check every week in the post office thinking everything was okay and she laughed in my face said to me don't be silly said have to come back next week (this Friday) 1st off my health office is in Dublin i live in Blabriggan so it cost me 8 quid getting the train in town thought health office was meant to be local?

Anyway just got a phone call to say i could get one more check this Friday and that i am not means tested for the JSA but i don't understand why???
she said i will give you some money to get a flight to England i don't have family in the Uk ..... or anywhere not going in to it sorry. But like i ow my Land lady a bit of money thank god she is so nice not to kick me out.

Sorry if spelling and grammer is bad i just upset i don't know what happened i though with getting a check i would be entitled to some money?

I'm sort of confused. Did you make a claim for J.S.A. (Dole)? The person giving you money and saying they'll pay for your flight back to the UK sounds like a Community Welfare Officer (CWO) who usually continue paying you until you get an official response from Social Welfare.

Habitual Residence regulations say that you must be residing in Ireland for at least 2 years before you have an entitlement to Benefits. Welfare website is down at the mo but you can read about it HERE. I'm assuming if you have received a decision from Social Welfare it is based on this. The fact you have no family ties or business connections to Ireland and cannot prove that you are willing to put down roots in Ireland or express that you wish to live permanently here, they will disallow you on that basis. The Means Test isn't relevant unless you're living with Parents, Boyfriend/Spouse/Civil Partner, Working Part Time or have Savings and Investments.

If you have received an Official Decision from Social Welfare (which in 3 weeks is quicker than most) and you are disallowed, then Appeal immediately and keep copies of all documents. The CWO as far as I'm aware has to continue payment until outcome of appeal but that is at their discretion as SWA is not a statutory payment.

Lugh Ildanach

NinjaNikki wrote: »

it's with the health center that i got the 1st check because i needed the money A.S.A.P and it's them who told me i can not claim anything

Get the appeal in against the Jobseekers decision. That could change the attitude of the CWO. At the minute you have nothing in the system, so they can't pay you, if you have an appeal submitted, they can pay you pending the appeal, its a completely different ball game. I'm not saying it'll be easy, but it is possible that you can get a payment sorted out pending your appeal, and that would also give you the chance to improve your circumstances, or perhaps even get a part-time or casual job that would allow you to combine your social insurance records.

NinjaNikki

Plazaman wrote: »

I'm sort of confused. Did you make a claim for J.S.A. (Dole)? The person giving you money and saying they'll pay for your flight back to the UK sounds like a Community Welfare Officer (CWO) who usually continue paying you until you get an official response from Social Welfare.

Habitual Residence regulations say that you must be residing in Ireland for at least 2 years before you have an entitlement to Benefits. Welfare website is down at the mo but you can read about it HERE. I'm assuming if you have received a decision from Social Welfare it is based on this. The fact you have no family ties or business connections to Ireland and cannot prove that you are willing to put down roots in Ireland or express that you wish to live permanently here, they will disallow you on that basis. The Means Test isn't relevant unless you're living with Parents, Boyfriend/Spouse/Civil Partner, Working Part Time or have Savings and Investments.

If you have received an Official Decision from Social Welfare (which in 3 weeks is quicker than most) and you are disallowed, then Appeal immediately and keep copies of all documents. The CWO as far as I'm aware has to continue payment until outcome of appeal but that is at their discretion as SWA is not a statutory payment.

it's the CWO that gave me the checks and is giving me a check on friday to fly home

NinjaNikki

Plazaman wrote: »

I'm sort of confused. Did you make a claim for J.S.A. (Dole)? The person giving you money and saying they'll pay for your flight back to the UK sounds like a Community Welfare Officer (CWO) who usually continue paying you until you get an official response from Social Welfare.

Habitual Residence regulations say that you must be residing in Ireland for at least 2 years before you have an entitlement to Benefits. Welfare website is down at the mo but you can read about it HERE. I'm assuming if you have received a decision from Social Welfare it is based on this. The fact you have no family ties or business connections to Ireland and cannot prove that you are willing to put down roots in Ireland or express that you wish to live permanently here, they will disallow you on that basis. The Means Test isn't relevant unless you're living with Parents, Boyfriend/Spouse/Civil Partner, Working Part Time or have Savings and Investments.

