Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Some number theory questions:

  • 15-05-2011 5:01pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,150 ✭✭✭


    Hi lads I just have a few number theory questions.

    How many invertible elements are in Z-63?
    Is there a formula for this? If I know a method I will try apply it.

    Compute 5^2011 mod 77.
    Our lecturer did some of these out but he skips a few steps. Again is there a formula?

    Find the solutions of x^3 + 2x^2 -x + 47 = 0 (mod 343)
    I know 343 is 7x49 so I find them for 7 and 'lift' to 49 but then I'm not sure where to go to get mod(343)

    Thanks!


Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,081 ✭✭✭LeixlipRed


    a is invertible mod n if and only if the gcd of a and n is equal to 1. That give you any clues about the first one?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭click_here!!!


    I think you use the Euler-phi function for the first one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler's_totient_function

    You can use the Euler-Fermat theorem for the second one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler's_theorem

    Both are described on Wikipedia.

    You can check to see if your answer is correct on http://www.wolframalpha.com.

    Hope this helps.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,150 ✭✭✭.E_C_K_S.


    OK so the first one I got 36. Broke it up into 7x9 and then they have 6X6 elements coprime. I presume that is ok?

    Second question I get 5^61=5(mod77).Not sure if this is right!

    Any idea for the third. I know it will be long but I have no time! Once I get mod7 and then mod49 how do I go from there thanks.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,150 ✭✭✭.E_C_K_S.


    Just have to bump this lads because my exam is tomorrow!:o


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭click_here!!!


    I think you're right about the first two, but I don't know how to do the other one myself.

    If you find out and have spare time, let me know! Thanks.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 156 ✭✭MoogPoo


    Compute 5^2011 mod 77.

    Using Euler's I got e(77) = 60
    SO 5^60 = 1mod77

    so I wrote 2011 = 60(33) + 31

    that means you can keep subtracting 60 from 2011 till you get 31
    and so 5^2011 = 5^31 mod77. I think thats right how did you do it? I might be wrong :(

    Then I dunno how to simplify it more.
    This is a complete guess cause I got answer from wolframalpha.

    Can you say by Fermat's that 5^31 = 5mod7 and 5^31 = 5mod11
    and then try and find x = 5mod7 and x = 5mod11 by Chinese Remainder or something. So x = 5, this is the answer on wolfram anyway.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭click_here!!!


    [latex]5^{2011} \bmod{77} \equiv 5^{2011 \bmod{\phi(77)}}[/latex]
    [latex]\equiv 5^{2011 \bmod{60}}[/latex] (Since [latex]5^{1980}.5^{31} \equiv 5^{2011} \bmod{77}[/latex] (Read the Wikipedia article on Modular exponentiation))


    2011 mod 60 = 31
    [latex]5^{2011} \bmod{77} \equiv 5^{31} \bmod{77}[/latex]

    To calculate [latex]5^{31} \bmod{77}[/latex] on your calculator:
    Since 5^{31} is too big to display on most calculators, split your equation into terms like 5^3 and 5^4 which can be displayed on your calculator like so:
    [latex]5^{31} = (5^4)^7.(5^3)[/latex]

    Then, calculate each of these terms mod 77:
    For example, to calculate [latex]5^3 \bmod{77}[/latex], do [latex]5^{3} \div 77[/latex] on your calculator. Then subtract the integer part so you're left with the fraction bit. (0.6233766233766233766233766233766233766233766233766233766233...)
    Then multiply by 77.

    Now solve this:
    [latex]\equiv (5^4 \bmod{77})^7.(5^3 \bmod{77}) \bmod{77}[/latex]

    Tip: for an easier example, look at Wikipedia's example of 7^222 mod 10 on the Euler-Fermat theorem article.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 156 ✭✭MoogPoo


    yeah i was trying the calculator way alright but it seems messy and i might mess it.
    if 5^2001 = 5^31 mod 77 = a mod 77
    then can't you solve for x = a mod 77
    by Fermats
    x = 5 mod 7
    x = 5 mod 11

    then use Chinese RT
    x = 5 mod 7
    x = 5 mod 11
    and solve for x and get 5
    then if y a solution y = x = 5?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭Eliot Rosewater


    Tip: for an easier example, look at Wikipedia's example of 7^222 mod 10 on the Euler-Fermat theorem article.

    If WALSHY16291 gets a tough question in the exam will he be able to ask the invigilator for access to Wikipedia so he do the easier version? :p:D


    The solution to this particular example involves considering 5^2011 seperately in mod 7 and mod 11.

    As MoogPoo says, you get x = 5 mod 7 and x = 5 mod 11, but it's not neccesary to use CRT at all. x=a (mod n), x=a (mod m), n & m co-prime, implies x=a (mod nm).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,150 ✭✭✭.E_C_K_S.


    I was wondering when you would reply!:D For the q4 that he gave us on the sample test, I broke 343 into 7^3 but I'm unsure what formula to use for this since we have only used squares in the examples?

    Thanks for the replies lads!


  • Advertisement
Advertisement