If you have received an Official Decision from Social Welfare (which in 3 weeks is quicker than most) and you are disallowed, then Appeal immediately and keep copies of all documents. The CWO as far as I'm aware has to continue payment until outcome of appeal but that is at their discretion as SWA is not a statutory payment.

it's the CWO that said i do not mean test not the Social welfare dose this change thing's?

NinjaNikki

Lugh Ildanach wrote: »

Get the appeal in against the Jobseekers decision. That could change the attitude of the CWO. At the minute you have nothing in the system, so they can't pay you, if you have an appeal submitted, they can pay you pending the appeal, its a completely different ball game. I'm not saying it'll be easy, but it is possible that you can get a payment sorted out pending your appeal, and that would also give you the chance to improve your circumstances, or perhaps even get a part-time or casual job that would allow you to combine your social insurance records.

Dose this change anything that it was the woman from CWO saying i did not means test and not the Social welfare?

Jubbin

Lugh Ildanach wrote: »

To be able to rely on your UK contributions, you need to have worked at least one week since you arrived in Ireland. Even if you only earned 38 Euro that week, it would be enough to bring you into the social insurance system and enable you to combine your record with your English one.

Sounds as if you need to find a job even if only for 1 week
Good Luck

tenchi-fan

Hi Op

Your centre of interest seems to be the UK. You should be able to claim jobseekers and get rent supplement over there.

There are mechanisms to transfer unemployment benefit under certain circumstances from England to Ireland, but you should investigate this with the welfare office in the UK.

You should also look into claiming unemployment benefit in Northern Ireland rather than the republic.

maryk123

ok you came to ireland 2009 and lived with your uncle. you then lived with a boyfriend and lived off him. you have never worked in this country or contributed to this country. you have no family here and all your family are in the uk. your centre of interest is not ireland, you have no job, you are not at school, you have no family, proof of looking for work. i would say you will find it hard enough to get paid. why are you staying here now.

what i am unclear about is:-
1 did you apply for job seekers allowance, if so and you were refused did you appeal the decision-do you have all this in writing.
2. if you have appealed it did you apply in writing to the cwo and if they have refused it do you have it in writing and have you appealed that decision.
3. you have no money but can manage to keep yourself
4. what is your nationality

it looks to me your only option is to present homeless or go back to the UK. I think you will lose the appeal based on the above.

NinjaNikki

maryk123 wrote: »

ok you came to ireland 2009 and lived with your uncle. you then lived with a boyfriend and lived off him. you have never worked in this country or contributed to this country. you have no family here and all your family are in the uk. your centre of interest is not ireland, you have no job, you are not at school, you have no family, proof of looking for work. i would say you will find it hard enough to get paid. why are you staying here now.

what i am unclear about is:-
1 did you apply for job seekers allowance, if so and you were refused did you appeal the decision-do you have all this in writing.
2. if you have appealed it did you apply in writing to the cwo and if they have refused it do you have it in writing and have you appealed that decision.
3. you have no money but can manage to keep yourself
4. what is your nationality

it looks to me your only option is to present homeless or go back to the UK. I think you will lose the appeal based on the above.

Half uncel lives in ireland but sure that downt count dose it my friends live in ireland i have a social life here i closed everything in uk banks etc and have it all here so no england is not my intreste ireland is

tenchi-fan

NinjaNikki wrote: »

Half uncel lives in ireland but sure that downt count dose it my friends live in ireland i have a social life here i closed everything in uk banks etc and have it all here so no england is not my intreste ireland is

Op, I would think twice about explaining to the welfare officer that you wish to claim benefits to fund your social life in Ireland. If you are so close to your half-uncle you should ask him to put you up and support you until you find a job.

However, the best thing you can do is take up the offer of a free plane ticket. As soon as you arrive back in the UK you can open a bank account, sign on benefits while you look for a job and when your finances are better come back to Ireland and make another go of it.

Also, it really is not a big deal moving between England and Ireland. It's not like you're being deported from Australia. For €50 you can get a return flight to visit your friends. However, I strongly suggest you save at least €4,000 before attempting to settle in Ireland again.